Posted on Nov 28, 2014
Should service members that commit adultery be processed for discharge and be given an OTH?
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Adultery is punishable under the UCMJ, but I personally have never seen it executed. I know a lot of service members will phlander while deployed, and likewise, their civilian spouses. With divorce running rampant through the military, divorce rate in excess of 50%, should commands be coming down harder on members that 'cheat'? There are numerous problems with this: there are those that make up stories to ruin a career, is it he said/she said, difficult to prove, do you bring all three witnesses into a court setting to get statements. I would imagine the only time it actually becomes a problem, is when two married service members get involved and it becomes a 'black eye' for the unit. Or in cases where there is fraternization accompanied with adultery...in the chain of command.
I bring up this question because I feel the military could do more, and should institute a pro-active approach to increasing successful marriages. Coming down on cheaters is just one thought. The problem I see with this is the military member gets punished but not the civilian spouse...it is one sided.
I bring up this question because I feel the military could do more, and should institute a pro-active approach to increasing successful marriages. Coming down on cheaters is just one thought. The problem I see with this is the military member gets punished but not the civilian spouse...it is one sided.
Posted >1 y ago
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When you wrote: "I feel the military could do more, and should institute a pro-active approach to increasing successful marriages," you were on the money, but your proposed solution is way off.
First, it goes after one aspect of marriage, fidelity, that usually isn't a problem until the marriage is in trouble for other reasons (e.g., physical or emotional distance, stress, financial problems, etc.). You don't cure or prevent anything by addressing symptoms.
Second, the ramifications for adultery are already so harsh that the non-offending spouse already knows through the rumor mill NOT to report their military spouse. Better to divorce him/her in civilian court and let the military member keep the job that can pay child support, alimony, and college benefits, than to blow the whistle to military authorities. Your proposal of OTH discharge would make things worse, not better.
Third, crimes of passion - for lack of a different term - rarely are dissuaded by threatened consequences. People in a bar fight know assault is against the law, but in the moment, it doesn't enter into the decision making process. This would be no different. Additionally, people committing adultery specifically plan not to get caught. Adding more consequences for getting caught only means it is all the more important not to get caught. There's a big difference between that and not doing it in the first place.
If you truly care about military marriages, and I completely agree that there needs to be more effort focused on this, look at advocating for things like longer periods between PCSs, more real support during deployment (not dumping everything on the FRG), a closer look at how we handle the work day (could we do better at managing the work week to 40 hours?), and things like that. Looking to affix blame after the barn has burned down and the horse has run off is just pointless. It has more to do with desiring vindication than remedy. If my spouse left me for another service member, throwing the other woman out of the Army (after what probably would amount to over a year of proceedings and having my own personal life aired for the entire unit's entertainment) wouldn't do a gosh darn bit of good.
First, it goes after one aspect of marriage, fidelity, that usually isn't a problem until the marriage is in trouble for other reasons (e.g., physical or emotional distance, stress, financial problems, etc.). You don't cure or prevent anything by addressing symptoms.
Second, the ramifications for adultery are already so harsh that the non-offending spouse already knows through the rumor mill NOT to report their military spouse. Better to divorce him/her in civilian court and let the military member keep the job that can pay child support, alimony, and college benefits, than to blow the whistle to military authorities. Your proposal of OTH discharge would make things worse, not better.
Third, crimes of passion - for lack of a different term - rarely are dissuaded by threatened consequences. People in a bar fight know assault is against the law, but in the moment, it doesn't enter into the decision making process. This would be no different. Additionally, people committing adultery specifically plan not to get caught. Adding more consequences for getting caught only means it is all the more important not to get caught. There's a big difference between that and not doing it in the first place.
If you truly care about military marriages, and I completely agree that there needs to be more effort focused on this, look at advocating for things like longer periods between PCSs, more real support during deployment (not dumping everything on the FRG), a closer look at how we handle the work day (could we do better at managing the work week to 40 hours?), and things like that. Looking to affix blame after the barn has burned down and the horse has run off is just pointless. It has more to do with desiring vindication than remedy. If my spouse left me for another service member, throwing the other woman out of the Army (after what probably would amount to over a year of proceedings and having my own personal life aired for the entire unit's entertainment) wouldn't do a gosh darn bit of good.
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SSG(P) (Join to see)
I'm not proposing an OTH discharge is the solution, but it is an option right now. I feel a letter of reprimand for 1st offense, NJ for second, and discharge for 3rd...would seem fair. There is so much infidelity now it seems like marriage should be 'illegal' for he first 3 years....said with sarcasm, but a hint of honesty.
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For the record, I've had a few courts-martial with adultery as a charge. Even though the civilians do not prosecute we tend to because it's prejudice to good order and discipline and/or beings discredit to the armed forces.
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SFC Peter Cyprian
SGT Kesler- punitive articles have elements that must be met/proven by the TC in order to convict. Just like any law in the civilian world. One of the elements of the crime that must be proven for adultery is the effect on good order and discipline. If you cannot prove ALL elements of a given article, you cannot get a conviction for that article. It is not a matter of "articles that aren't enforced". It is a matter of "can we prove all the elements", because if they can't, they can't charge the Soldier.
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SFC Peter Cyprian
No, just a CJ major that also teaches Site Exploitation, Forensics, and Biometrics. ;-)
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SSG Brian Fernandez
"For the record, I've had a few courts-martial with adultery as a charge." Amber you better tighten up that shot group. LOL
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Unless one of the people involved admitted the act or you have film that clearly shows the act, it's hard to prove. A command only has so much time and people, an adultery task force was never one of my priorities.
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SSG(P) (Join to see)
Agreed sir! How does one get caught? I guess by email or text message...but seriously a serious charge to make on hearsay. My guess, it happens more than we are all willing to admit.
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