Are real leaders made or develop in the classroom or in the field?

1LT Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 13 Jan 2015 14:14:59 -0500

I am cadet soon to accept my Commission in the TN National Guard 11A.

I wonder you have some people say that leaders are made in the classroom, or say in the field.
what is your opinion?

Response by CMSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 13 at 2015 2:18 PM

CMSgt Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 13 Jan 2015 14:18:20 -0500

I believe leadership is something that is in each of us to some degree but how well that matures or manifests itself is largely a matter of experience, understanding and desire. Leadership techniques can certainly be taught, but true leadership comes from the experience in how those techniques are applied and the willingness to do it.

Response by LTC David S. Chang, ChFC®, CLU® made Jan 13 at 2015 2:22 PM

LTC David S. Chang, ChFC®, CLU® — Tue, 13 Jan 2015 14:22:46 -0500

Both! The best leaders are constantly learning in the classroom (can be just reading books, doesn't have to be necessarily in that environment) and they apply it to the real world. Information becomes knowledge when you learn it, and becomes wisdom when you apply it.

Take the case of the best martial artists. You can learn the moves, forms, and combinations. But if your intent is to be the next MMA champion, you can only know how good you are when you have to apply it.

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 13 at 2015 2:30 PM

LTC Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 13 Jan 2015 14:30:56 -0500

It depends!
One could lead a group after only OJT (in the field) as long as you became the best at it and demonstrated ot the others in the group that you were the best choice for leading.
Once could lead a group after studying leadership in the classroom, however as all of your knowledge would be academic, the challenge would be applying the right tool to the right problem set.

Ideally, one needs to study leadership in a classroom and in the field before becoming one.

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 15 at 2015 1:55 AM

1SG Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 15 Jan 2015 01:55:52 -0500

Real leaders are defined by those they lead. There is no formula that states that classroom experience is better then field experience. One gains valuable tools to develop your own leadership competencies in both arenas.

As a young LT you may find yourself being compared against or even criticized for not having "combat leadership experience" or "deployment leadership experience". DO NOT let that shit rest on your shoulders. There are have been many LTs and probably CPT's by now, that have come up without deploying since the drawdown. Be the leader you know you are and heed the lessons you can learn from senior O's and NCO's that have been in the wars, but use those to help shape your own style.

Response by Capt Richard I P. made Jan 15 at 2015 8:16 AM

Capt Richard I P. — Thu, 15 Jan 2015 08:16:37 -0500

Yes.

Response by COL Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 15 at 2015 9:31 AM

COL Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 15 Jan 2015 09:31:49 -0500

If it was singular, we wouldn't have 3 domains of Leader Development in the Army. The Operational domain, the Institutional domain, and the Self Development domain are all required to make a leader...if you believe they can be made. In my opinion, you can't shine a turd. That being said, most people can be given the right tools, but that doesn't make them a good leader. There's a lot more that goes into it and personality in the right environment is a factor as well. One thing that I have seen is that GREAT leaders make themselves (Self Development Domain). You have to want to be the best person you can be, both professionally and personally. It won't work without that key factor...and it has to be done for the right reasons. Self improvement for the sake of being better isn't enough. You have to believe in something that others want to be inspired by.

Response by CMC Robert Young made Jan 15 at 2015 9:33 AM

CMC Robert Young — Thu, 15 Jan 2015 09:33:00 -0500

Both are needed to become a successful leader. The classroom provides theory; a starting point if you will. The field provides a opportunity to practice the theory and refine your craft.

Likewise, both are in a state of constant flux, and must be revisited repeatedly. Leadership and the aspiration of being a leader require continual learning in both environments.

Response by CSM Christopher St. Cyr made Jan 15 at 2015 9:37 AM

CSM Christopher St. Cyr — Thu, 15 Jan 2015 09:37:58 -0500

Like the trades, you learn the principals in the classroom then you apply them in the field, hopefully, under the watchful eye of a journeyman or master. As a new LT, that should be your PSG or section NCOIC depending on whether you are assigned a platoon or staff job.

Response by CMDCM Gene Treants made Jan 15 at 2015 12:04 PM

CMDCM Gene Treants — Thu, 15 Jan 2015 12:04:21 -0500

Many will tell you that both are required and they are, but there is so much more. Some people believe that leaders are born with an innate ability to lead, I have to disagree with them. Those who seem to be born with this ability were born in the right place to leaders and with leaders, not with any innate or inborn ability. They learn from a young age by observation.

However, IMHO, the most necessary quality of leadership is, followership. If you cannot follow orders and be the best at following your chain of command, you will never learn how to lead in peace or more importantly in war. You will learn more from following your senior officers AND your NCO's than you ever will in the classroom.

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 15 at 2015 9:12 PM

1SG Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 15 Jan 2015 21:12:25 -0500

NEITHER.
Real leaders are made as they learn from daily interactions with the Soldiers around them.
How to build a team.
How to gain unity of effort.
How to address disagreement.
How to remedy a mistake.
How to use diplomacy to gain allies.
How to make a point respectfully, but assertively.
Who to emulate; who not to.

Classrooms can teach the technical aspects. Field work can teach practical application of classroom-learned skills. But leaders can't lead if they don't know how to handle people.

Response by CW5 Jim Steddum made Jan 15 at 2015 9:16 PM

CW5 Jim Steddum — Thu, 15 Jan 2015 21:16:56 -0500

I do not think leaders are made at all. One is either a leader or not. Classroom (virtual or institutional) can help develop leadership techniques. Experience is even more important for develop leadership characteristic (given appropriate well-rounded feedback). But, one can know everything there is to know about being a leader and not be effective at leading.

Response by SGT Jonathan Williams made Jan 15 at 2015 11:02 PM

SGT Jonathan Williams — Thu, 15 Jan 2015 23:02:09 -0500

Either or, sometimes both. Does not matter; however as long as they are made.

Response by SSgt Randy Saulsberry made Jan 15 at 2015 11:59 PM

SSgt Randy Saulsberry — Thu, 15 Jan 2015 23:59:27 -0500

In all actuality both but mostly in the real world. A leader can only be informed in a classroom, they can never be made there. You have endure the life at the bottom of the totem pole observing all those around you; taking mental notes of what works and what doesn't work. As you emerge from this crucible a polished NCO you will then be ready to put the training received at the courses and the OJT gained in the fleet: and you will empower the generation of leaders.

Response by MSG Brad Sand made Jan 16 at 2015 12:14 AM

MSG Brad Sand — Fri, 16 Jan 2015 00:14:02 -0500

@Cadet CPT Alex Griffin,

The only people who are telling you about leaders being made in the classroom are people who only have time in the classroom. You will get plenty of knowledge in the classroom, but be ready to use it in the really World.

Congratulations on your upcoming Commissioning.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 16 at 2015 12:16 AM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 16 Jan 2015 00:16:19 -0500

I believe that Great Leaders are well rounded with a good combination of both.
A book gives you the basic knowledge where the field or combat gives you a better perspective on how to react and think under pressure.

Response by MAJ Ken Landgren made Jun 25 at 2015 5:03 PM

MAJ Ken Landgren — Thu, 25 Jun 2015 17:03:11 -0400

Leaders are made in the field, motor pool, and office. I believe when your career is young, reading about a great victory like COL Chamberlain's can't be fully understood due to a lack of experience leading. How was he able to turn deserters into fighting men. How did he use the terrain to his advantage. What compelled him to fix bayonet and charge the Rebels?

Response by SP5 Laurie Mixter made May 28 at 2023 12:32 PM

SP5 Laurie Mixter — Sun, 28 May 2023 12:32:03 -0400

In your heart you believe in yourself and your people, you believe you will do the best you can, and you also cair what happens to your Soldiers, you are there for them!! So both! I went to the Hardest PLDC in the Army and served when all others failed, and so will you!