Posted on Dec 1, 2014
SFC Paralegal Specialist
61.6K
791
312
19
19
0
A Soldier has been to the "company level" promotion board three times. His (we'll assume it's a "he") leadership feels he is ready for the next step... Yet when the Soldier goes to the board he refuses to "sing a song" (the Army Song) and say a "creed that nobody lives by". He will never get past the company level to the actual promotion board because of this. He feels that singing a song and reciting a creed shouldn't make a good leader. He believes he can recall the regs, research, battle drills, etc..

What are your thoughts on this?

**UPDATE**

Since I originally posted this, the Soldier has PCS'd, gained new leadership, attended the promotion board, and has been promoted to Sergeant. When the Soldier was where I am, he was not my Soldier, he was in a completely different unit, but I did what I could to help mentor him. His new leadership has "opened his eyes" and he has grown and come along way! I am proud of him and he still reaches out to me for guidance.
Posted in these groups: American flag soldiers SoldiersLeadership abstract 007 Leadership
Edited >1 y ago
Avatar feed
Responses: 142
SFC Recruiter
104
104
0
Anyone can study for a board. What separates Soldiers from civilians is our dedication and sense of duty to uphold the standards in which our very foundation is built. As NCOs, we are required to enforce the standards. There is no place in the Army for political stances when it comes to standards. You are entitled to think what you will, but at the end of the day you are required to do your duty above everything else. If the Soldier doesn't understand this, then he isn't ready to advance. Although we may fight for democracy, that doesn't mean we are a democracy.
(104)
Comment
(0)
SFC Military Intelligence Systems Maintainer/Integrator
SFC (Join to see)
>1 y
PFC Howard Toller - The problem I have is Self Entitled Soldiers feeling they deserve simply because they showed up. Learn the value of hard work and appreciation, Stand out by being humble about your successes, Stop demanding unearned recognition.

What you see as "Power tripping" I call correcting a discipline problem 18-20 years too late.
(0)
Reply
(0)
MSG Mechanic 2nd
MSG (Join to see)
>1 y
i totally agre lleaner your position and move on
(0)
Reply
(0)
SFC Practical/Vocational Nursing
SFC (Join to see)
>1 y
our country is not a democracy. It is a Republic.
(0)
Reply
(0)
SSG Training Nco
SSG (Join to see)
>1 y
F’n A!
(0)
Reply
(0)
Avatar small
COL Strategic Plans Chief
75
75
0
I think it's time for him to pack his crap. This isn't an option. Comply. If you can't do that over a song, how the hell am I supposed to trust you with complying with complicated orders? You think I believed that everything I was told to do was the right thing? Hell no. I did it because I trusted in the overall competence and system of those around me. Suck it up.
(75)
Comment
(0)
PFC Bradley Campbell
PFC Bradley Campbell
>1 y
if you cant pass the board, how can you be trusted to order your platoon to do something where men are going to kill our enemies and we will lose some of our troops?
(0)
Reply
(0)
SGT Michael Davis
SGT Michael Davis
>1 y
I'm sure you had a different intention when you said "you think I believed that everything I was told to do was the right thing?" That right there is what's wrong with some individuals in all branches of government, law enforcement and military. If the excuse for completing a unlawful order was "he told me to do it" then they are too stupid to do their job. That is exactly what's wrong with the agents and law enforcement of today following laws that may be on the books but violate every human and natural right that supersede any political bs after it, same with the government walking on the constitution. We have standards that no rank supersedes. I'm sure you didn't mean it to that extent sir but I felt the need to rant and clarify.
(2)
Reply
(0)
SGT John Bales
SGT John Bales
>1 y
SGT Michael Davis - He didn't mean that the orders he recieved were unlawful, hell there is a standing directive to NOT obey unlawful orders. He meant that he thought there was a better way to accomplish the mission but he did what he was told because he understood that there was a method to the madness and a reason for the orders given.
(2)
Reply
(0)
COL Strategic Plans Chief
COL (Join to see)
>1 y
SGT Michael Davis, SGT John Bales nailed it on the head. I have heated discussions with my current boss ALL THE TIME because we don't agree on the "how" regarding certain tasks. I will go at him in private until he tells me to shut my hole and move out with the orders he gave me. That's pretty much how it goes too. Then...even though I don't agree with the way in which we are about to do something...I do it that way anyways. I do what he told me to do because that is what we do in the Army. If it isn't illegal, immoral or unethical, I move out and do it. If someone told me to sing a song, I'd do it. Even if I didn't agree with it and it wasn't about something that crosses a line (some old cadences come to mind...it would be wrong to sing about the nether regions of native Alaskans for instance). If the CSM told me to wear rubber clown shoes because that's the uniform of the day...I'd do it (command teams can authorized alternative footwear...it's in the regs). I will not make a spectacle for the sake of my own internal satisfaction and misguided self-righteousness. That is unacceptable and we do a very poor job of inducting people into the military instead of shaping the military to individual personalities. There are too many people whose parents failed to instill in them the understanding that their opinion isn't very important in every situation.
(0)
Reply
(0)
Avatar small
MAJ S3/5/7 Cuops
44
44
0
If the Solider wants to stand on his views, albeit a little off, then he can not get promoted. The Army song wasn't in the board when I was enlisted but the NCO creed is part of every board. From my view I was say this Solider is too immature and not ready to join the NCO Corps.
(44)
Comment
(0)
MAJ S3/5/7 Cuops
MAJ (Join to see)
7 y
Outstanding response Gunny and fully agree!
(0)
Reply
(0)
Avatar small

Join nearly 2 million former and current members of the US military, just like you.

close