Why is it difficult for Reserves and National Guard to go active duty?

SPC Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 20 Nov 2016 17:54:00 -0500

Response by SFC George Smith made Nov 20 at 2016 6:59 PM

SFC George Smith — Sun, 20 Nov 2016 18:59:41 -0500

the standards may be different than they are used to...
when i went back on active duty, with Jump-pay, Pro-pay, BAS/ BAQ I was making almost 3 1/2 times what i was making as a Civilian...

Response by 1SG Al Brown made Nov 20 at 2016 8:18 PM

1SG Al Brown — Sun, 20 Nov 2016 20:18:03 -0500

An RC or NG commander has to release you, and the AD component has to accept you. Those planets can be difficult to align.

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 20 at 2016 9:12 PM

MSG Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 20 Nov 2016 21:12:46 -0500

It's not that it's difficult to go.........just that it's difficult to get everyone to sign where they need to when you need them to. So going isn't the hard part....it's getting released so you CAN go is the hard part.

Response by MAJ Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 21 at 2016 3:21 AM

MAJ Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 21 Nov 2016 03:21:45 -0500

It depends on the time and the needs of the Army. Right now the AD is full up with recruits, wait a year or two and I'm thinking they'll be recruiting again.

It's very, very difficult if you are in the NG, not so much in the RC as the dollars are all federal, so your State doesn't loose the money they spent on your training.

Response by Cpl Justin Goolsby made Nov 21 at 2016 7:11 AM

Cpl Justin Goolsby — Mon, 21 Nov 2016 07:11:34 -0500

Well the simple answer is we're in a drawdown military. You have to consider first that recruiters are constantly recruiting. Next people are either getting out or staying in. Some stay until their contract ends, and some get kicked out for multiple reasons. Now every year there is a magic number they have to hit. So if they need to kick more people out, they will. But if there aren't enough recruits to fill those spots, then that's where you get the reservist.

Response by PO1 Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 21 at 2016 7:50 AM

PO1 Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 21 Nov 2016 07:50:56 -0500

It can be several reasons. Maybe their job isn't available due to overmanning, not enough credientials, etc.

Response by SPC(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 21 at 2016 10:19 AM

SPC(P) Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 21 Nov 2016 10:19:58 -0500

More than likely that your MOS is over manned... For instance, I went to 3 recruiters asking if I can go active and they asked me "What is your MOS?" I told them, then they asked "Do you want to reclass?" I told them no, then they told me "Well you pretty much have to be homeless to get on Active"... I didn't believe it, but yeah... LOL

Response by SFC J Fullerton made Nov 21 at 2016 10:52 AM

SFC J Fullerton — Mon, 21 Nov 2016 10:52:57 -0500

Because they have you under contract, and letting you out of your contract hurts their manning numbers, and with the case of the state NG, a loss of the money they spent on training you. A lot of NG recruiters like to sell the "test drive" enlistment with the 17 yr old High school juniors who can do the split training while still in school, with the presumption that they can easily "switch" to active duty later if they want. I used to get a lot of NG kids fresh out of AIT walk in wanting to go active, only for them to find out that getting released was not easy. And when they did, their options were limited.

Response by SPC Erich Guenther made Nov 21 at 2016 10:49 PM

SPC Erich Guenther — Mon, 21 Nov 2016 22:49:34 -0500

OK, I have been out of service since 1987 but let me give you some quick advice on rank. If someone wrote their rank as PFC(P) in the Regular Army the person would be humiliated and ridiculed publicly. Maybe times have changed but just a tip for you if your really trying to go Active Duty you might think it is funny thing to do in the USAR but your going to be a real target if you do that on Active Duty in some units........based on my long ago past experience.

Response by 1SG Bill Farmerie made Nov 22 at 2016 1:12 PM

1SG Bill Farmerie — Tue, 22 Nov 2016 13:12:24 -0500

While I was on recruiting it had to do with NG units being part of an enhanced brigade. They had to keep their units at a certain manning level or lose out on money. I had one unit not part of an enhanced brigade, that would not release a soldier no matter what, unless I provided them a contract that they could put in. This soldier tried not going to drill for over a year and even missed AT to see if they would release him, but they marked all his absences as excused

Response by MAJ Daniel Buchholz made Nov 22 at 2016 2:54 PM

MAJ Daniel Buchholz — Tue, 22 Nov 2016 14:54:00 -0500

Think about it from the National Guard's perspective (and this is also my view as a Commander). The Guard has spent considerable amounts of our finite pool of federal training money to get that Soldier through Basic and AIT (we get a pool and it costs a lot, in excess of 100k for all that training, which doesn't get magically reallocated if you go Active). Then from my perspective as a Commander, when they recruit you they are recruiting you against an open slot on my roster, which cannot be overfilled (sometimes we are allowed to go over-strength for various reasons, but even then that is never more than 125%) and stays vacant until they are done training and on a drilling status (this is one big reason why when my Company has 46 authorized slots, I am lucky to have 30pax show up to any particular drill).

So my people are covering down on that slot until filled, do you think I am happy or even particularly willing to let them go until they have served out the term of your enlistment and we get some of the investment back as well as give the Soldiers who were covering that spot some relief?

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 22 at 2016 3:26 PM

SPC Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 22 Nov 2016 15:26:34 -0500

From my guys who are in the NG it's difficult because when your NG your paid for by the state and not the federal government. Therefore it's a huge waste of money for them to send you active from I've oticed for guard everything is based on funds. Idk why though

Response by SGM Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 23 at 2016 7:16 AM

SGM Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 23 Nov 2016 07:16:14 -0500

Supply and demand, the active component is still in a draw down mode. There are limited opportunities right now as a result. If they reverse course and start to increase troop levels, the opportunities will definitely increase over the next several years.

Response by SGM Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 29 at 2016 7:59 AM

SGM Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 29 Nov 2016 07:59:03 -0500

SPC Private RallyPoint Member it probably is money, at least in part, as both MAJ Private RallyPoint Member and MAJ Daniel Buchholz have said. But I think it's also that everyone wants someone who starts and stays with their program.

There is a certain amount of discrimination against reserve soldiers. We have only 39 days a year to do the same training the active has 365 days for. It's not uncommon for reserve soldiers, especially in the highly technical and low density MOSs, to not be as well trained as we would like. I can imagine an active duty SFC wondering if the SSG he just got from the reserves is ready to go, or is a PFC wearing too many stripes and needing a lot of training.

SFC J Fullerton makes the case for release of a soldier to active duty in the case of severe financial hardship (unemployed with a family, sick child/no insurance) and thinks that the welfare and best interests of the Soldier and family have to be considered. I respect compassion, but I think that is misplaced. The Army isn't a welfare society. No civilian employer would be held to this standard, requiring that an employee be given higher paid work just because of financial hardship.

There are means of getting release from the reserves. Just move to somewhere more than 50 miles from a reserve unit. Then ask to be released. You'll get it, and then if you want to go active, you can. As a National Guard 1SG, I had enough to deal with in my 39 days a year without having to help someone leave my unit to go to another one.

Response by CAPT Hiram Patterson made Nov 29 at 2016 10:50 AM

CAPT Hiram Patterson — Tue, 29 Nov 2016 10:50:34 -0500

It boils down to the needs of each service at the time. For me, prior service in the Army and Air National Guards were positive factors in getting my Navy commission. Before my Guard service I was turned down probably 5 times by the Navy, AF and Army for a commission.

Response by COL Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 29 at 2016 11:22 AM

COL Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 29 Nov 2016 11:22:43 -0500

There are several reasons. The first is retention. The Reserve Components want to retain their troops and risk losing them if they go on tour or 'go active.' It is tough to recruit 'part-time' troops. So, once recruited, the focus is retention.

The second is social. For a long time, Reserve Components were treated by the Active Component as the 'great unwashed.' The AC would call on the RC during times of conflict or stretched resources with an expectation that we would 'go back to where we belong' after they were done with us. Once a troop transitions from active duty to RC, they are treated differently from those who remain their entire career on active duty.

The third is legal. There are regulations on the number of days an RC trooper can spend assigned on Active Duty (Mobilized, ADOS, COTTAD, AT, etc.) whereas there is no limitation on how long an AC troop can remain assigned or attached to RC units. Granted, there are few opportunities for AC troops to be assigned/attached to Drilling Reserve Units.

Finally, there is the bureaucracy. The policies make it so difficult to gain permission, find the right tour/slot and actually transition from RC to AC, it is easier to just quit all together. Many want to serve full-time but are unable to find the right fit. So, they struggle in a part-time status, balancing work, family, military, education and social life and often find it easier to just return to civilian life. My recommendation continues to be that every member of the AC should come from the RC and all Military and Civilian Education requirements would be fulfilled while a member of the RC. Instead of a two year RC course and a 6 month AC course, there should be many two year RC courses and everyone attends. The AC join the RC units in a full-time status or attend college or obtain civilian employment during course attendance, then return. Also, every assignment and promotion should be made regardless of component. If an RC troop is selected for promotion to an AC position, then they should be provided the option to serve on active duty. We are one force, despite how they treat the RC and AC differently.

Response by CPT Pedro Meza made Nov 30 at 2016 4:22 PM

CPT Pedro Meza — Wed, 30 Nov 2016 16:22:14 -0500

Active duty has slots, and we don't not compete for those slots as a serve force, but as a Reservist or National Guards you can volunteer for missions that will put you in Active service.