Why is it so hard to get a promotion slot within the National Guard?

2013-11-04T22:52:34-05:00

As a E4 i found it quite demotivating that it is almost impossible to move up in the national guard ranks. How can we motivate our E4 if there is no chance of reward for all their hard work and no further place for them to go other then to stay in the E4 club.

Response by SSG(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 5 at 2013 7:21 PM

2013-11-05T19:21:23-05:00

You know ive been asking that same question for yrs and all I get are excuses and no soloutions to this madness. I do however, see people get the E5 put on and then ets within months. Just makes no sense.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 6 at 2013 11:21 AM

2013-11-06T11:21:08-05:00

Sorry to hear that. The favorites games that doesn't exist, yet someone under qualified will be picked over you. Thats rough. sorry

Response by CW3(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 6 at 2013 12:05 PM

2013-11-06T12:05:07-05:00

You literately have to wait for a slot to open and in the guard or reserve that person has to either one get out or two retire which could be a very long time. My father was in the Air National Guard for 24 years and only was promoted to E-7. Rank is more of a marathon race rather than a sprint.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 7 at 2013 6:09 PM

2013-11-07T18:09:12-05:00

That's why I stayed Active Army my whole career. But like the guard

It's come down to the in crowd who gets sent to the board

And I never really joined for Rank anyway, so ill be getting out an E5 after 14-15 years in

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 7 at 2013 8:00 PM

2013-11-07T20:00:26-05:00

Yes, I was prior NG and that "slot" system is veryyyyy daunting. Your promo slot may be 250-300 miles away and GOD forbid you need to be there by Friday evening.... I switched over to Reserves and the slotting system was totally different, as were many other things such as we actually did PT, field problems, CTT tasks, and etc. I enjoyed the Reserves way better.

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 8 at 2013 9:39 AM

2013-11-08T09:39:20-05:00

I actually dealt with this a bit. I made an automated excel spread sheet that you can use to calculate your promotion points. I would use this and send it to all of my Joes when I was an NCO. It would show them where they are lacking points. Then they could see the difference if they had more college or awards. It took me a week to make but it is fully functional with drop downs and date point calculators built in. I am a geek when it comes to excel and power point, somehow I still managed to be an Infantry officer. If you would like this search for me on AKO email me. I will send it to you.

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 8 at 2013 10:32 PM

2013-11-08T22:32:22-05:00

As Guard the only way you can be promoted is within the force structure of your State. Just a fact of life, if you like your State Guard you have to think stratecgically for promotion, I.e. Know which MOS has the beat potential for advancement. If you are in a low density MOS, or where the senior positions are Techs or AGR you neeed to consider reclassification. It can be a complicated solution, but your company training NCO or Readiness NCO should be able to point you in the right direction, you actually have a better potential to get to senior NCO ranks as a M-Day Soldier than the full time staff does due to NGB manning for FT staff.

Response by SSG(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 13 at 2013 9:37 PM

2013-11-13T21:37:28-05:00

Does anyone on this site know of any units leaving for missions? Its so hard to get a job and im chasing deployments like crazy. California here tells me no one is deploying. Any help would be appreciated.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 27 at 2014 2:52 PM

2014-03-27T14:52:58-04:00

SGT Walker, I would recommend you reclass to an MOS that 1. isn't low density, 2. will have more upward mobility, and 3. reduces your commute. Your state has a big MTO&E, and in the right MOS you will get promoted. You need to take a look at the state UMR and see where the vacancies are. I'm in a tiny state, and we're running out of eligible M-Day soldiers to promote!

Response by SPC Chelsea Fernandez made Apr 9 at 2014 2:13 PM

2014-04-09T14:13:05-04:00

I've been in my Guard unit for two years and its really hard to get promoted in a slot.

Response by SSG Keven Lahde made May 31 at 2014 11:19 AM

2014-05-31T11:19:00-04:00

I know what you mean SGT. I am stuck in that same boat. I have been in my unit since 2006 and everytime I fill out the 4100 I always put state-wide cause I don't want to limit myself to a certain area. Even with that said, my unit didn't have an NCO in my MOS for the longest time. Then we picked up a SSG. He pick up his E-6 upcoming transferring to us. We didn't have an E-5 and I was senior E-4 in the company. I am attached to an MP unit so I am combat support. I feel as though we are over looked for promotions cause they want the MP's to promote over us I feel. So I am really frustrated with this issue. I don't want to be a career SPC but I feel as though I will be.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 20 at 2014 2:47 AM

2014-09-20T02:47:29-04:00

When you're in the Guard you have to wait for the people above you to retire, ets, or die to get promoted. Depending on your MOS you may be further limited. If there's 10 E4 slots there will be 5 E5 slots, 3 E6 slots, 2 E7 slots and 1 E8 slot. (That's just an example.) There was a time when you could hold a slot that was intended for one rank below or two ranks above yours, but with cuts and drawdowns and all that nonsense, those days are gone.

I just recently initiated a transfer to the AL Guard. When I was talking to the aviation units here, I was being told that I'd have to take a demotion to e4 after I had waited 7 years to get my 5. Thankfully I ended up finding an E5 slot in a flight company... but it's 150 miles from where I live... >.< I didn't have to take the do over though.

Response by SPC(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 23 at 2014 1:07 AM

2014-10-23T01:07:42-04:00

I have been a specialist for over 8 years, i know what you mean by "demotivating". So many little things can get in the way, PT, height and weight, MTOE chanfes, moving from unit to unit, changing sections within the unit, SSD... its tough!

Response by CW3 Kevin Storm made May 1 at 2015 4:17 PM

2015-05-01T16:17:26-04:00

I am going to cry foul Sgt Walker. You control your own destiny in the Guard. Each soldier gets informed annually of what their point sheet is, they know where they can make points (PT, Civ education, Correspondence Courses for mil education are a few), yet how many are doing that? Now here is the kicker, you get to pick the distance you wish to travel to your next unit, so how is this an unfair system? I see those in my state (California) driving hundreds of miles to make the next grade. Are they making any extra money? Hell no they are losing it. It gets down to dedication.

There comes a point when you have to decide if you want the grade or not, and if you want it, what do you have to do to get it. If you sit on the stump and cry "they won't promote me," Well I got a news flash for you, you are absolutely correct "they won't promote you!" You promote yourself, you demonstrate you have what it takes to be that leader, and sometimes that means sacrifice over convenience.

Sorry if this sounds abrasive, there are no free rides in life nor the US Army.

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 1 at 2016 6:06 PM

2016-10-01T18:06:48-04:00

You have to be willing to maneuver, change units, change MOS, commission or just change component into the reserves.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 1 at 2016 6:42 PM

2016-10-01T18:42:43-04:00

Well for starters you're in the Guard.
2. Probably the "the good ole boy buddy system"
3. You probably made some one mad
4. State funded lack of funding for schools for promotions
5. Lack of funding for NCOES schools
6. Did I mention "the good ole boy buddy system"

Response by SSG Matthew Koehler made Oct 1 at 2016 7:19 PM

2016-10-01T19:19:51-04:00

E-1 thru E-4 is a relatively easy promotion process based on your time in service and promotion points given by your evaluations. Somebody's particular line and paragraph number could max them out as E-4. Then its up to them to reclassify and possibly relocate to a new unit where NCO slots are available. E-5 and above is based on slots that are available through your respective state's "puzzle palace." Picture it as a giant chess board with many pieces (slots). From time to time, the "chess board" gets reorganized, units go bye bye, and new units evolve. Given my experience, its wise to go to college and drive on with NCOES.

Response by LTC Michael Brantley made Oct 2 at 2016 1:30 PM

2016-10-02T13:30:25-04:00

Think about it...How many NCO positions are available in that unit? Is anyone leaving the unit? No, then there are no open positions. You may have to travel to another unit (or another state) in order to find an available position in order to get promoted. One of the principle reasons I encouraged my students at the university to go USAR once they left school. It is much easier to transfer to a different unit. Some states just simply will not release you to go to a open assignment in a different state.

Response by SGT Justin Temple made Mar 3 at 2017 1:25 PM

2017-03-03T13:25:35-05:00

More E-4 and below than E-5 slots and above in each unit. Some have to drive further away just to fill an E-5 slot.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 9 at 2018 11:44 AM

2018-03-09T11:44:53-05:00

Got my E5 is 4 years and signed my E6(Have ALC in April so will get pinned this year) in 6. It’s not hard at all to promote. Just don’t expect it to be given to you. You have to work for it. Volunteer for schools, be a PT Stud, do something in the civilian world that will make you an asset to your unit. All the E4s I’ve meet who complain that they have been E4s too long and never get promoted is because they are either lazy and fat or don’t turn in their paperwork for their 4100’s. Oh yeah and finish SSD1.

Response by SPC William Weedman made Mar 9 at 2018 11:53 AM

2018-03-09T11:53:20-05:00

My issue (in the 1990s) was getting PLDC. I held an E-5 slot for 3 years but our Training NCO (also my Plt Sgt) never could seem to find a PLDC course for me, although other soldiers could find schools and courses they needed. The drill before my ETS 15 E-4s in my unit came down on orders for PLDC in the fall, this was spring. It was to be in lieu of AT. The majority of us were also going to ETS prior to our course. For a month after my ETS I was called by everyone in my CoC officer & NCO asking me to reconsider leaving the Guard. I found out through a fellow unit member they wanted me more for the fact I was prior service and had done my job full time than any other reason. PLDC was the carrot to keep me, but I would not be offered BNCOC or the 91B/C course which was required for E-6. Our unit had a “rule” NCO meetings were E-6 and up, E-5s need not bother, they were not admitted. All this said, the unit leadership was stale, toxic and poorly managed. Last I heard (my friend retired as an E-4) the unit had its MTOE changed from a medical support BSB to a generic med unit with the mission of statewide medical support.

Response by SGM Bill Frazer made Mar 9 at 2018 1:08 PM

2018-03-09T13:08:23-05:00

MTOE!!!- if they are no open slots in the unit, then there is no promotion. It has been that way since 73 that I know of. It's slightly different AD- cause its easy to move from unit to unit to fill a slot on Post.

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 10 at 2018 7:35 AM

2018-03-10T07:35:46-05:00

The old aged question. Why are promotions so difficult in the ARNG? Personal experience; after AD I ETS into the ARNG and it was very frustrating to see people getting promoted ahead of me. What did it for me as a 1LT I was given a CMD but once my CPT board was open I was send back to be a PL at that point I made the decision to transfer into the AR where the only thing that matters is your performance and merits not whom you know or the buddy club you belong to.

Response by MSG John Duchesneau made Mar 13 at 2018 3:51 AM

2018-03-13T03:51:46-04:00

Find a unit with a reasonable number of E-5 slots and then get an MOS for that unit. Military Police has a lot of E-5 slots.

Response by SFC C Bradshaw made May 27 at 2018 12:31 AM

2018-05-27T00:31:23-04:00

Be honest with your troops and explain to them that they must be at the top in their skill set and willing to go to the leadership course Whenever a slot opens be on the waiting list and be ready to go also be acceptable to changing Units as slots become available within their Command and the State

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 23 at 2018 9:45 AM

2018-08-23T09:45:14-04:00

I can tell you from experience that the whole "not trying hard enough" is nonsense depending on your situation. As a 25B in the SC national guard there are about 150 25bs and maybe 2 that are in E5 slots and they are AGR. The way they have signal chain of command is set up for a CPN team, the team chief (E5) has to be a 25Q. So no matter how well you perform as a 25B, there's virtually no way to get promoted pass E4 without getting an AGR slot or reclassing. As a matter of fact several of the 25B in my company who's been in for 6 plus years moved over to cyber for that very reason.

Response by MAJ Ken Landgren made Aug 23 at 2018 7:53 PM

2018-08-23T19:53:45-04:00

You must kill and E-5 first.