Posted on Sep 3, 2015
Have you heard about the Army using new fragmenting ammunition?
14.2K
73
66
14
14
0
"There's a myth that [expanding/fragmenting bullets] are prohibited in international armed conflict, but that doesn't make any sense now," Jackson said.
"After a recent legal review within the Pentagon, the Army can consider adopting "special purpose ammunition," said Richard Jackson, special assistant to the Army Judge Advocate General for Law of War, according to an Army news release. This marks a departure from battlefield practices over a century old.
Jackson told Army Times that while this isn't the first approved use of such bullets in the military, the stance represented "a significant re-interpretation of the legal standard" for ammunition. He also said a lot has changed since the initial movements against the round, especially with the increased prevalence of ASYMMETRIC WARFARE."
The Army is moving closer to adopting a new standard issue pistol. The Army is looking for a more modern sidearm that can use additional accessories. In addition to this the Army wants to move away from the standard ball ammunition and is looking at hollow point and fragmenting ammo types. The R.I.P 9mm is an example of what fragmenting ammunition will look like. This ammo will have much greater destructive force than ammunition previously used for standard issue sidearms. Here's a link to what it looks like and how it performs. http://mic.com/articles/80211/a-new-bullet-has-been-invented-this-is-what-it-looks-like
"After a recent legal review within the Pentagon, the Army can consider adopting "special purpose ammunition," said Richard Jackson, special assistant to the Army Judge Advocate General for Law of War, according to an Army news release. This marks a departure from battlefield practices over a century old.
Jackson told Army Times that while this isn't the first approved use of such bullets in the military, the stance represented "a significant re-interpretation of the legal standard" for ammunition. He also said a lot has changed since the initial movements against the round, especially with the increased prevalence of ASYMMETRIC WARFARE."
The Army is moving closer to adopting a new standard issue pistol. The Army is looking for a more modern sidearm that can use additional accessories. In addition to this the Army wants to move away from the standard ball ammunition and is looking at hollow point and fragmenting ammo types. The R.I.P 9mm is an example of what fragmenting ammunition will look like. This ammo will have much greater destructive force than ammunition previously used for standard issue sidearms. Here's a link to what it looks like and how it performs. http://mic.com/articles/80211/a-new-bullet-has-been-invented-this-is-what-it-looks-like
Ammo
Firearms and Guns
Troops
Edited >1 y ago
Posted >1 y ago
Responses: 26
7
7
0
People confuse the various Geneva Convention iterations that deal with this. It doesn't. The Hague Convention of 1899 did but the US did not sign off on the article that dealt with expanding bullets. So the reality is that under International Law, the US isn't prohibited, nor ever was from using expanding bullets. There's this notion of "excessive damage" which really means "who the heck knows?" so that's pretty useless. The reality is if we use this stuff for generalized use, the enemy will too and will make the argument that whatever they may have signed in the past is invalid if it puts them at an inherent disadvantage. That won't matter either as the victor will get to write history and conduct war crimes courts.
My sense is every action will have a reaction, hence the US will think very carefully about what gets used on what, how, why, and will likely stay away from major international blow back. Remember we could be legally correct but suffer in the court of world opinion.
My sense is every action will have a reaction, hence the US will think very carefully about what gets used on what, how, why, and will likely stay away from major international blow back. Remember we could be legally correct but suffer in the court of world opinion.
(7)
(0)
SSG Timothy Miller
No, but that is about to change. They are no longer going to abide by the Hague Convention.
(0)
(0)
SSG Timothy Miller
Also, the statement that people confuse the Geneva Convention and the Hague Convention is very true. They are NOT the same. It is also true that the US never signed the Hague agreement. BUT, the US honored/abided by the agreement because mst of our Allies DID "sign" the agreement. In the past five years, the DOD has sought legal opinion and concluded that we (DOD-Americans) will NO LONGER abide or honor this agreement. I'm glad too. How many Americans have spilled their own blood (in the past 100 + years) had they had a better round to use on our enemy????
(1)
(0)
SSG Timothy Miller
DAH, I 'thought' I was responding to the OP's opening statement on fragmenting rounds.....
(0)
(0)
SGT Beau Thomas
I constantly was told by almost every young person that it is against the Geneva Convention to use excessive force, .50 cal BMG, hollow points, etc.. When the subject came up. I would tell them the Geneva Convention pertains to POW's and the US is not a signatory of The Hague Convention. I had a bear of a time convincing the ignorant. I am constantly astounded by the number of people who wouldjust believe what they hear without so much as a thread of research. i tried to show everyone of them how easy it is to look up some facts on their smartphone.
(1)
(0)
7
7
0
It was announced a while ago that the Army would switch to fragmenting rounds because of better lethality and less overpenetration. I just wonder how long it will take to get them.
(7)
(0)
4
4
0
Not sure, but I think in one of those treaties somewhere in there you are supposed to wear a uniform and you can't kill women and children.
Not only do I think we need these, but they should be soaked in pigs blood, by drunk women in shorty shorts, that have their hair uncovered, while giving opinions to men.
Allah Snackbar!
Not only do I think we need these, but they should be soaked in pigs blood, by drunk women in shorty shorts, that have their hair uncovered, while giving opinions to men.
Allah Snackbar!
(4)
(0)
Read This Next
Continue with Facebook 
Continue with Google