Women in combat: Would you accept the idea of gender-specific combat units, such as all female units and all male units?

SGT Anthony Rossi — Wed, 27 May 2015 01:13:03 -0400

I personally like the special comradiery that comes in all male / all female units. My wife still talks of her all female basic training unit and how great it was.

Response by GySgt Wayne A. Ekblad made May 27 at 2015 1:20 AM

GySgt Wayne A. Ekblad — Wed, 27 May 2015 01:20:19 -0400

In combat? NO.

Other than in basic training (or something similar), what would be a reason for an all-female unit? Can you give me some examples?

Response by SSG (ret) William Martin made May 27 at 2015 1:41 AM

SSG (ret) William Martin — Wed, 27 May 2015 01:41:23 -0400

Two times in my Army career I have been in two all male units and both were combat arms. There are pros and cons to both for all male unit and coed units. In coed units I experienced more people prone to being offended by literally every thing from music to eye balls.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made May 27 at 2015 3:18 AM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 27 May 2015 03:18:17 -0400

Let's not forget the FET- Female Engagement Teams. They're not a "unit", but have a strong sense of commaraderie.

Response by 1LT Private RallyPoint Member made May 27 at 2015 4:18 AM

1LT Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 27 May 2015 04:18:22 -0400

SGT Anthony Rossi.

COME ON . . . REALLY NOW . . . YOU WANT COMRADERY . . . DON'T FORCE SEGREGATION ! ! !

The argument sounds a lot like the arguments made to enforce racial segregation in the military.

Warmest Regards, Sandy

Response by Sgt Aaron Kennedy, MS made May 27 at 2015 6:45 AM

Sgt Aaron Kennedy, MS — Wed, 27 May 2015 06:45:39 -0400

It promotes an Us / Them mentality, which is counter to good order & discipline, and the "We're all Green" mentality.

There are certain points where it is necessary, like in basic training, but there are clear reasons why we do that, and clear limitations on it. Once "In the Fleet," the reasoning behind those limitations make less sense.

Additionally, one of the often spouted "disadvantages" of women in combat units is the physiological differences. By spread-loading women, we reduce the potential impact on combat effectiveness dramatically. The mathematics are much more in favor of women being integrated than segregated from a pragmatic standpoint.

Response by CMSgt Private RallyPoint Member made May 27 at 2015 6:49 AM

CMSgt Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 27 May 2015 06:49:01 -0400

H*ll no! There is a reason that my Drill Sergeants used to call us a "bunch of b*tches".. Lol

I love my girls/besties but there is only so much time that I can spend with even my longest/closest of girlfriends. After a while, I need the simplicity/directness of male thinking. No cattiness, no petty bullsh*t... Just scratch, and eat, and talk about Top Gear/Star Wars/Walking Dead... :)

Jerry Seinfeld said it funniest:
"I betcha women would like to know what men really think... the truth, the honest truth.
You wanna know what men are really thinking? 'Cause I could tell you.
Would you like to know?
Alright, I'll tell you.
Nothing.
We're not thinking anything.
We're just walking around, looking around.
This is the only natural inclination of men.
To just kinda check stuff out.
We work because they force us to, but other than that,
this is really the only thing we wanna do."
:)

https://youtu.be/TTqW64CLHsg

Jerry Seinfeld What men are really thinking

A part from Jerry Seinfeld's last movie "I'm telling you for the last time". I found this bit particulary interesting :)

Response by 1LT William Clardy made May 27 at 2015 7:38 AM

1LT William Clardy — Wed, 27 May 2015 07:38:24 -0400

Military units do not exist to create camaraderie, nor to provide a "great" experience.

They exist to persuade, by force of arms if necessary, unfriendly folks to accept our definition of How Things Should Be.

Units which are consistently successful at accomplishing that purpose tend to have high levels of self-esteem and camraderie. They also tend to produce a lot of filled graves and broken bodies.

For a historical example of the cost of becoming a "Band of Brothers", 52 members of the now-famous E Company 2/506th PIR were reported as killed in action during the 11 months between D Day and VE Day. That's a pretty stiff price to pay if all you're looking for is a sense of belonging.

Response by SGT David T. made May 27 at 2015 9:29 AM

SGT David T. — Wed, 27 May 2015 09:29:10 -0400

No. Integration is the key. I have served in all male units and in coed units. I saw no advantages to single gender units. We have to remember that the battlefield is asymmetrical and there is no front line anymore. The lines between combat jobs and support jobs are blurred. We had cooks as gunners in our gun trucks, admin clerks on ECPs, mechanics dealing with detainees and the list goes on. I see no value in separating units based on gender.

Response by MSG Brad Sand made May 27 at 2015 9:37 AM

MSG Brad Sand — Wed, 27 May 2015 09:37:23 -0400

I know the Russians formed all women battalions in the First World War that were so ruthless that the opposing German units feared so much that some men refused to fight if they thought they were facing these women.

I know the Kurds are fielding all women units in their fight against ISIS/ISIL to great effect.

Being the only boy with four sisters, I think we should tread very carefully with this subject. War is terrible enough without unleashing all women unit on the World.

Response by SGT James Elphick made May 27 at 2015 12:58 PM

SGT James Elphick — Wed, 27 May 2015 12:58:43 -0400

I don't think we should have separate all-male/all-female however, I do think there is some merit in only integrating certain units. I say this because of the camaraderie aspect as well as the mutual support. I imagine it would be quite difficult if someone were the only female assigned to a particular infantry battalion. I work with a women who was in MI in the 90's as was at Ft. Bragg when they integrated the battalion and she said it was miserable sometimes because she was the only female in the barracks. That is just my opinion, it seems to be unpopular though.

Response by SSG Donald Mceuen made May 27 at 2015 2:19 PM

SSG Donald Mceuen — Wed, 27 May 2015 14:19:28 -0400

My time in desert storm the females stayed with us all the way
and they were as good as you would expect. They even proved
to be better than some of the men.

Response by CPT Pedro Meza made May 27 at 2015 3:27 PM

CPT Pedro Meza — Wed, 27 May 2015 15:27:46 -0400

We currently have the all Female Teams called Cultural Support Teams (CST) which was previously the Female Engagement Teams (FET) and given the religious misguided men of our current conflicts our CST or FETs are able to accomplish what no man can. Yes they see battle and yes they get Kill and Wounded but we need to support and respect the desire of any women fighter that takes that extra step in these modern war where women are more victimized then before. We can learn a lot from the Kurdish Women Fighters and hope that we do, because women are an un-used weapon system. I came into the service in Jan 1974, when the Women's Army Corps (WAC) was being commingled with the men and was sad when they were eliminated in the early 1980's.

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made May 27 at 2015 9:09 PM

SPC Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 27 May 2015 21:09:14 -0400

I've already fought "shona ba shona" with females. It isn't much of an issue to me.

Response by Cpl Eric Honomichl made May 28 at 2015 11:16 AM

Cpl Eric Honomichl — Thu, 28 May 2015 11:16:40 -0400

No I was motor transport they can even drive the trucks inside the FOB without hitting something

Response by SSgt Stevan Auldridge made May 28 at 2015 6:47 PM

SSgt Stevan Auldridge — Thu, 28 May 2015 18:47:54 -0400

If men and women are equal then what is the point. Because then throw in transgender, people who have no idea, homosexual it would be a mess. Mix the pot and everyone performs together regardless.

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made May 29 at 2015 9:52 PM

1SG Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 29 May 2015 21:52:24 -0400

Anyone who thinks having an all-female unit obviously never was a First Sergeant with a bunch of females living in an open bay. Holy Jesus. Did they ever fight.
Drama.

I wound up threatening to move into their bay to fix it after repeated attempts at utilizing the three NCOs in there. Everybody would just have to change in the latrine and sleep in PTs.
It worked.

Response by SGT William Howell made Apr 29 at 2016 4:59 PM

SGT William Howell — Fri, 29 Apr 2016 16:59:54 -0400

Absolutely not! What then. The all Jew unit?

What makes us great is our ability to work together as Americans. I have taught and trained in both Iraq and Afghanistan with people that hated each other because one was not from the same religion or the same area. They were a fucking mess.

I have already said this once, but I will say it again. A good leader gathers his group figures out who is better at some things and who is better at others. You access this, make a plan based on what your people can do and you move out. It works in sports, the military, or the corporate world. Why would you loose good teammates to segregation? Because they ain't got a dick? How stupid is that?

Response by SPC John Decker made May 13 at 2016 4:13 PM

SPC John Decker — Fri, 13 May 2016 16:13:02 -0400

Sexism or racism or homophobia or any of a long list of other discriminatory concepts have no place in the Armed Forces. If we start down that road, it will never end. As a member of the Armed Forces, you are an American. Nothing more. Nothing less.

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made May 13 at 2016 6:35 PM

SPC Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 13 May 2016 18:35:38 -0400

Why don't we just create integrated combat units where female service members have to pass standards of their male counterparts and do not let any that cannot? If a woman can do and want to, so let her, and those who can't have their uses somewhere else.

Response by SPC Robin Price-Dirks made Jun 17 at 2016 12:21 PM

SPC Robin Price-Dirks — Fri, 17 Jun 2016 12:21:18 -0400

If I had been assigned to an all female unit I would have requested a transfer out. I don't get along with the girls and rub almost all females the wrong way. I'd have been court martialed in a week. Guess latch key kids raised by brothers don't get the girl thing.

Response by SPC Robin Price-Dirks made Jun 17 at 2016 12:27 PM

SPC Robin Price-Dirks — Fri, 17 Jun 2016 12:27:39 -0400

If I had been assigned to a all female unit I would have requested a transfer out! I may be one but I don't understand the creatures and sooner or later rub all of them the wrong way. I'd have been court martialed in a week. I was a latch key kid raised by my brothers mostly. Thank God I had no female drill instructors in basic or I wouldn't have made it!