Why is building a unit so complicated?

PV2 Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 18 Jun 2014 19:35:06 -0400

Im a 92 Yankee in a unit thats being built currently stand up is scheduled sometime in September or October, Ive worked 18 days straight way later than we are supposed too... Why is it so complicated to set up a unit? And why do they only had two 92 yankees on the job when they really need 4-5 to make it easier???

Response by SSG David Hollingshead made Jun 18 at 2014 7:44 PM

SSG David Hollingshead — Wed, 18 Jun 2014 19:44:14 -0400

Complicated is relative. there is a right way and if you do it right its not complicated just tedious.

Response by SFC Scott O. made Jun 18 at 2014 11:13 PM

SFC Scott O. — Wed, 18 Jun 2014 23:13:08 -0400

Are you seriously complaining about 18 straight days way later than you are supposed to. You do realize you joined the Army and not the Boy Scouts correct. We are soldiers 24 hours a day, 7 Days a week. This is something you will have to come to realize and get used to. Just hold on tight and embrace the SUCK.

Response by SGT(P) Harry Clyde Jr. made Mar 10 at 2015 11:49 AM

SGT(P) Harry Clyde Jr. — Tue, 10 Mar 2015 11:49:15 -0400

Welcome to the MOS of the overworked, overwhelmed, underappreciated, understaffed and everything is your fault.
There will be times where you will be working a lot of extra hours and sometimes staying in your office overnight due to deadlines, last minute requirements known by the requestor a week prior but asks hours before the need then doesnt need it after all. Extra duties such as armorer and hazmat. People who want stuff but not want to sign for it or pay when its lost. I could go on.
The key is that as a new young private ask for guidance from your supply sergeant, read the regs, ask your S4 for guidance as well as your fellow 92s. If you are the Supply Sergeant then definately use your resources and take advantage of being in the position at your rank, it will benifit you. I was put in that position in Korea just out of school after 4 years as an artilleryman. Learned the most in that position early than from any supply sergeant. There will be times where the TDA/MTOE says your supposed to have 3 people in the offfice but you only have yourself and it can stay like that for years due to shortages. Ive been there more than once both active and civilian.
As for unit standup, theres more to it than whats in your lane, just roll with it.
As for working days/weeks with no breaks, thats the Army. Suppply guys will work everyday to included overnight missions and late nights during rotations that last up to a month at the training centers i.e. JRTC, CMTC. Also real world deployments. Change of commands will cause long days and nights as well.
As for the wife. She will get frustrated, mine still does even though im retired army and now work as a supply tech as a civilian for the army. She may get used to it, she may not and may or may not ever understand how and what the job entails. If shmakes friends easily , this will relieve some of the stress. Supporting you and you her are the key here.
Lastly keep in mind that you arwe in a field that key when it comes to unit support. You bring the chow and supplies to the field and garrison. Training can stop without it, missions can haltYou are the custodian of the commanders hand receipts for property. Those using that property will at times be uncomfortable to approach you if they have damaged or lost that gear. He the commander, relies on you for his bottom line support. If you fail or he fails to suppport you then he has failed as leader. There is a power that other MOSs dont have along with some Autonomy even at a ower rank. Never lose your integrity.
Finally. You are in field that with time and experience will allow you to get a job even with little civilian education.
Just roll with it.

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 10 at 2015 12:17 PM

CPT Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 10 Mar 2015 12:17:34 -0400

PV2 Private RallyPoint Member, although I have never stood-up a unit, I was the commander of the HHD, 83rd OD BN when we inactivated, so I might have a little insight on how these procedures work. Both standing-up and standing-down are not easy tasks. They are complicated to say the least. When we inactivated, I had one E-5 92Y, a 1SG 92Y, and a CW2 Property Book Officer working with two local national supply specialists. And we still wanted more. The amount of equipment to be laterally transfered, turned-in (in your case signed for), or DX'd is massive. The management of both property and personnel is a huge task. MTOEs and TDAs take months to adjust and require approval from several levels up. A close working relationship with your higher leadership and support from your adjacent units is essential. Towards the end, I only had 12 Soldiers available to move several million dollars worth of equipment and one S-1 NCO to manage the follow-on assignments for 12 Soldiers and five Officers. As the Commander, I was sometimes packing equipment myself while conducting daily inventories and tracking over 120 lateral transfers. The fact that we didn't lose any property I directly credit to my CW2 and Supply Sergeant, who regularly worked until 1800 (and sometimes weekends). The fact that my Soldiers got properly out-processed and made it to their follow-on assignments on time is directly credited to my S-1 NCO who also worked until 1900 some nights. Sometimes I was in my office at 2200 so I could speak with my branch manager about my next assignment (time zone differences). The thing with both standing-up and inactivating a unit is that it must be done the right way and you really only have one shot to do it properly without suffering from long-term ramifications. By the end, I was exhausted, my fiance was frustrated, and we both left a little jaded. But we did a good job and we did it right. Not one piece of propery was unaccounted for and not one Soldier had to sign a statement of charges. In both cases you will never have all the tools you want. Be it more Soldiers or equipment, it just won't happen for any number of reasons. Each one of my Soldiers had about 3 or 4 additional duties for the last 3 to 4 months. We all had to shoulder a bigger share of the burden. That is just the way it works. As a PV2, you just have to remember that you probably cannot see the whole picture from the perspective of the Company, Battalion, and Brigade Commanders. The situation and priorities will be changing for them on a daily (sometimes hourly) basis and every little change at those levels are amplified the further down the chain it goes. It isn't easy, but if it is done right, you should be proud of everything you will accomplish. Stay positive PV2 Kinder! If it was easy, everyone would be doing it.

Response by LTC Jason Mackay made Mar 10 at 2015 11:05 PM

LTC Jason Mackay — Tue, 10 Mar 2015 23:05:10 -0400

For years 92Y has been habitually at 75% fill Army wide. Many Companies are rolling at 50% (1 of 2). There are no extras.

Response by COL Charles Williams made Mar 11 at 2015 12:23 AM

COL Charles Williams — Wed, 11 Mar 2015 00:23:14 -0400

Making sausage is never easy.

Activating and Deactivating units is even harder, as the main part of this is property and property accountability. You signed on for a low density support MOS, that is also central to our success and failure. The Army is a 24/7 gig, or at least until the job is done. I hope you recruiter did not tell you this was 9-5, we had a union, or it would be easy. If it was easy, anyone would/could do it.

The number of supply spaces in your unit is determined by your MTOE or TDA... Usually that means a Supply NCO, and one or two assistants depending on the size of the unit. If you are a Bn or Bde... add a PBO and few more NCOs... You have a very important job, so don't take it lightly... and stop your bellyaching...

Welcome to the Army.

Response by MAJ Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 11 at 2015 12:33 AM

MAJ Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 11 Mar 2015 00:33:15 -0400

PV2 Private RallyPoint Member,

I'll tell you right now there are no set duty day hours. That is why you're paid a salary and not by the hour. While your wife may not like it, it is reality.

My wife was an AD Chemical Officer while I was in the ARNG. There were times we barely saw each other because she had to work the night shift during rotations. When we say things like "I will always place the mission first" or "Readily will I display the intestinal fortitude required to fight on to the Ranger objective and complete the mission" they're not just platitudes. Sometimes completing the mission requires some late nights and early mornings. In almost 9 years I can say I've rarely had all of the resources I wanted to complete a mission, whether it was personnel or equipment. Rising to the occasion is something that is expected of us as Soldiers.

Response by SFC Mark Merino made Mar 11 at 2015 12:40 AM

SFC Mark Merino — Wed, 11 Mar 2015 00:40:10 -0400

Good training.

Response by SGT Chris Quesenberry made Mar 11 at 2015 2:24 AM

SGT Chris Quesenberry — Wed, 11 Mar 2015 02:24:03 -0400

18 days is nothing man.....MTOE Units will always be understrength in terms of manpower. You have it maid, I am trying to come back in to the military and its nearly impossible. It will never be easy, but you have one of the easiest jobs.

Response by SFC Chris Crossley made Mar 11 at 2015 10:13 AM

SFC Chris Crossley — Wed, 11 Mar 2015 10:13:29 -0400

DOTMLPF Analysis... enough said.

Response by SGT Tyler G. made Mar 25 at 2015 12:49 AM

SGT Tyler G. — Wed, 25 Mar 2015 00:49:51 -0400

Welcome to the bureaucracy. You don't usually see it until you're in a leadership position, but there is a lot that go into just maintaining a unit, let alone setting one up.

The best thing you can do for yourself is to get used to long days, and just roll with it. They will happen many more times, no question. Remember that you don't see everything that is going on behind the scenes, and often times there are reasons behind things that don't seem to make sense.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 6 at 2015 9:08 PM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 06 Jun 2015 21:08:47 -0400

Kiddo, you'll be okay. Keep working your tail off (no whining), get it right, and when it's done you will have far more working experience than any of your peers; in some cases, NCOs.

I empathize with you, but I have no pity. Welcome to the Army Logistical Family. This is a good place to ask for tools of the trade, use us as a resource.

Response by MAJ Ken Landgren made Jun 6 at 2015 9:31 PM

MAJ Ken Landgren — Sat, 06 Jun 2015 21:31:00 -0400

They need the right personnel, equipment, weapons, vehicles, sections need to be defined, procedures must be in place between sections and the whole unit.

Response by SFC Mark Merino made Jun 6 at 2015 10:11 PM

SFC Mark Merino — Sat, 06 Jun 2015 22:11:22 -0400

This is great experience for you at this stage of your career. Getting to see big Army at work and everything it entails. I stood up 1-10 ATK (a trial unit of Kiowas-not used as recon) as well as 3-17 CAV. Both units were at Fort Drum in the mid-90's. We had to take them to CAT-B (4 month deployment to Fort Hood to be certified). Now, the Kiowa units are dropping like flies. A good friend is dropping off some of our acft for the boneyard here at Davis-Monthan on WED. He is standing down the units and talk about nightmares. The most comple units are mixed units include ground scouts, mixed with Apaches, Kiowas, and Blackhawks. Zoinks!

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 6 at 2015 11:20 PM

SPC Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 06 Jun 2015 23:20:27 -0400

"We, the underappreciated, have done so much, with so little, for so long, we are now qualified to do anything, with nothing, forever."
I did what you're doing in 2003 with the 470th MI BDE. We didn't get a supply NCO for months. We started with a captain, a SFC filling in an 1sg, a CW4 on loan from USARSO, and twenty-thirty CI agents and interrogators. We had to shut down our facilities in Puerto Rico and transfer everything to Ft Sam Houston, while conducting our direct mission supporting USARSO and deploying teams to south/central America, still taking takings from our parent unit, the 513th, to support the mission in Afghanistan and Iraq. It was not a happy time. I know two soldiers that volunteered to go provide interrogation support and ended up working at Abu Ghraib when all hell broke loose there. They still said they'd have gone instead of staying.

Response by SGT Hector Rojas, AIGA, SHA made Jun 7 at 2015 2:07 AM

SGT Hector Rojas, AIGA, SHA — Sun, 07 Jun 2015 02:07:26 -0400

PV2 Private RallyPoint Member , deployed to Afghanistan as build up team for an AH-64D unit. 6 days later our Advon team came in, 11 days later our first personnel flights started coming in (6 total), by the time my unit was all in theater, we (build up team) had our first 2 days off after 28 days. Working roughly 15 hour shifts. Under far worse conditions than you are going through right now.

War is not garrison but the point is, we were still separated from our families just as you are away from your wife.

I'm sure you have been married for a short time and you are both young, need to grow the relationship and all that, and it is too bad you were assigned to unit that is being stood up.

But it is what it is. It will end at some point.

What YOU can do for your marriage, is set some appointments with ACS for couples sessions, or talk to your Chaplain about a couples retreat, etc.

I'm certain your wife knew military life would take you away from her for periods of time, but no one knows how lonely it can be except her. So try to have her come in for lunch with you, even if it is for 30 minutes.

What many fail to realize is that senior leaders have been married for a while by the time they get to sand up a unit so those spouses are equipped to handle long absences...young soldiers with young marriages are not prepared for that yet.

To close, call her up through the day, have any chance to meet up and keep chugging along at work, you can be proud to be making $1.67 an hour defending your country, while a MacDonald's employee flipping burgers is making $15 an hour.