Why do some lower enlisted Soldiers dwell in their pay grade while some promote ahead of them?

2016-02-18T17:55:00-05:00

When I got to my unit I recieved a four month waiver to get PV2 and then another early promotion to PFC and looking at SPC around fall and after my E4 promotion I'm being sent to WLC for SGT. However I know some E-1s who have still yet to be promoted to E2 and it is past their automatic promotion date. My question is, why do some units refuse to promote privates and others (like mine) get them the hell away from the private title?

Response by MAJ Ken Landgren made Feb 18 at 2016 5:56 PM

2016-02-18T17:56:31-05:00

Its called bad leadership, lack of caring, ineffiency, and failing to do a job right.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 18 at 2016 6:03 PM

2016-02-18T18:03:20-05:00

There are also the cases on insubordinate privates. Not saying that is the case, and for the most part, it is mainly what MAJ Ken Landgren said, lack of leadership.

Response by SFC Kenneth Hunnell made Feb 18 at 2016 6:05 PM

2016-02-18T18:05:51-05:00

Apparently you are doing the right thing.
Showing up on time, right uniform, passing the APFT.
If you can't do that, you would be a private for a long time..
Remember promotions are not automatic, you still have to do your part.
Right place
Right time
Right uniform
To easy

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 18 at 2016 6:07 PM

2016-02-18T18:07:36-05:00

It's not a lack of leadership, except for the guys who haven't received their automatic promotion yet. They will still get promoted and receive their back pay though. There are only so many waivers available within a unit. On top of that, depending on the unit you are in, some MOS's will arrive with a year and a half in the Army, others with less than six months.
Even with a waiver there is a minimum time requirement before being promoted to specialist.

Response by SGT Frank Leonardo made Feb 18 at 2016 6:14 PM

2016-02-18T18:14:15-05:00

If you are doing the right thing and your leadership has noticed I would say maybe that is the cause.

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 18 at 2016 6:17 PM

2016-02-18T18:17:42-05:00

I have seen some cases were promotions should have been faster but I have also seen some to where a soldier was a PVT well beyond the time required to promote. Most of the time it was due to the soldier. They are the ones that are responsible for their career. I have a feeling that that soldier may have failed an APFT or be flagged. I can't really say that I have seen a squared away soldier stuck at a rank longer than they should be promoted.

Response by BG David Fleming III made Feb 18 at 2016 7:05 PM

2016-02-18T19:05:48-05:00

The door of opportunity never slams open!

Response by SGT Jerrold Pesz made Feb 18 at 2016 7:06 PM

2016-02-18T19:06:40-05:00

While in some cases it may be the unit I think that in most cases it is the soldier. I spent almost my entire time in service with the same brigade at Ft. Jackson and we had a bunch of people (including me) make E5 in less than 2 years. We also had people who were on their second enlistment who were still PFCs. My unit promoted everybody who busted ass the first day that they were eligible. Those who sat on their asses had a far different experience. I actually knew one person who managed to still be an E2 when he got out. You sort of got what you deserved.

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 18 at 2016 7:21 PM

2016-02-18T19:21:32-05:00

Are these E-1s doing the wrong thing and getting in trouble? failing their APFT and/or HT/WT?

Response by CPT Mark Gonzalez made Feb 18 at 2016 7:39 PM

2016-02-18T19:39:23-05:00

It is complacency. The army is an amazing system of social mobility and if you work hard you can progress reasonably quickly. However, if you are lazy and barely get by you'll run into RCP. Complacent Soldiers have a place as long as they perform their duties, but work hard and leave them in your dust.

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 18 at 2016 8:20 PM

2016-02-18T20:20:07-05:00

There are three possible answers to this situation.

1. Advancement are automatic from E1 through E4 and that is the system. So the first that may have failed is the auto advancement system. Those Soldiers may have slipped through the cracks.
2. The first Line leader are not taking the time to know their Soldiers, specifically their advancement dates. and when they should be eligible for the next rank.
3. The Soldiers themselves, if they are Reservist or National Guard then maybe their performance are UNSAT and does not deserving of an advancement to the next rank (i.e... missing drills, failing apft, flags for other reasons),

Response by CSM William Payne made Feb 18 at 2016 8:43 PM

2016-02-18T20:43:32-05:00

In automatic promotions action has to be taken to PREVENT a Soldier from getting promoted, otherwise it happens. Soldiers usually are aware if they've done something to keep from being promoted or not. That being said, the system is not fool prove. There are systems and administrative reasons why a Soldier may not get picked up for promotion. Also if the Soldier was ever flagged for some reason, failing height and weight or APFT for example, some units are more diligent than others to remove the flag after the issue in question has been corrected.

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 18 at 2016 8:46 PM

2016-02-18T20:46:31-05:00

You're on the right track. Talk to your peers you went to basic training with and give them the right tools and tips so that they can succeed like you

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 18 at 2016 9:53 PM

2016-02-18T21:53:37-05:00

Some folks will just do minimum time and then finish in the IRR while they use their GI Bill. I was like that during my active duty time. I enlisted for the minimum time I could just to receive educational benefits. Unfortunately, I did not listen to my leadership. I still went to (WLC) knowing that I was getting out, my CO told me many times that I was ideal for Green to Gold program. But I had my own agenda.

17 years later I enlisted into the Reserve and still have time to make it to at least E8 if I don't go Warrant. Often I look back and wonder where I would be if I had stayed in or gone Officer

Response by SGT(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 19 at 2016 1:37 AM

2016-02-19T01:37:23-05:00

Honestly, some soldiers are not interested in progression. Similarly, the same soldiers are not interested in becoming more skilled and well rounded soldiers. Also, many of them do not want to step out of their comfort zones and do things other than what is requiredof them. It's sad, but true.

Response by CSM Michael Poll made Feb 19 at 2016 9:16 AM

2016-02-19T09:16:17-05:00

There could be other reasons, have the passed their APFT of body fat, have they been receiving unsatisfactory performance by not showing up to drill, have they missed schools, appointments etc. There could be many circumstances why someone is not getting promoted. If it is lack of leadership, shame on the team, squad leader, Platoon Sergeant and 1SG for allowing these Soldiers to go around without promotion. The simple fix is to back date the promotion and the Soldier will receive back pay. I would have to see each individual case in order to make and educated synopsis on why. I would have them request an open door with the 1SG or talk to their PSG to find out why.

Response by LCDR Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 19 at 2016 9:30 AM

2016-02-19T09:30:18-05:00

Some people are good at their jobs, and others suck. It really is quite simple.

Response by MAJ Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 19 at 2016 9:33 AM

2016-02-19T09:33:18-05:00

Those Privates probably can't pass their PT test or are otherwise flagged. Up to E4 its just an automatic advancement, not a promotion. They just have to remind S1. But that isn't the case, they are surely flagged.

Response by CSM Carlson C. made Feb 19 at 2016 10:48 AM

2016-02-19T10:48:31-05:00

I'll tell you this, the door opens and closes both ways. Some times you have awesome Soldiers that want to progress and you have lackluster leaders that don't do their part and drop the ball on promotions. On the other side of the coin, you have Soldiers that fail APFT, do not follow through on maintaining their medical and dental readiness, military education, fail to become MOSQ'd, have excuses for going to schools.... I had a SGT/E-5 a couple years back that was about to retire... 20 years and never made it past E-5.... When I got to the reserve unit from active duty, I was his Platoon SGT and I wanted him to progress, but his response was he didn't want the responsibility... Absolute waste. I had a commander that blatantly stalled a warrant officer packet that i submitted. So it is easy to blame leadership, it is easy to blame the Soldier. It's usually a combination of the two and the truth lays somewhere in the middle. So troop, I would tell you continue leaning forward and if you can help some of your brothers and sisters along the way, do so, because contrary to popular belief, we are ALL leaders. You can also make a difference by speaking up and setting an outstanding example.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 19 at 2016 2:22 PM

2016-02-19T14:22:59-05:00

Some may have red flagged for pt or medical

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 19 at 2016 4:10 PM

2016-02-19T16:10:46-05:00

You may not know the whole story. If a SM is flagged for nay reason the command can stop any automatic promotions. If you have battles that are wondering why you are getting promoted and they aren't just tell them to take a long look in the mirror and see if they are truly deserving of promotion. If they aren't' living up to the expectations then they shouldn't be promoted just because its supposed to be automatic. But if they have been meeting the standards then they need to address it with their first line leader and get an explanation why.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 19 at 2016 5:55 PM

2016-02-19T17:55:38-05:00

For future reference it's Junior Enlisted.Its nots what's on your chest that makes you a leader,it's your positive actions,your integrity,and loyalty to those around you.Dont get caught up in the "I need the get promoted to be come better issue".It will come .

Response by PO3 David Fries made Feb 20 at 2016 6:47 AM

2016-02-20T06:47:20-05:00

Just as in the civilian world, there are over and under achievers. Why an underachiever would join in the first place is beyond me, but it is the way of people. It can also be a lack of knowledge. I remember not knowing how the transition from E2 to E3 worked (I didn't have to worry about E1 to E2 as I was meritoriously promoted in RT).

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 22 at 2016 4:23 PM

2016-02-22T16:23:17-05:00

Most are APFT failures. Others are just lazy and not motivated. That's it.

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 22 at 2016 4:35 PM

2016-02-22T16:35:09-05:00

Poor leadership, final answer. Unless my Soldiers are flagged when it is time, promotion is automatic. I usually craft up a 4187 for them to perm in case they need it later. I usually give the 1SG a chance to do the right thing, but won't wait long for them.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 23 at 2016 11:36 PM

2016-02-23T23:36:01-05:00

Some are high speed, some are not. If you were selected to receive a waiver to promotion os because you were likely more deserving. Also, some MOS have fewer waivers depending on the type and size of the organization. I personally never had waivers for ranks 1-4 because i was one of two 42L in my company, and I worked in the PAC! But 2-4 is automatic in 6-12- and 24 month intervals. Also time in grade, time in service is a consideration when selecting people for waivers. Honestly the real test, is how motivated you are to make 5, 6, 7, 8 and 9. :)

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 24 at 2016 9:31 AM

2016-02-24T09:31:35-05:00

It all depends upon the Chain of Command and the individual themselves. If that PVT is past his automatic promotion time, but was not promoted, it is probably because his CoC thinks he has not earned it. Also, something that happened a lot at my old unit, he may be promoted on paper, but his CoC restricts him from wearing the rank (this is not technically authorized, but it does happen). And some units want to square you away and promote you quickly so that you can move on to bigger and better things.

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 26 at 2016 11:17 PM

2016-03-26T23:17:20-04:00

You dont know what you dont know. It is possible that the Soldier is flagged and not eligible for promotion.