Posted on Feb 10, 2014
SSG Recruiter
10.7K
21
15
3
3
0
After reading many discussions on here and the responses to many I am ashamed that so many people feel the NCO Corps is failing.

Is the NCO Corps not the back bone of the Army? How about the fact that many of the people making these claims are part of the NCO Corps?

Here is what I propose. Get a copy of the NCO Creed read it and decide if you are actually living by the Creed of the Non Commissioned Officer. If it is broken we must fix it. The last line of the creed will solve many of the problems people have mentioned are broken or wrong.

 "I will not compromise my integrity, nor my moral courage. I will not forget, nor will I allow my comrades to forget that we are professionals, noncommissioned officers, leaders!"

Sound off and let me know if I am way off base on this one.
Avatar feed
Responses: 9
SSG Saun Lehar
5
5
0
Many of us did live the NCO creed and the Army values, however, when we see our peers not living up to those standards and do nothing to try and correct it, what happens then?

Junior soldiers listen to bad NCOs and turn into bad NCOs, that is the point I think that some people are trying to make, the NCO corps is weakening because there is not a push to make NCOs better, to make them take the responsibility that has been handed to them seriously.

I will say that because of the wars, we have seen a huge turnover of soldiers returning home and ETSing, many of them good NCOs because they get rode hard because leadership wants things done right the first time. You can oly ride your prized horse so long before even he quits.
(5)
Comment
(0)
Avatar small
SGM Sergeant Major
5
5
0

I will say this - just because we have an NCO Creed doesn't mean NCOs will follow it. I had those values long before I became an NCO.

Let's look at the real reason behind a issue plagued NCO Corps (my thoughts). The 2 biggest issues that come to mind are -

1) 13 years at war. We have focused on the war and less on garrison operations. That caused a lot of Soldiers to act a certain way and those Soldiers turned around and became Leaders.

 

2) Highly tweaked promotion system to accomodate the loss of Leaders at all levels. You can't lower the standard and expect the Leaders joining the ranks to "get it".

Now the kicker to both of these issues - We as NCOs have sat here and watched it happen and didn't do anything cause we had to focus on the wars. I believe if we get back into garrison operations and making Soldiers earn their rank we will see a mindset change over time.

 

Get rid of the CLI program - any NCO getting promoted on less than 50 promotion points really raises a red flag. I am not saying good NCOs didn't come out of the program but I bet the majority were substandard Soldiers not ready to be Leaders. That caused current Leaders to focus more on those Leaders instead of the collective group. The other piece to this puzzle is the NCOES system - make it mandatory to complete the school before you get promoted.

There is a different mindset when a Soldier works for their promotion or is just handed it.

My explanation should not be taken as the only issue but they are some of the major issues I see from my foxhole.

(5)
Comment
(0)
SGM Sergeant Major
SGM (Join to see)
10 y
No that is not what I am saying. Everyone knows an Army's job is to win wars. When you speed up promotions just to get more bodies into a rank you water down their Leadership value. Once that happens Leaders all over the Army are working harder to teach the new Leaders those core values and bring them back up to speed with their rank. Garrison Army holds a lot of value in training and it is all around training not just training for a specific job downrange but a wide variety of jobs. Go to a CTC rotation today and the focus is getting back to a basic Army mindset and away from the FOB mentality.
(1)
Reply
(0)
SFC Robin Gates
SFC Robin Gates
10 y
Well gentleman this has came back like a plaque again. I entered the Army Infantry in 1975, the NCO Corp was broke then after Vietnam. No fault from the NCO's back then (Shake and Bake system) same problems you have again. I'am a defense contractor and have seen some of the problems. Unfortunately this is going to take Command Influence, Senior NCO's (but again weak Senior NCO's) are going to have to built from ground level. It took 20 years to get the NCO corp rebuilt from 75-95. Get the Officers out of NCO business start etching the younger NCO's responsibilities and change the mind set. The wars have degraded the leadership due to high turn over, the drawdown is going to degrade moral and kill the corp more. No short term fix here.
(0)
Reply
(0)
SFC Robin Gates
SFC Robin Gates
10 y
I agree with the 1st SGT Quackenbush!
(0)
Reply
(0)
SSG Jose M. Hernandezsanchez
SSG Jose M. Hernandezsanchez
6 y
I personally witnessed this when I returned from my first tour to Iraq. We lost very good caliber of Soldiers who could've become solid NCOs, but for whatever reason, they either ETSed or re-classed. Now, from 2001 til 2007 I was too busy trying to stack up on deployments and get that combat leadership experience. I forgot or neglected to know that the garrison environment leadership also counts, and that's the one things I was lacking of which it ended up hurting me when I was considered to go for the 7 board.
Yes, the military's business is to be ready to go to war, period. But there are other facets that will make a NCO a solid and effective leader that Soldiers should crave for.
(1)
Reply
(0)
Avatar small
Maj Chris Nelson
4
4
0
Being a former NCO (Army), as an officer I fully respect the NCO Corps. I do not let them off the hook for their duties....if it is NCO business, I make them deal with it. If they can not deal with it, I will then step in and handle it, but that is only as a last resort. NCO demands respect. The individual wearing the rank must EARN the respect with those about. If you perform as expected, you will ALWAYS have my respect.
(4)
Comment
(0)
Avatar small

Join nearly 2 million former and current members of the US military, just like you.

close