Posted on Jun 12, 2021
How do you feel the story of Generation Kill has affected service members?
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Whether the book or the HBO miniseries, Soldiers and Marines I have spoken with feel the story resonates with them in things they have experienced or things they expect from their service.
Additionally and whether right or wrong, some of have explained that this has colored their impression of officers in the armed forces and in some cases SNCO's.
While this one unit, this one story in twenty years of years of war tells an important story it is one of many. Why do you feel it impacts so many?
Do you think it's important to embed war correspondence journalists in forward units knowing that it has the potential to embarrass the military for its decisions or poor leadership at various levels?
Do you think the book and miniseries damaged the careers of the officers involved?
Additionally and whether right or wrong, some of have explained that this has colored their impression of officers in the armed forces and in some cases SNCO's.
While this one unit, this one story in twenty years of years of war tells an important story it is one of many. Why do you feel it impacts so many?
Do you think it's important to embed war correspondence journalists in forward units knowing that it has the potential to embarrass the military for its decisions or poor leadership at various levels?
Do you think the book and miniseries damaged the careers of the officers involved?
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Leadership
Leadership
Posted 3 y ago
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Happens all the time. In WWII, Korea, Vietnam, and today. There are always people wo manage to get into leadership slots who should never be there. I got one absolutely idiotic Lt. blackballed and I wish I could of gotten a few NCOs booted, but ........ Truth, honesty and all of those Army Values are what really count. I absolutely support journalist being imbedded with us.
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I think that for too long military leadership could get away with terrible things with not just little but no consequences. Then embedded journalists/reporters became a thing and some things were exposed, and then social media became a thing and a lot of dirty laundry was aired. Groups like "US Army WTF! moments" have done a surprisingly large amount of good by exposing things that in the past would have never been known outside the immediate players involved. Now, as far as how your one cited miniseries affected things I can't say. I have no idea what affect if any the miniseries had on anyones careers, but I do believe it's important to shine lights into places to expose the truth. If this embarrasses the Army then it's not the fault of the reporter, it's the fault of the embarrassed.
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I doubt enough people have watched it to make a difference. I was in Iraq shortly after the book took place and again later on. There were a lot of isms that were still happening like that. That's the nature of war. It's not battles, it's politics being played out in foreign lands. Clauswitz said it hundreds of years ago and Sun Tzu said it thousands of years ago.
There were a handful of people in the book who disagreed with how they were portrayed, you can read about it on the wiki. The fact is that these type of books had already saturated the American book scene and wasn't being read by people who weren't already reading this type of book. So, there was no big collective shock from the population because most people never read it. By the time the mini series came out, the handful of officers and enlisted who were still in service had so much time and rank in that they weren't going to be negatively affected just because a book portrayed them poorly.
As to people saying it colored their perception of military leaders, I say these impressionable and naive minds are easily colored toward whatever story they're reading. Give them a copy of Blackhawk Down or We Were Young Once and they'll feel right as rain again
There were a handful of people in the book who disagreed with how they were portrayed, you can read about it on the wiki. The fact is that these type of books had already saturated the American book scene and wasn't being read by people who weren't already reading this type of book. So, there was no big collective shock from the population because most people never read it. By the time the mini series came out, the handful of officers and enlisted who were still in service had so much time and rank in that they weren't going to be negatively affected just because a book portrayed them poorly.
As to people saying it colored their perception of military leaders, I say these impressionable and naive minds are easily colored toward whatever story they're reading. Give them a copy of Blackhawk Down or We Were Young Once and they'll feel right as rain again
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CPT Lawrence Cable
I agree, by the time the Mini Series came out, it was Military History. Maybe because I have always been a reader of military histories, I didn't find anything particularly shocking about it. That generals misuse the tools they have available or that you can get Senior NCO's and/or Officers that are incompetent? It's happened in every war since Homer copied down the Fall of Troy. For every Grant there are a dozen McClellan's.
Even with Blackhawk Down, I would point to the failure to adequately plan for a mission going bad, not including the 10th and Pakistanis in the planning process as a leadership failure too. It certainly didn't do much for Garrison's career, although he survived it. The part of We were Soldiers Once and Young that wasn't included in the Movie was not the Army's finest hour either.
Even with Blackhawk Down, I would point to the failure to adequately plan for a mission going bad, not including the 10th and Pakistanis in the planning process as a leadership failure too. It certainly didn't do much for Garrison's career, although he survived it. The part of We were Soldiers Once and Young that wasn't included in the Movie was not the Army's finest hour either.
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SPC (Join to see)
Appreciate the thought out response. We've been waging war since Elam and Sumer, as far as writing tells us at any rate so the nature of war is certainly well documented. I hadn't thought of that, but the book market is teeming with personal experiences about GWOT. I suppose that's not surprising all things considered. I know a fair few have ended up on recommended reading lists, but I also don't know too many people in the units I've been in that actually read anything on those lists.
I would say you're right about the peoples perceptions being influenced by this are correct. While I would say it imparts good lessons or background information that people were not aware of unless they were there, you can't exactly judge the entire military on the actions of a few. If anything, you see things like that and just don't impart it into your own leadership style.
I think people forget that you see a show or read a story and forget that life goes on despite the story ending. Like you said, they had so much time and rank; for example Sergeant Brad Colbert served on until 2016 before retiring as a Master Sergeant. Then you have others like Lieutenant Nate Fick who left in 2004 as a Captain, before the series even came out.
I would say you're right about the peoples perceptions being influenced by this are correct. While I would say it imparts good lessons or background information that people were not aware of unless they were there, you can't exactly judge the entire military on the actions of a few. If anything, you see things like that and just don't impart it into your own leadership style.
I think people forget that you see a show or read a story and forget that life goes on despite the story ending. Like you said, they had so much time and rank; for example Sergeant Brad Colbert served on until 2016 before retiring as a Master Sergeant. Then you have others like Lieutenant Nate Fick who left in 2004 as a Captain, before the series even came out.
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MSgt Steve Sweeney
SPC (Join to see) - While it may not be sound to "judge the entire military on the actions of a few", you are never going to change the fact that some people will make those judgements, not just about the military, but in all walks of life. Further, the potential for embarrassment is not sufficient cause to deny journalists access to a military that is completely funded by the taxpayer's dollars. Perhaps the focus should be improving the leadership and decisions that would be embarrassing if exposed rather than preventing exposure. Sunshine standard.
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