Should instructors receive special duty pay?

SFC Michael Boulanger — Fri, 22 Nov 2013 12:25:19 -0500

Instructors put a lot of hours in teaching important skills to young and senior Soldiers.  I was an instructor at WLC in the Army Reserves and missed meals and had to pay for things that I normally would not have to pay for.  As a recruiter a few years back I didn't really have to pay for as much and almost always had the time for meals.  I am not saying recruiters shouldn't get Special Duty Pay, all I am asking is should they add instructors to the list of duty positions that are entitled to Special Duty Pay?

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 22 at 2013 1:18 PM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 22 Nov 2013 13:18:02 -0500

I would agree with that. Instructors (especially NCOES and MOSQ) are similar to Drill Sergeants in the effect that can have in influencing and mentoring a soldier, and because that kind of leadership doesn't come with a set daily schedule an instructor deserves some compensation for incidental expenses like missed meals.

Response by SSG Matthew Thomas made Nov 22 at 2013 1:26 PM

SSG Matthew Thomas — Fri, 22 Nov 2013 13:26:20 -0500

As an instructor operator in the UAV field you have many more duties and responsibilities associated with it. i understand have another designation comes with added responsibilities. All I am saying is it would be nice to be compensated for it.

Response by SFC William Swartz Jr made Nov 22 at 2013 1:30 PM

SFC William Swartz Jr — Fri, 22 Nov 2013 13:30:24 -0500

Having served as an SGL and Sr SGL at PLDC, an Instructor/Writer and Sr Instructor/Writer in the Armor School, I have always felt that due to the number of hours worked in garrison and field environments as well as missed meals, etc, that Instructors should have been receiving Special Duty Pay similar to that of Recruiters and Drill Sergeants.

Response by MSG Bobby Ewing made Nov 22 at 2013 1:53 PM

MSG Bobby Ewing — Fri, 22 Nov 2013 13:53:35 -0500

I have never served as an instructor, but several of my friends have. From the majority of responses about the duty assignments ranging from: signal to armor, I feel that instructors should receive special duty pay. The Army advertises instructors, AIT PSGs, and other TRADOC assignments as career boosters like Recruiting and Drill Sergeant. They should offer a little if not as much special duty pay as they do for those assignments, because of the hours they work, the missed meals, etc pay a huge toll on a Soldier.

Response by SGM Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 22 at 2013 7:00 PM

SGM Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 22 Nov 2013 19:00:01 -0500

When the Drill Sgt's took their hats off in AIT (2008), I was a new Instructor...we came in at 5, woke up the Soldiers, did PT with them, marched them to chow, taught them all day, marched them to chow at night, tucked them in. Worked 7-8 days a week (It was 6 months before I had a 2 day weekend) and pulled duty 8 times a month as well. As an Instructor we received no special pay, no permanent badge (unlike DS and Recruiters) and no respect from anybody. It was a long three years.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 22 at 2013 7:13 PM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 22 Nov 2013 19:13:22 -0500

Instructors and AIT PSG's work an insane amount of hours here on Fort Lee. They literally work from way before sun up to way after sun down all year round. Beyond the actual duty requirements, lets not forget about the never ending taskings that come down that require NCO's to fill. We can't task the PSG's so the instructors take the hit on those as well. The only break that they get is during the holiday block leave timeframe. I remember when I saw my orders taking me to Fort Lee. A friend of mine told me, "oh you're going to TRADOC, it will be a nice break." I can't wait to go back to operational Army to get a break.

Special duty pay is the start of what these NCO's need to be compensated with.

Response by SGM Matthew Quick made Nov 22 at 2013 8:02 PM

SGM Matthew Quick — Fri, 22 Nov 2013 20:02:30 -0500

Not for just "missing meals" or to pay for certain things...that's what you get BAS for.

Would recommend looking at WHY the Army pays SDAP in the first place.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 22 at 2013 8:11 PM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 22 Nov 2013 20:11:18 -0500

SFC,

I don't think that there should be a special pay across the board. There are plenty of Soldiers around the Army as a whole that put in hours that are just as long. If anything create and give the AIT instructors and NCOA instructors a badge that they can wear and allow them recieve the same type of lasting recognition that the Drill Sergeants and Recruiters do.

Response by SFC Benjamin Parsons made Nov 25 at 2013 10:02 PM

SFC Benjamin Parsons — Mon, 25 Nov 2013 22:02:29 -0500

Worked long hours as an Instructor/Writer for Armor ANCOC.

Overall not nearly as day-to-day challenging as Armor line PSG.

Unless there is real extra expense or voluntary physical risk involved, no.

I do like the idea of a little uniform award though.

Response by SFC James Baber made Nov 26 at 2013 2:33 PM

SFC James Baber — Tue, 26 Nov 2013 14:33:58 -0500

I was in a unit that had both DS and SQD LDR/INST, when the DS took their hats of, they were still receiving the pay even though them and the other SQUD LDRS were doing the same job and the nonDS were doing more including platform time, it caused a lot of controversy and bad feelings. I think their should be some type of special pay when they are giving up as much if not more time that a DS is.

Response by 1LT Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 27 at 2013 6:05 PM

1LT Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 27 Nov 2013 18:05:54 -0500

Having worked with Marine Corps officers, I very much like how they handle this problem. Being selected as an instructor of Marines in any capacity is considered a favorable personnel action which puts you ahead of other Marines. Being selected for instructor duty is very favorable, and very competitive, in that individuals who receive this duty are recognized as some of the best in their field, and it reflects into their promotions. For NCO's we see a similar favorable response to those who receive Drill Sergeant duty. We offer tremendous career incentives to the Drill Sergeant. Now I recognize our need for instructors is much larger than the Marine Corps, and as such we can't afford to be as selective in choosing instructors - but there must be away that to create greater incentives to be an instructor so that soldiers will volunteer rather than be voluntold for the duty and I think it begins with rating instructor time more favorably on that soldiers overall career progression than it is now.

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 29 at 2013 5:05 PM

MSG Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 29 Nov 2013 17:05:52 -0500

Short answer, No.

Long answer, SDAP is not about missing meals or anything of that nature. SDAP is awarded to SM's for holding "Positions of Trust". Now what that means is the SM's that hold those positions are not working directly with personnel with military backgrounds, they work will civilians. So those SM's in the public eye that work a job such as Drill SGT, or Recruiter have a lot more pressure and responsibility than those other SM's that are Instructor's.

Instructors such as NCOES, MOSQ and so on are working with SM's that are to already have Military bearing. Just because an instructor works long nights and misses meals does not entitle him/her to SDAP.

Now AIT PLT SGT, I have seen first hand in Ft. Lee how much life sucks for them, and I will tell you this if any instructor deserves some kind of compensation it is them and no other.

Response by CSM Mike Maynard made Nov 29 at 2013 6:46 PM

CSM Mike Maynard — Fri, 29 Nov 2013 18:46:28 -0500

Well, ALARACT 2013-308 is out and there are significant changes to SDAP. Great reading - I had no idea that SDAP was authorized for that many folks.

On another note, there may be "hope" for instructors - one of the new authorized SDAP position is an instructor - "RANGER-QUALIFIED SOLDIERS (SGT AND ABOVE) SERVING IN RANGER OR RECONNAISSANCE AND SURVEILLANCE LEADER COURSE INSTRUCTOR POSITIONS ARE AUTHORIZED SD-2."

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 30 at 2013 8:31 PM

MSG Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 30 Nov 2013 20:31:26 -0500

The vantage point I speak of is in AR 614-200. Not going to type all of it out but look in 3-22 and 3-23.

Just like the CSM mentioned they are making changes to the SDAP but no matter how you slice it some one some where doesnt think that you fall into a SDAP related category.

Sure you can make the arguement that you fall under Ch 3-22 para a(2).

A greater than normal degree of responsibility (heavy and personal burden to ensure successful accomplishmentof duties) than what reasonably could be expected in a regular military assignment for a Soldier’s grade and experience

But someone somewhere thinks that you don't, and I disagree with them; I am just pointing out what the Regulation states.

Response by CW2 Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 12 at 2014 1:11 PM

CW2 Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 12 Mar 2014 13:11:37 -0400

Perhaps with the new badge being awarded to instructors - this may potentially change