Initial reaction to soldiers with shaving profiles?

SPC Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 11 Aug 2014 21:22:16 -0400

This topic is more related to the superior ranks whether it be NCO's or Officers. Before getting to the topic let me say I am fairly knew to the army(17 months), but i am very... hooah; i guess is a good term. i grew up army and joined with discipline, i think that it has gotten to "soft." i follow and know the standards sent down from my superiors. i only mention this so i hopefully don't get backlash for just being "another private."

So... to the topic above. I am a white male with a permanent shaving profile which i always have at least one copy of on my persons. it states :
"must be uniform and neatly trimmed to a length of ~1/8 inch - 1/4 inch(not to exceed 1/4 inch total length of curled hair) so as to maintain a neat and clean appearance. no styling of the beard is authorized."
I am always within my range of length and never style, i just trim the whole thing. i have had bumps and cuts ever since i started shaving.

so to stop "defending myself" and get to the real point. How do you first react to a soldier who obviously didn't shave? I would about 85% of those that "correct" me on the spot do so by starting the correction in a degrading sometimes yelling and profane way only to find out after they are done that i have a profile. then when they find that out theres no appologizing for making a public scene so everyone thinks that private is a ____bag. i have actually been in a situation in which one superior did this, only to have a higher rank 2 mins later yell at me again to find out the same thing.

So again, how do some of you respond at first? what do you think is an appropriate way to react to the lower ranking soldier? keep in mind, a young soldier doesn't forget most of his/her encounters with higher ranks.

thank you everyone for your responses, its good to hear more opinions of how some of your fellow leaders are acting to junior enlisted. have a good night all.

Response by Cpl Christopher Bishop made Sep 4 at 2014 2:03 AM

Cpl Christopher Bishop — Thu, 04 Sep 2014 02:03:13 -0400

Uhm....I have to ask just exactly how long any man's "Fear The Beard" has to grow before it might negatively affect getting a good skin-seal when donning a Gas Mask...?

Of course its been a while since I've been out of the USMC. But I suppose I must also ask if this is an Army Only thing? Do more modern-day gas mask and related equipment not require a good skin seal to the face?

A decent NCO who is truly troubled by your facial stubble should ask you if you have (whatever paperwork allowing you to be short on blades) before he goes off on you. That said, there are always those few "sub-par bosses" out there, some who have many years of service in yet still have not netted themselves any "locked-in-to-retirement" staff rank, who just walk around all nervous about getting booted home before that ever happens, and so like most other workplace bosses, some just gotta run their mouths at you out of lack of anything more constructive to do, if only to appear busy.

That said, once you get to the top of the "relatively automatic promotion ranks"---which for you could mean E3 with some Time in Grade under it or E4 if you end up going the Spec4 route ... the better a Soldier you are, the less you will generally get messed with about it ... that applies to those you work with, but you cannot expect your entire base to know you personally unless you are in some really tiny facility, in which case its more likely no one cares. NCOs, in my opinion, should be setting a better example in terms of how much more money they make, and what is being gained by the system for that money...i mean there are always those few who truly need, and by action ASK for "extra attention" but I'd hope most NCOs are doing something a little more valuable than playing Babysitters.

Sometimes you almost have to be a "Smart Ass" to make a good point. If your immediate chain of command is being unreasonable about it ... well could wait until the next morning formation (after PT) and show up with your face and neck all cut n bloody and when asked about it....you say This is why I have the Shaving Paper...my facial hair is far less likely to transmit whatever diseases I might have now or in the future in my blood, than these open sores might. It is much harder for your own Squad/Section leader to keep badgering you about it, when your Company 1stSgt is laughing his ass off about it. Jus' Sayin'. =)

Semper Fi =)

Response by WO1 Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 4 at 2014 9:25 PM

WO1 Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 04 Sep 2014 21:25:08 -0400

Have you tried shaving with a safety razor? I used to get bumps and cuts on my face pretty bad i used 3-4-5 blade razors, clippers, trimmers even electric. An old barber showed me a safety razor i been using it ever since.

Response by SSG Christopher Freeman made Dec 7 at 2014 12:49 AM

SSG Christopher Freeman — Sun, 07 Dec 2014 00:49:40 -0500

Well when it comes to shaving profiles, I always ask for the profile before I say anything. Once I see the profile, I look at their face and see if it is too long. I understand that you can't really tell the difference between 1/8" and 1/4" unless you are looking real close. Then I look to see if it is edged at all. If they are my Soldier, I would make sure to outline procedures for following a profile and what violating it could cause.

Personal opinion: I think the shaving profile thing is a croc (unless there is a medical necessity or severe facial injuries, at least I think they would give it for that). You get bumps while shaving, big deal. I get the same thing every day, have been for the 10 or so years I have been shaving. I just got used to it after a while. I won't consider you a bad Soldier for having one, one that uses what is available to him.

Don't let my personal opinion fool you, I will still follow regulatory guidance and keep my thoughts to myself.

Response by SSG(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 7 at 2014 1:03 AM

SSG(P) Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 07 Dec 2014 01:03:55 -0500

I wouldn't give you crap if you kept it short. I see too many with a profile...take advantage of it, and let it grow long...which is giving you a bad name. I suspect the military will only put up with this for so long, especially the Marine Corps, they do not so well with anyone outside of the norm. (From personal experience) Is your diagnosis chronic faliculitis?

Response by WO1 Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 18 at 2015 9:14 PM

WO1 Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 18 Jan 2015 21:14:25 -0500

Here's the reason. First impression is that you didn't shave, which is slightly irritating. If you have a shaving profile, its even more irritating. I can't stand shaving profiles because 99% of the people who get them, are using them as a way to rebel against the institution because they are a 'sub-par' Soldier and they know that it irritates the rule-enforcers. Kind of like a passive aggressive way of flipping NCO's the bird. The other 1% have a legitimate facial injury prohibiting them from shaving even if they wanted to.

Response by 2d Lt Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 5 at 2015 3:22 PM

2d Lt Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 05 Sep 2015 15:22:49 -0400

Try the 5 star wahl shaver shaper (best 50 dollars spent ever) . I struggle with pseufofolliculitus barbae my self. It is unfortunate because you have a medical condition; however in the military, image and perception and first impressions go a long way. It doesnt make you any less capable if a soldier because you don't/can't shave. But the first thing leadership is going to ask is why is xxxxx out of regulations. And then there is whole stigma associated with shaving waivers as some believe them to be a croc. In the end it all boils down to what you want to do.

Response by SPC Earl Woodland made Jul 1 at 2017 7:41 AM

SPC Earl Woodland — Sat, 01 Jul 2017 07:41:13 -0400

While I was in the army they always ask whether you have a shaving profile or not before they correct. The thing that kills me is the excuse that interferes with the gas mask. One day while I was on a temporary shaving profile I had to go into the gas chamber. I got a perfectly good seal while in the gas chamber.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 23 at 2017 2:11 PM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 23 Aug 2017 14:11:01 -0400

My first reaction is this Solder is not going to make it a career in the military. Perception goes a long way. You can scream shaving profile and medical condition all day; but the bottom line is it will hold you back one way or another. The Army will discriminate you just like they do with P2 walker's, you can't attend Airborne school, go for Drill Sergeant Duty etc. You are limited on ways to make it long term in the military. So going back I react with the assumption that this guy isn't planning on making it a career or maybe the military isn't for him because of his life threatening medical condition to not shave. If your like Samson and your strength is in your hair, you're in the wrong line of work. Unless it's religious and your a chaplain than that's another story.

Response by COL Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 19 at 2018 12:12 AM

COL Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 19 Mar 2018 00:12:31 -0400

I’ve been known to say- hey, what’s up with the shaving? Sometimes you can see the bumps on their neck. No point in asking cause, really - if they don’t have a profile then I’m sure they know to get one.

Response by SSG Curtis Vaughn made Dec 8 at 2019 1:07 AM

SSG Curtis Vaughn — Sun, 08 Dec 2019 01:07:11 -0500

I have re ad some good and poor leadership answers here. If you as an NCO or Officer have a question if a Soldier has a shaving profile ask the Soldier for his profile, if he has it no harm no foul. If doesn't find out who is his First line supervisor or 1SG is and let NCO's due their job. First line supervisor counsel you Soldier on they will be checked by others who don't know them. And to those who put labels on Soldier's you don't know of being Dirtbags because of their profile that show's me you don't need to be in the position you are in.

Response by SFC Pat Mattson made May 21 at 2020 9:42 AM

SFC Pat Mattson — Thu, 21 May 2020 09:42:17 -0400

During the my enlistment, the only shaving profiles I ever saw were African American. Sure there was a few Caucasian that needed one.
The rule was a #1 (1/8)or #2 (1/4) clipper guard and no styling the stubble.
Today’s military feels like the transition time between Vietnam and 82

Response by Cpl Christopher Bishop made Sep 26 at 2021 3:51 AM

Cpl Christopher Bishop — Sun, 26 Sep 2021 03:51:01 -0400

I learned a basic psychology tip early on. I call it “Tell them they’re right, then show them they’re wrong.”

Now most of the time Id shave myself a nice close shave every Mon/Wed/Fri mornings after PT and a shower. Now keep in mind that at that age, my growth rate was so far from “wildabeast” that the only people who might bother me on a Tues/Thurs about my “horrendous lack of shaving” were quite clearly those with nothing better to do. Now I knew my neck would turn bright red “turkey gizzard” if I shaved daily. So some SSGT who is quite obviously a relative POS and not even in my platoon just has to come by and grill me on a late Thursday afternoon about how we all gotta get into Dress Blues the following Tuesday and thus I better be well shaved for that. So Im thinking Ok I should get a good shave in Sunday and again early Tuesday morning. So of course he digs at me Monday during PT about it. Ok fine...I get a shave in after PT about an hour later, knowing Im going to “extra close shave” Tuesday morning. Now he has to look at my screaming red turkey gizzard in dress blues. I personally didn’t care, as it wasn’t an event I was all to concerned about even attending. Then of course he has to make this small issue a public spectacle. So I just said “I guess this is why you can’t find your way to an E7 promotion...”Praise Publicly, Scold Privately” never crosses your mind?? Or is it that your fatass doesn’t even fit into your Blues and thus you quite obviously do not meet height/weight regulations...not that you even have much decorum to put on them anyways, nope just another “pizza box infantryman” who must be pretty damn good aiming Mortars because God forbid you ever have to aim a rifle.”

But everything else was secondary...I complied by having the closest of shaves that morning!! Red gizzard neck in all of its splendor!! Im sure someone above him told him to leave me be about shaving after that.