Why are men held to a more restrictive hair grooming standard than women?

SSG Brian Marshall — Tue, 12 Apr 2016 15:09:03 -0400

Equality in the Army. Why can't men in the Army grow there hair out as long as it's well groomed? Seeing that woman are equal to men now!

Response by SGT Laura Delgadillo made Apr 12 at 2016 3:11 PM

SGT Laura Delgadillo — Tue, 12 Apr 2016 15:11:06 -0400

Looking at your profile picture i don't think you are able to grow any hair.

Response by 1stSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 12 at 2016 3:12 PM

1stSgt Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 12 Apr 2016 15:12:04 -0400

I think that that would destroy the conservative look that soldiers have always had in the last 100 years or so. I would leave that one alone. Just my opinion.

Response by Sgt Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 12 at 2016 3:12 PM

Sgt Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 12 Apr 2016 15:12:19 -0400

SSG Brian Marshall Each branch of the military has grooming standards for men and women that are different, and always have been.

Response by MCPO Roger Collins made Apr 12 at 2016 3:15 PM

MCPO Roger Collins — Tue, 12 Apr 2016 15:15:23 -0400

Be serious, SSG, then how could you tell the women from the men? How about makeup? (sarcasm) I get your point. I will believe there is no difference between the genders when the Professional sports have mixed teams. There is a reason for that.

Response by SSG Carlos Madden made Apr 12 at 2016 3:23 PM

SSG Carlos Madden — Tue, 12 Apr 2016 15:23:35 -0400

Because there's more to groom. Women can't grow beards and mustaches.

Response by COL Jean (John) F. B. made Apr 12 at 2016 3:25 PM

COL Jean (John) F. B. — Tue, 12 Apr 2016 15:25:15 -0400

SSG Brian Marshall Bottom line is that it is politically correct for women to be treated as equals to men, but the reverse is not necessarily true. There is no liberal PC push for men to be treated as equals to women.

While I think this whole social engineering crap has gone too far, what's fair is fair. What is good for the goose is good for the gander. I don't like the fact that women can pick and choose what to be equal in and what not to be equal in.

Of course, all you really need to do is wake up one day and "feel" that you are a woman, instead of a man. In that way, you can wear what you want, wear your hair however you want, use whatever latrine and shower facility you want, and on and on... and, if anybody says anything to you about it, you can sue them for a trillion dollars. Isn't this country great, or what???

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 12 at 2016 3:25 PM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 12 Apr 2016 15:25:58 -0400

Great question. I'm not as in favor of males growing out their hair as much as females having fewer options with styles and colors.

Response by SGT(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 12 at 2016 3:33 PM

SGT(P) Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 12 Apr 2016 15:33:11 -0400

SSG Brian Marshall Even if they bring a change, I do my own hair just to save some money and I know just 2 styles. But I don't think I would see it right, there are some thing in the Military that shouldn't change, that being one.

Response by SGT Jeremiah B. made Apr 12 at 2016 3:51 PM

SGT Jeremiah B. — Tue, 12 Apr 2016 15:51:35 -0400

Let's be honest - the standards are largely a mix of cultural throwback and practicality. Short hair is handy on the battlefield, but masks seal just fine with reasonable beards. I think we could loosen up the Army standards a little bit and be just fine.

I also think that with the inclusion of women in combat positions, the Army should consider moving away from general standards and more towards MOS-centric standards. Infantry and Armor personnel with long hair would be bad, but not so much for a finance clerk or quartermaster. Setting physical and appearance standards by MOS rather than gender nullifies a lot of the concerns.

Response by SSG Warren Swan made Apr 12 at 2016 4:00 PM

SSG Warren Swan — Tue, 12 Apr 2016 16:00:11 -0400

Look I'd be happier than hell if the Army would allow me to grow this. I could fit it under my headgear, have my pic inside and no one would notice a damn thing. Add some porkchop sideburns and I'm BEYOND SF qualified. NO ONE would DARE touch the hair. Don't mess with the mans Fro. If women can have big hair, I should have it too. And it's cheaper on the Army budget. They won't have to give me any pillows, I have a built in pillow!! It's really a win win. And if you can't grow a Fro, then a mullet works too. My question would be would the Army allow me to have a Jeri Curl? If so PT formation is about to get messy for sure. Hit me two times baby!!

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 12 at 2016 4:16 PM

CPT Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 12 Apr 2016 16:16:50 -0400

SSG Brian Marshall The first thing I would ask is: Do you really want to do this? I think some men may think it is a novel idea at first but the reality of keeping long hair restrained and maintained isn't as simple as pulling it back and then expecting it to be good for the rest of the day, ESPECIALLY IN A FIELD ENVIRONMENT. When you say this do you take into account the guidelines women must conform to for their hair?

Response by PO2 Robert Aitchison made Apr 12 at 2016 5:20 PM

PO2 Robert Aitchison — Tue, 12 Apr 2016 17:20:00 -0400

I was always told one of the reasons why grooming standards are the way they are is so that service members are always "presentable" (not offensive) to the general public. Women are EXPECTED by society to have longer hair than men.

Response by SGT Shane Allen made Apr 12 at 2016 7:00 PM

SGT Shane Allen — Tue, 12 Apr 2016 19:00:04 -0400

They can. Become an Operator and 670-1 no longer applies. Otherwise keep the clean neat professional appearance that is expected of a male soldier. In my opinion there should not be exceptions for PT standards either. The same standard should apply regardless of age or gender and I'm old. I should be able to hang with an eighteen year old. I've had more practice. To paraphrase a famous quote, you have one true warrior among a hundred men. Better to have a hundred warriors than ten thousand targets. Do not change the standards for anyone.

Response by Maj Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 12 at 2016 7:13 PM

Maj Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 12 Apr 2016 19:13:17 -0400

For the same reason as men are not allowed to wear a skirt with their Class A's.

Response by Capt Richard I P. made Apr 12 at 2016 8:30 PM

Capt Richard I P. — Tue, 12 Apr 2016 20:30:48 -0400

I actually think that equality is the way to go on this. I've said that before around here. Same uniforms same hair regs and grooming standards, options for makeup and jewelry the same, etc.

Start with combat requirements, add in some tradition and judgement and then let it ride for all.

Whether it be the current "male" or current "female" standards that are authorized for all, or something in the middle, they should all be the same. Same standards, same conditions, equality.

This also conveniently sidesteps any issues with the trans community.

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 12 at 2016 11:50 PM

SPC Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 12 Apr 2016 23:50:58 -0400

A good haircut gives a more professional look, long hair gets in the way in the field and can fall apart. If you don't have long hair then you have that much more time during the day.

Response by CSM Darieus ZaGara made Apr 13 at 2016 5:56 AM

CSM Darieus ZaGara — Wed, 13 Apr 2016 05:56:57 -0400

The grooming standards for all service members are professional and respectable. Do we hold each other to that standard? If we go further, do we want women to look like men? As women's role evolves in the services there will be instances where their hair in particular would have to be shorter based on necessity. Women were always equal to men, it was a matter of where they could serve based on military regulation. I will say as the military evolves it should ensure that the original standard for the performance of specific duties does not change regardless of who is taking on that challenge.

Let us not further erode standards just to make a point!

Response by CW4 Guy Butler made Apr 13 at 2016 6:42 AM

CW4 Guy Butler — Wed, 13 Apr 2016 06:42:46 -0400

Apparently because of the 1960s-70s according to this "short" history of military grooming standards. It's amazing what you can find with a little research.

http://www.defensemedianetwork.com/stories/hair-has-long-and-short-history-in-armed-forces/

Hair Has Long and Short History in U.S. Armed Forces | Defense Media Network

A history of hair and facial hair in the U.S. military.

Response by PV2 Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 13 at 2016 8:28 AM

PV2 Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 13 Apr 2016 08:28:19 -0400

I'm sorry but I'm cracking up at all of these guys talking about women with mustaches made me think of Goonie Goo Goo. LOL

Response by SrA Lauren Kresse made Apr 13 at 2016 8:43 AM

SrA Lauren Kresse — Wed, 13 Apr 2016 08:43:30 -0400

I have very long hair and I keep it slicked in a bun and I don't wear makeup at work. I'm missing your argument.... If you want to grow your hair out, shave your legs and wear lipstick go ahead! I have a feeling when you do, you might be treated slightly different. And yes as a woman I would like to be an equal, but until you as men can put yourselves in our shoes for one minute and see how hard some of us have to work just to stand side by side next to you, you have no argument. When you can grow a human being and push something the size of a watermelon out of your body then your equal to us! It goes both ways!

Response by COL Mikel J. Burroughs made Apr 13 at 2016 8:56 AM

COL Mikel J. Burroughs — Wed, 13 Apr 2016 08:56:56 -0400

SSG Brian Marshall I currently believe the standards that are set seem to be working fine - just my opinion. The other point, is each command needs to make sure the standards are enforced properly by men and women. This comes down to solid leadership. I'm sure that there are some really great suggestions throughout this post and discussion, but I think the service branches have it right for now. There are foreign services that have more relaxed standards throughout the world for their men and women, but I think that are current standards set us apart in the world. By the way, even though I have beard now for the first time after 37 years of clean shaving I still wear the hair high and tight (free haircuts from my wife). Just my opinion Brian! Good post/discussion! Thanks

Response by SSgt Nicolas Favela made Apr 13 at 2016 9:48 AM

SSgt Nicolas Favela — Wed, 13 Apr 2016 09:48:59 -0400

So should women have to follow men's standards or men woman's? The way I see it men's hair standards are easy. Women have more standards in the hair department than men. Who would want that? You don't get to show off your hair in uniform it's eather cut close or in a bun and let's be honest how professional would it look to see a male walking around in full service dress with a man bun? Veep it as it is.

Response by SrA Edward Vong made Apr 13 at 2016 10:10 AM

SrA Edward Vong — Wed, 13 Apr 2016 10:10:06 -0400

When it comes to standards, the military views what is considered the social norms.

This applies to civilian culture as well. In a business setting, we usually wear business casual. For men, that usually means a button shirt, with some type of dress pants and dress shows. Women are a little bit more open to what they can wear. I try to break into the gray area a little bit more with dress jeans, and sweaters, sometimes having my shirts not tucked. Because I have a good work ethic and look presentable, no one cares.

While serving, I also kept my hair pretty long (but in regs). Leadership didn't like the way it looked, but I always argued that it was in regs. The only thing they can bring up is faddish, however so did many of the other troops that served with me.

Response by CPT Joseph K Murdock made Apr 13 at 2016 1:20 PM

CPT Joseph K Murdock — Wed, 13 Apr 2016 13:20:52 -0400

We don't look sexy in a hair bun.

Response by PO1 Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 13 at 2016 3:27 PM

PO1 Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 13 Apr 2016 15:27:39 -0400

Ya know, I don't know why. Honestly I think guys with a fade, or military cut (being in regs) is sharp looking; I don't like how guys hair can touch their ears or is disheveled and have facial hair (the ones don't have legit reasons to not shave or just lazy). Females can have short hair or long hair; we can't style it (fad styles) or color with a vibrant and not appropriate shade (orange or pink doesn't look all that good).

I just think it's just the military history of it all. Why fix something that isn't broken? Coming back to the females, I think that we get away with too much stuff with regards to hair styles and ways to wear it.

It's usually the fight of the woman wanting to be equal with a man, not the other way around. But you do have a point.

Response by TSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 13 at 2016 5:56 PM

TSgt Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 13 Apr 2016 17:56:17 -0400

It looks unprofessional.

Response by COL Charles Williams made Apr 13 at 2016 10:39 PM

COL Charles Williams — Wed, 13 Apr 2016 22:39:27 -0400

Good question... double standard it is.

Response by PO3 Taylor Wilkening made Apr 14 at 2016 12:35 PM

PO3 Taylor Wilkening — Thu, 14 Apr 2016 12:35:41 -0400

The battle bro abides..

Response by SGT Alicia Brenneis made Apr 14 at 2016 1:22 PM

SGT Alicia Brenneis — Thu, 14 Apr 2016 13:22:36 -0400

I'll be honest, I think your question would have been better without the "seeing that women are equal to men now" comment. It's a good question but that comment made it sound snide. Women are not allowed to shave their heads so as to not be mistaken for a male. Some units do not push the issue but it is still a regulation. Long hair is a pain in the assaults. It interferes with the kevlar and someone is always telling you to fix it. Headgear on and off all day pulls it out or gives it a messy appearance. Someone is always questioning if it is within regulation by color, length, the way you chose to pin it back that day and the color of your hair tie. "Your hair is brown but your hair tie is black... no". males want this added annoyance.... ok then.

Response by TSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 14 at 2016 1:37 PM

TSgt Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 14 Apr 2016 13:37:22 -0400

I am just waiting for the day someone goes to take their PT test and tells the technician that he identifies as a woman. When he is told he cant do it, I hope he makes a huge blowup due to his gender identity being marginalized. Get the media and Congress.... I know a guy that wants to do it! So to watch a 6'4", black, gay man, who played college football, do this, will make me laugh for years to come. While this may not be politically correct or somewhat offensive, the pendulum is starting to swing back to the other end, and not the way people thought it would. Get ready, all the things that went one way, will not have to be allowed the other way.

Response by SPC John Taylor made Apr 14 at 2016 1:56 PM

SPC John Taylor — Thu, 14 Apr 2016 13:56:14 -0400

They want everything to be dress right dress they do get some leniency towards how exactly you have your hair but they trying keep it as uniform as possible. The military is not a place where you can make it like the rest the world it is a opportunity to protect your country and standard should be met through discipline. If we look away from standards on little things like hair who's to say we will have things to help our discipline on a daily basis. They took boot shining away (not that I'm complaining) But will the discipline stay.

Response by SGT William Howell made Apr 14 at 2016 2:15 PM

SGT William Howell — Thu, 14 Apr 2016 14:15:29 -0400

Because if you had a ponytail you would be in the Hippy Scouts.

Response by SSG John Jensen made Apr 14 at 2016 2:45 PM

SSG John Jensen — Thu, 14 Apr 2016 14:45:38 -0400

the europeans that I saw in Iraq were there for nation building and had left their NBC masks at home - the Hungarians had wild muttton chops, the spanish foreign legion troops had beards that made them look like refugees from a ZZ Top album cover, and I told my 1SG (an old cowboy) that if he saw the mustache on the Polish Sgt Maj, that he would defect in a heartbeat

Response by Capt Rachelle Crespo made Apr 14 at 2016 2:53 PM

Capt Rachelle Crespo — Thu, 14 Apr 2016 14:53:54 -0400

I have to agree that the "seeing that woman [women] are equal to men now!" comment is a bit off-putting, but I don't know your intent behind it.

I think the requirement for men to keep their hair short is based on the military's historic concern with public perception. As other people noted, many people view men with long hair negatively. That's just one hypothesis, it could just be the military's lingering stereotypes. As many people also mentioned long hair can be difficult to manage in the field. Personally, I think men should be allowed to have long hair. If they want to deal with the proper standards they have every right to in my book. The upholding of those standards is a completely different issue that some people have mentioned. I know the Air Force and Army are very different but it might be a pervasive issue: some people are gung-ho about upholding standards and some people just don't care. Maybe if the Army has an office of uniform standards you should present your question to them?

Response by SPC Marcus DeMatos made Apr 14 at 2016 2:55 PM

SPC Marcus DeMatos — Thu, 14 Apr 2016 14:55:45 -0400

There is a point to be made that equality ... i.e. = ... points both ways. You don't have to be misogynistic or a feminist to have the common sense to know that genders are not the same, hence aren't equal anymore than individuals of either gender are automatically equal to each other. If the military is going to be used for social engineering then it is time to be scientific and say equality means the same. And if females can meet the same standards and work under the same guidelines, then I have zero reason to do anything except acknowledge their contribution. But if as we know, that 99% of the population aren't capable of fulfilling the roles exactly equal, then we should stop pretending that they are. Women deserve the respect to know that they are given different treatment because of the uniqueness of their gender, not because they are being seen as weaker in comparison.

Response by SSgt Christopher Brose made Apr 14 at 2016 4:02 PM

SSgt Christopher Brose — Thu, 14 Apr 2016 16:02:11 -0400

Shave them all. Bald is beautiful.

(Plus it's hygienic, and there's no ambiguity about standards.)

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 14 at 2016 4:12 PM

LTC Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 14 Apr 2016 16:12:26 -0400

Or, should women in the military be required to have short hair?

Response by PO3 David Davis made Apr 14 at 2016 4:51 PM

PO3 David Davis — Thu, 14 Apr 2016 16:51:14 -0400

No such thing as equal in the Military. Cut that hair high and tight.

Response by CSM Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 14 at 2016 5:12 PM

CSM Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 14 Apr 2016 17:12:40 -0400

Pretty soon you will be able to pick and chose which bathroom you want to use so I'm all for long hair and beards.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 14 at 2016 5:58 PM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 14 Apr 2016 17:58:26 -0400

It seems that, collectively, women want to have their cake and eat it too. They want to be equal in some areas but not in others.

Having said that, the hair example is really reaching in that argument. The military tents to favor a more conservative image e.g. men with short hair and women with long hair. I see no issue with that.

Of the many discussions about the opening of combat arms schools and jobs to women, I will say this. I think that there are allot of women who are going to ranger school, becoming an infantryman or an artilleryman just to feel special that they are the first or among the first. That is the wrong answer. I'm not in any of those fields but, like anything else in life, one should pursue a field because they have a true desire to do it--not because it's going to grant them 15 minutes of fame because they will be the first left handed, green eye, blonde haired ranger. No one is going to care tomorrow if a woman graduated from ranger school or infantry school today. All that anyone is going to care about is whether that Soldier can do her job. If they can, then good on them, but I have a lot of doubt that anyone, male or female will be successful at anything if they have ulterior motives.

Response by Lt Col Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 14 at 2016 6:01 PM

Lt Col Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 14 Apr 2016 18:01:03 -0400

Seems logical. If we're going to have gender neutral standards for some things, there should be gender neutral standards for all things... unless it's a man bun, then the answer is no.

Response by SSG Brian Marshall made Apr 14 at 2016 6:44 PM

SSG Brian Marshall — Thu, 14 Apr 2016 18:44:45 -0400

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 14 at 2016 7:51 PM

CPT Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 14 Apr 2016 19:51:56 -0400

When men are able to grow hippie hair does that mean I can finally dye my hair blond?

Response by SSG Dereck Davis made Apr 14 at 2016 8:09 PM

SSG Dereck Davis — Thu, 14 Apr 2016 20:09:05 -0400

I was waiting for this. The floodgates have been opened. Nothing can stop the wave of change that is coming. If I liked popcorn, I would have a bucket right now to watch the show that is unfolding before us all.

Response by LCpl Jim Pleace made Apr 14 at 2016 8:12 PM

LCpl Jim Pleace — Thu, 14 Apr 2016 20:12:44 -0400

I have to assume you are trolling or just bored. You know damn well why it's the case

Response by TSgt Marco McDowell made Apr 14 at 2016 8:55 PM

TSgt Marco McDowell — Thu, 14 Apr 2016 20:55:09 -0400

I'm not well versed on Army grooming standards but across the branches they seem to be similar, give or take a few centimeters or inches...and a iron, but why not look at how Navy Corpsmen who attach to Marine Corps units get to choose between staying Navy reg or going Marine reg. First time I saw it I was a boot Pvt and saw a Doc wearing our Charlies. I thought I had completely missed a rank in the structure and was lost until someone told me "Doc went Marine regs, so he follows our grooming standards and such". Maybe particular specialties should make a blanket reg that all personnel will have hair at XX length be it for hygiene or safety. Sometimes you gotta meet half way to get a mission done.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 14 at 2016 9:19 PM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 14 Apr 2016 21:19:26 -0400

As far as i can see we will be coming to that phase, so as not to offend any gender neutral persons that prefer to be recognized at the other gender

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 14 at 2016 9:32 PM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 14 Apr 2016 21:32:04 -0400

More hypocrisy and double standards from the current U.S. military establishment...

Response by CW4 Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 14 at 2016 10:25 PM

CW4 Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 14 Apr 2016 22:25:31 -0400

I believe we should take a closer look at Isreal's playbook on men and women serving. They seem to be a little closer than we are in what right looks in respect to standards. Granted they fight to be free daily.

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 14 at 2016 10:28 PM

MSG Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 14 Apr 2016 22:28:25 -0400

I'm not a fan of the man bun and don't think a lot of men in the service are either, let it be

Response by PO3 Chris Scheide made Apr 14 at 2016 10:45 PM

PO3 Chris Scheide — Thu, 14 Apr 2016 22:45:37 -0400

There isn't enough time in the day for everyone to have long hair. Imagine the lines in the head!

Response by MSgt Darren VanDerwilt made Apr 15 at 2016 12:39 AM

MSgt Darren VanDerwilt — Fri, 15 Apr 2016 00:39:40 -0400

Response by PO2 Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 15 at 2016 3:33 AM

PO2 Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 15 Apr 2016 03:33:00 -0400

I'm with you, SSG. Bring on the man-buns!

Just kidding. Please don't.

Response by SSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 15 at 2016 3:35 AM

SSgt Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 15 Apr 2016 03:35:03 -0400

I've seen a young female Marine feel the same way, so she went out and got a high and tight... The following day, she received a negative counseling for being out of regs.

Response by MSgt Wayne Morris made Apr 15 at 2016 6:56 AM

MSgt Wayne Morris — Fri, 15 Apr 2016 06:56:33 -0400

As the wheel revolves again. AD had this discussion in the late 60's, early 70's when the excuse was it would be dangerous on the flight line and such yet today women crew chiefs are a dime a dozen. Besides, from what I have seen everyone want to look like a Jarhead today anyway.

Response by PFC Derek Friedman made Apr 15 at 2016 7:14 AM

PFC Derek Friedman — Fri, 15 Apr 2016 07:14:36 -0400

Because then we might end up like this guy. He's totally out of regs.

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 15 at 2016 9:37 AM

LTC Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 15 Apr 2016 09:37:40 -0400

So who do you think is preventing men from having longer hair in the Army--liberal male and female and minority officers, or the good ole white male conservative generals?

Maybe since we've gone back to wearing the blue uniform all the time like these guys, we could go back to their hair length. Seems like they managed to figure out how to maintain hygiene in the field.

Response by PO3 David Fields made Apr 15 at 2016 8:15 PM

PO3 David Fields — Fri, 15 Apr 2016 20:15:24 -0400

There are a lot of males who sound butt hurt, last time I checked males make the rules in the military, if there is a regulation that a man hasn't written, I'd like to see it. Men's rights, this country has been about men's rights for centuries. Women will have to meet the same standards as men for direct combat mos's/rates. If your big problem is long hair, just think about how many women are sexually abused/assaulted in the military, if you wan't to be equal, put up with that for a while. Why are(were) rapes pushed under the rug, and the women punished. Take a look at the history and then decide if it's worth being mad about hair length, or some other trivial thing.

Response by SSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 15 at 2016 9:07 PM

SSgt Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 15 Apr 2016 21:07:32 -0400

That's because women aren't fighting for gender equality. They're fighting for gender dominance. They want all the things men have, but are for the most part unable to complete the physical labor required to achieve those goals.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 15 at 2016 9:14 PM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 15 Apr 2016 21:14:57 -0400

I'm all for female hair grooming standards matching that of males and not taking the opposite approach whining about why males can't look unprofessional. We should be in the business of trying to improve standards, not sabotaging them out of spite.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 17 at 2016 8:09 AM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 17 Apr 2016 08:09:50 -0400

I'm with you SSG Brian !

Response by SGT Charles Cameron made Apr 18 at 2016 1:54 PM

SGT Charles Cameron — Mon, 18 Apr 2016 13:54:43 -0400

Why...? Women tend to be a little "cleaner". I served with a man, who had to be escorted under armed guard, just to take a shower ! This "old boy" never cleaned his clothes either. He would hang them up, dry them out &use them again...and again. I could tell more stories, but you get the picture.

Response by PFC Joseph . Sheffield made Apr 19 at 2016 4:42 PM

PFC Joseph . Sheffield — Tue, 19 Apr 2016 16:42:34 -0400

Ssg. Brian you know when I was in they took off all our hair while in basic in 1969 we don't have women. In lucky us but you know there has all ways been a difference between men an women's hair I believe man should have short hair and women should have short hair in military I think women in military service look great lol!!

Response by SGT Charles Cameron made Apr 20 at 2016 4:51 PM

SGT Charles Cameron — Wed, 20 Apr 2016 16:51:52 -0400

SSG Brian;
I do agree, women can get as "funky" as men. But from what I've seen &/or experienced, dirtiness sometimes goes along with their duty & their MOS. Both, men & women get "nasty" sometimes ...in combat, or where there are poor opportunities to clean-up on a daily basis, the men & women I have had the pleasure to meet & serve with...the ladies tend to be a little better groomed. I dealt with a lot of troops rotating to & from 'Nam. The Marines were always "strack". Air Force were neat & tidy, the Navy were clean & white. The troops coming home from the bush were just that..."from the bush". Many times they were plucked-up and sent home "just as they were"...sometimes with a little clean-up. Uniforms were borrowed or miss-fitted. But remember, that was in the 70's. We have come along a way since then. As for hair length...? I say, for myself, keep it short for the men...it just "looks good", show pride. A little longer, under your cover...the ends stick out and looks "un-kept". I've had all lengths, & I surprise myself...I kinda "like it short"...easier to keep clean. For the ladies, it adds to their looks...even in BDU's or their dress uniforms.
I found, that when I traveled in uniform, if I hadn't shaved, or dressed neatly...hair included, I tended to be a little "self-conscious" about my appearance, & felt that others could sense it too.

Response by PO3 David Fields made Apr 28 at 2016 8:27 PM

PO3 David Fields — Thu, 28 Apr 2016 20:27:34 -0400

Because men have made that rule, and the men who made that rule wanted to see women as nurses and nothing more. As men we can't keep blaming women for rules and reg's that seem to favor females. Just realize that men made those regulations.

Response by TSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 1 at 2016 8:41 PM

TSgt Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 01 Jun 2016 20:41:44 -0400

In that case women should be able to shaved their heads too then. Which we can't! Not that I would want to.

Response by SGT Laura Delgadillo made Jun 2 at 2016 10:19 AM

SGT Laura Delgadillo — Thu, 02 Jun 2016 10:19:46 -0400

I like how you changed your profile picture. Lol

Response by Capt Tom Brown made Jun 2 at 2016 11:03 AM

Capt Tom Brown — Thu, 02 Jun 2016 11:03:03 -0400

Couldn't help but notice the two women who completed Ranger School both had very short haircuts. Wondering if that was by choice or did they conform to Ranger regulations for trainees? At any rate in the infantry/combat arms living in the field for months at a time a person only tends to get grungier and grungier, esp the hair. Short hair in the field at least, can be a very useful expedient to facilitate good personal hygiene. When I tried to grow back a full head of hair after a number of years, I found it wasn't there any longer.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 2 at 2016 3:22 PM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 02 Jun 2016 15:22:16 -0400

The sad thing is that we have already relaxed the standards in the army. We have officers who walk around with hands in their pockets. People of higher ranks can skip PT. And people already have their hair out of regs. Haircuts have to be Tapered according to the regs. Tapered means "following the contour of the head". I see so many people who have naturally square heads apparently.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 3 at 2016 4:05 PM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 03 Jun 2016 16:05:53 -0400

http://cdn.timesofisrael.com/uploads/2013/05/F130526MA081-e [login to see] 64.jpg
Israeli Army is changing hair policy on beards.

F130526MA081-e1369645543264.jpg

4Û¶òæ_VÛòíû¿íW"ºqkÑÃ%Íµ§æhÿ ÚAá?HÕ`ÔÓöî['ÿ eVÄKÞÙ2ä§ðÄï5+]ÅSjWIâ+oHÛcvò/ûÕ'þYëÑÍxúW1Æß»¶EÜÕæ7umô¶}BÛNÝÕÑiÿ üq·íLìª»¿u"îRí%K%XòÆ§)ôwþi6Cq/ú

Response by CPT Pedro Meza made Jun 3 at 2016 6:35 PM

CPT Pedro Meza — Fri, 03 Jun 2016 18:35:55 -0400

Cause in the middle east it Men Love Thursday, and those misguided religious idiots that we fight fear women in uniform, so the service makes it easier to distinguish who they should fear and who they can druel over..

Response by Sgt Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 3 at 2016 10:15 PM

Sgt Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 03 Jun 2016 22:15:21 -0400

This question doesn't interest me in the slightest, but I have to say that is a pretty above-par lookinggroup of wooks.

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 4 at 2016 7:48 AM

SPC Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 04 Jun 2016 07:48:36 -0400

I mean it only makes sense if your on that whole gender equality train.

Response by SSG James Stodola made Jun 5 at 2016 9:15 AM

SSG James Stodola — Sun, 05 Jun 2016 09:15:46 -0400

I cannot even believe that this is a question or much less a topic of discussion. There are standards for a reason, and NO, not everyone has to be EQUAL, that is a myth in the military. What I am seeing here is the "NEW" military whiners bringing up useless and non-issue items to whine about. Long hair on men, I'm sure at some point someone will bring up the "other nations military" argument, which if course is invalid because we are the Untied States military, not other nations. We don't care what the grooming standards of other nations military forces are. Reason #1; I am pretty sure that any of you who have been in close quarters fighting, or even hand to hand with the enemy, are really happy you did not have long hair for the enemy to grab hold of during this battle, this is why we don't have long hair. Reason #2; Those of you who have had to fit additional gear other than helmets would have found it to be a bit difficult with with this extra unneeded hair. Reason #3; Someone mentioned professionalism in this mass of comments, even with clear cut standards it would be unprofessional looking at best. Hygiene is another reason, why do you think many women in the field environment keep their hair short??? This folks is our new age military whining about nonsense instead of focusing on the real issues that face them today.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 5 at 2016 11:07 AM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 05 Jun 2016 11:07:18 -0400

Here is one better. If Sikh Soldiers can have full beards why can't I?