Posted on May 14, 2018
Does this fall under the provisions of corrective training IAW AR 600-20?
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Does this fall under the provisions of corrective training IAW AR 600-20?
After being released from work I was told by my team leader (SPC) to meet her at my barracks. No explaination given as to why or where in the barracks. When I arrived I could not find her, she was not in CQ nor was she by my room. So I went in and while waiting for her decided to clean my room a little. Less than 5 mins later while taking out trash that I had already staged to be taken out the same day after work (dumpster is against the barracks building) she comes out saying “is that what I told you to do?”. I get that the right thing to do would’ve been to call her but because of that I am going to take everything out of my room and clean every little thing as if I were clearing the barracks. Pull out every piece of furniture clean around and inside it and put it all back. My room is not even dirty, the only thing lying around is daily use items, and even they have their own place. To me this feels like I’m being punished for doing the right thing (cleaning my room). For some reason the frequency of our barracks inspections has increased to almost daily (I even had one last Saturday) I read that under AR 600-20 corrective training is to be in proportion to the deficiency and not to be considered punishment, but this feels like punishment. My team leader is a new one and inexperienced. Her and I were both PFCs at one point and she was a SPC for less than 3 months before being appointed as team leader. Her leadership style makes me feel like I can’t talk to her about anything and I’m not sure if I have anything solid to go on before trying to talk to her and bringing it up the chain of command.
Now I’m not a shit bag soldier, I try my best but like everyone I make mistakes. I don’t cause trouble and I do what I’m told (when the instructions are clear). I talked to a couple other soldiers and even they feel that’s excessive and the “punishment does not fit the crime”. I was wondering what you all think so I can have some solid advice to go on.
After being released from work I was told by my team leader (SPC) to meet her at my barracks. No explaination given as to why or where in the barracks. When I arrived I could not find her, she was not in CQ nor was she by my room. So I went in and while waiting for her decided to clean my room a little. Less than 5 mins later while taking out trash that I had already staged to be taken out the same day after work (dumpster is against the barracks building) she comes out saying “is that what I told you to do?”. I get that the right thing to do would’ve been to call her but because of that I am going to take everything out of my room and clean every little thing as if I were clearing the barracks. Pull out every piece of furniture clean around and inside it and put it all back. My room is not even dirty, the only thing lying around is daily use items, and even they have their own place. To me this feels like I’m being punished for doing the right thing (cleaning my room). For some reason the frequency of our barracks inspections has increased to almost daily (I even had one last Saturday) I read that under AR 600-20 corrective training is to be in proportion to the deficiency and not to be considered punishment, but this feels like punishment. My team leader is a new one and inexperienced. Her and I were both PFCs at one point and she was a SPC for less than 3 months before being appointed as team leader. Her leadership style makes me feel like I can’t talk to her about anything and I’m not sure if I have anything solid to go on before trying to talk to her and bringing it up the chain of command.
Now I’m not a shit bag soldier, I try my best but like everyone I make mistakes. I don’t cause trouble and I do what I’m told (when the instructions are clear). I talked to a couple other soldiers and even they feel that’s excessive and the “punishment does not fit the crime”. I was wondering what you all think so I can have some solid advice to go on.
Posted in these groups: 
Corrective Training
Corrective Training
Posted 6 y ago
Responses: 1
Here is where I will start: Yes, as soon as you got to your room, and could not find your Team Leader, you should have called her to let her know you were in your room. Now, if I were your Team Leader, you would have found me already standing there, especially if this were to be a room inspection, which I'm gathering it was, but since she wasn't clear on her instructions, one will never really know for certain. It is of my opinion that your corrective action, going off of what you have said (and every story has three sides), was a tad on the excessive side.
As for barracks inspections....those can happen at any moment. Barracks Inspections is a 1SG/Commander driven policy. If the 1SG decides to inspect rooms on a Saturday....well, then your room better be squared away and you standing tall at your door ready to put them in awe. As for the trash that you staged, I have to ask why you didn't take the bags to the dumpster on your way to work since, as you said, the dumpster is right next to the building? Also, as a Preventive Medicine NCO that conducts Health Sanitation Inspections with my 1SG, I can tell you that I would have dinged you on sanitation conditions and you would have been dinged by the 1SG for not having taken out the trash. But I digress.
I would definitely say that your Team Leader was a tad excessive. And, your Team Leader was also not clear in her instructions. But remember, your Team Leader is there for a reason. It appears that someone feels she was the right person for the job. Plus, she is also trying to establish her role as a Leader. Granted, her style could use a little polishing, but that is what your Squad Leader is for, to help mentor not only you, but to also mentor her. I also have to ask, did your Team Leader counsel you (in writing) in regards to: Her intent, your short-comings (if any) and the directed Plan of Action in regards to your corrective action(s)? Perhaps you could have a sit-down face to face and talk with her about this. If this does not happen, or she refuses to, then perhaps you can always take this issue up with your Squad Leader. But, if you choose the second route, inform your Team Leader of your actions. That way, she is in the know. Just a little food for thought.
As for barracks inspections....those can happen at any moment. Barracks Inspections is a 1SG/Commander driven policy. If the 1SG decides to inspect rooms on a Saturday....well, then your room better be squared away and you standing tall at your door ready to put them in awe. As for the trash that you staged, I have to ask why you didn't take the bags to the dumpster on your way to work since, as you said, the dumpster is right next to the building? Also, as a Preventive Medicine NCO that conducts Health Sanitation Inspections with my 1SG, I can tell you that I would have dinged you on sanitation conditions and you would have been dinged by the 1SG for not having taken out the trash. But I digress.
I would definitely say that your Team Leader was a tad excessive. And, your Team Leader was also not clear in her instructions. But remember, your Team Leader is there for a reason. It appears that someone feels she was the right person for the job. Plus, she is also trying to establish her role as a Leader. Granted, her style could use a little polishing, but that is what your Squad Leader is for, to help mentor not only you, but to also mentor her. I also have to ask, did your Team Leader counsel you (in writing) in regards to: Her intent, your short-comings (if any) and the directed Plan of Action in regards to your corrective action(s)? Perhaps you could have a sit-down face to face and talk with her about this. If this does not happen, or she refuses to, then perhaps you can always take this issue up with your Squad Leader. But, if you choose the second route, inform your Team Leader of your actions. That way, she is in the know. Just a little food for thought.
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PFC Jonathan Vosecek
I can understand where you’re coming from SSG, but this event just happened recently and I have not been counceled in anyway. And I didn’t take those bags to the dumpster on my way to work because today our work call formation was much earlier than usual. I got back to my room at 0800 and was told to be there at 0830 after showing and eating breakfast. Honestly SSG no one had time to do much this morning. It’s certainly viable that I could’ve done it earlier and that’s a deficiency on my part. However I don’t feel that cleaning everything in my room which isn’t even that dirty is an appropriate action. And these barracks checks aren’t even with our senior leadership present. It’s just team leaders that do this.
I do appreciate your insight SSG and thank you for your response.
I do appreciate your insight SSG and thank you for your response.
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MSG (Join to see)
PFC Jonathan Vosecek - Yes, you could have done it earlier, which you acknowledge. Which is a good start. On to your Team Leader, again yes her "corrective action" plan is excessive. AND, it should have been put in writing. As for the Senior Leaders present or not present, that is really here nor there. They set the policy and can either be present at inspection or have a designated representative. In this case, it's your Team Leader. One explanation is that, guessing there is more than just you two on the Team, that she was inspecting another Team Members room. But, since I don't know the particulars of your unit, that is only speculation.
In this particular case, I would suggest that you complete the "corrective action" and take this as a learning lesson and move forward. By that, I mean, in the future don't give her a reason to go excessive again. Have your stuff locked tight. But I also recommend you address this excessive guidance with your Squad Leader and Team Leader. There are many that, when put into a Leadership role for the very first time go overboard in trying to establish their position.
In this particular case, I would suggest that you complete the "corrective action" and take this as a learning lesson and move forward. By that, I mean, in the future don't give her a reason to go excessive again. Have your stuff locked tight. But I also recommend you address this excessive guidance with your Squad Leader and Team Leader. There are many that, when put into a Leadership role for the very first time go overboard in trying to establish their position.
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