Can a commissioned officer discipline a soldier through corrective action?

2019-08-03T19:38:44-04:00

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 3 at 2019 8:14 PM

2019-08-03T20:14:38-04:00

Yes they can

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 3 at 2019 8:21 PM

2019-08-03T20:21:01-04:00

I am curious, though. What brought about this question?

Response by SGT Chris Stephens made Aug 3 at 2019 8:53 PM

2019-08-03T20:53:37-04:00

You've never seen an officer drop a Soldier for something? That in itself is a corrective action.

Response by MSG Reid Zohfeld made Aug 3 at 2019 10:56 PM

2019-08-03T22:56:03-04:00

On the spot correction is every soldier responsibility

Response by SSG Brian G. made Aug 4 at 2019 2:31 AM

2019-08-04T02:31:52-04:00

NCO = Non-Commissioned OFFICER. Think about that for a moment.
Yes. An officer can discipline a soldier through this method. An Officer has every single method and NCO has plus a few depending on their title.

Response by MAJ Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 4 at 2019 8:46 AM

2019-08-04T08:46:21-04:00

Absolutely.

Response by SGT David A. 'Cowboy' Groth made Aug 4 at 2019 9:48 AM

2019-08-04T09:48:58-04:00

That they can.

Response by SFC Casey O'Mally made Aug 4 at 2019 10:16 AM

2019-08-04T10:16:52-04:00

By the very words of your question, no. Corrective action is corrective in nature and not punitive.

If your question is whether Officers can correct Soldiers, the answer is a RESOUNDING yes. It would be a sad world, indeed if Officers were given no authority to correct, and ONLY authority to punish.

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 4 at 2019 10:30 AM

2019-08-04T10:30:15-04:00

Where do you think NCOs get the power to perform corrective action? It comes from the officer with that special word under his signature block, "Commanding".

Response by SSG(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 4 at 2019 10:31 AM

2019-08-04T10:31:23-04:00

Here's my experience: It was 2005 in AIT, we were on our 3 day FTX and I can't recall what happened to justify this but our company commander had us in formation, lectured, and smoked us. Drill Sergeants included. We didn't do more than a couple push-ups but the point was made the officer could do this to enlisted of all those ranks. I agree with most stating on the spot corrections can come from anyone but really its preferred, without diving through all FMs, that it comes from the first line leader. I haven't seen it since my experience in AIT but it can be done.

Response by Capt Michael Wilford made Aug 4 at 2019 12:18 PM

2019-08-04T12:18:03-04:00

Your question is actually two different topics; discipline and corrective action. As a Commissioned Officer who is not in your chain of command, a captain could drop you for push ups and that is corrective action. As one who is superior in rank, that is well within their rights and scope of authority. Your battalion commander taking rank, pay, and restricting you to the barracks via Article 15, is punishment. See the difference? Only those in the chain of command have the authority to punish, while any officer or NCO can administer corrective action. Corrective action can be as simple as a brief period of instruction to physical training depending on the infraction. It is meant to address minor, easily correctable infractions that do not require disciplinary action. I know this is a long response, but I hope it helps you see the difference between discipline and corrective action and who may apply them.

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 4 at 2019 12:34 PM

2019-08-04T12:34:22-04:00

An Article 15 is nonjudicial punishment, not corrective training.
Pushups are corrective action physical exercise.
An example of corrective training: Soldier failed to report to the appointed place of duty at the appointed time several times, and was verbally counseled previously.
Supervisor counsels Soldier, in writing, and assigns corrective training where the Soldier is required
to report to the supervisor at the Company Orderly Room, in duty uniform, every three hours, between the hours of 0800-2100 daily (weekends, training holidays, and holiday included), until the deficiency is corrected. Then, once the supervisor believes the deficiency is corrected, the corrective training is considered completed. Then, the results are documented on the appropriate block on the counseling statement.
One of my pet peeves as PSG and 1SG was reviewing counseling statements where corrective training was assigned, but the results weren't documented. I'd tear those up, and write one for the supervisor, assigning them to provide a block of instruction on how to properly document counseling and corrective training.

Response by SFC Tom Crenshaw made Aug 4 at 2019 1:04 PM

2019-08-04T13:04:22-04:00

Can you avoid disobeying a direct order if you don't comply? Your question brings to mind a lack of submitting to authority, and that would ultimately be the cause. Anything needed , any cause, to get your head gear to fit. Before... Chopping it off.

Response by MSG Bob Metz made Aug 5 at 2019 11:17 AM

2019-08-05T11:17:55-04:00

A corrective action should be taken by any Soldier...in regards to any other soldier...that may knowingly or unknowingly be in violation of regulations or an order for example...as with any action between Servicemen and Women it should be done with respect...regardless of Rank...as a newly promoted E-6, I once took a Medical Captain aside outdoors and corrected him...for not wearing his Service Cap in an area he needed to (he carried it across the street in his hand)...Surprisingly, I also noted a number of folks were not saluting him...I encountered him first ergo they got away...His response was somewhat humorous but would’ve been totally unacceptable to my DI...

Response by LCDR Joshua Gillespie made Aug 5 at 2019 1:34 PM

2019-08-05T13:34:03-04:00

Oh, yes...

It has to be directly related to the infraction, and you can't circumvent/undermine the UCMJ...but last I heard, there's no reason an "O" can't use it. Frankly, if I saw something ate-up that hadn't caught the attention of a ranking NCO...I'd consider a personal failure not to call it out.

That being said (and speaking generally from personal experience), officers tend to avoid getting in the way of the senior enlisted. We may be "in command", but it's "their unit".

Yet another "angle" on this? The Platoon Sgt. or First Sgt. may have eyes in the back of their head...but believe it or not, "we" and "they" are usually on the same team.

Response by MAJ Anthony DeStefano made Oct 1 at 2022 12:25 PM

2022-10-01T12:25:22-04:00

A commissioned officer should but does not have to go to an NCO for such things...leave sargeant's business to sergeants, but there are times when an IMMEDIATE response is required, I have seen soldiers go way out of their way to avoid a salute...like putting things in both hands or crossing the street. Now I am a mustang and when I salute it is to say that I am committed to lead you as welll as I mentally physically and spirituall am able even if it means my life over yours...that is how much I value a subordinate's salute. So I corrected soldiers and explained the meaning and origin of the salute... in Roman days and earlier it was to show that no weapon or danger was presented to the superior and that they would follow and obey him... (back then only the Amazon's had female officers)

Response by SGT Ruben Lozada made Oct 1 at 2022 6:31 PM

2022-10-01T18:31:27-04:00

Negative ghostrider. It should the be the job of that Soldier's Team Leader to do the corrective action. It shouldn't never go to the Officer level.