Posted on Jun 5, 2014
A "Veteran" after dropping out of boot camp? Where do you draw the line?
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I feel that a woman I know (I will leave it at that for anonymity's sake) is claiming something and taking credit for something that she didn't earn. Personally, I am an honorably discharged disabled veteran, so I feel I have a legitimate gripe here. Anyway, this woman joined the Army a decade or so ago, and quit 2 weeks into boot camp because she couldn't hack it. She claims it was due to a sprained ankle. I know many soldiers that completed boot camp after healing up from a sprained ankle. Anyway, every time Veteran's Day, Memorial Day etc... rolls around she gladly accepts accolade's in person and all over social media and acts like she deserves the title veteran. I just can't get that taste out of my mouth that this creates. At what point can someone claim that title? I figured at the very minimum graduating basic training... any thoughts?
Posted >1 y ago
Responses: 119
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If you serve even one day on active duty you receive a DD214. The DD214 reflects the type of discharge you receive whether honorable or dishonorable, etc. It also has an RE- code which is your re-entry code and that determines if you can re-enter service or if you have to have a waiver to re-enter or cannot re-enter, etc. I know this for a fact because my initial enlistment I was discharged during basic training due to a medical issue and I received a DD214. My RE code required a me to get a waiver to re-enter the military which after a 10 year break in service and the medical issue corrected I received a waiver to re-enter service and my prior service time that I had from my initial basic training counts towards my service time. During my 10 year break in service I still was considered a Veteran and I still considered myself a Veteran. Had I done something illegal and been dishonorably discharged that would be a different story but one should never discount another's honorable service even for a short amount of time. By statute, a “veteran” is defined as a “person who served in the active military, naval, or air service, and who was discharged or released therefrom under conditions other than dishonorable.” I don't agree with people taking credit for service they didn't do or bragging about things she hasn't done and there may be more to her discharge that she chooses not to share but if she served honorably she is entitled to be considered a Veteran. Judging by some of the comments I've read there are a lot of egos and people need to get over themselves and embrace anyone that has served honorably as their brothers and sisters and stop being so judgmental about how long they have served.
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PO1 (Join to see)
CWO2, I didn't realize I singled you out that your opinion was geared toward yourself. I apologize if you took my opinion personally. I don't appreciate people stealing valor from those who are deserving of the honor but that is not what the question was. People are confusing being a Veteran and being a war hero; there is a huge difference. Anyone one who has served on active duty I don't care if it is for one day is a Veteran. The benefits are a different story, the article you have attached is referring to this guy using loopholes in the VA disability system to gain benefits. Believe me I am a huge supporter of Rep Tammy Duckworth, she has made unbelievable sacrifices for this country and every single one of us that wears this uniform and it is disgraceful for anyone to falsely make claims about being a Veteran or being injured worse than they were, exaggerating war stories, etc. and shame on those who do it. But, it is equally wrong for us to criticize fellow Veterans because they don't meet our definition of what a Veteran should be even though they meet the legal definition. I wasn't bashing anyone directly and I guess I didn't think that my thumbs down really needed elaboration other than it just meant I did not agree with your one line statement. I thought I gave enough information in my original post to explain the thumbs down, sorry didn't intend to offend.
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PO1 (Join to see)
MAJ Ballinger--The Soldier would absolutely be discharged and even though it would be Uncharacterized IAW AR635-5 the DD-214 would indicate her discharge status from active duty and by legal definition make her a Veteran. By people's personal definition many may not consider her a Veteran but the legal VA definition states she would be. Unfortunately some people like to inflate their Veteran status as CWO2 states for financial/personal gain or other accolades which is just shameful.
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I don't tell people I used to be a Pararescueman. I quit after 4 weeks, I did not complete any part of the course.
To say I was a member of that elite group of warriors is to spit on the faces of those who were dedicated to the training, and subsequently the missions they completed.
No your friend is not a veteran, nor was she ever a soldier.
To say I was a member of that elite group of warriors is to spit on the faces of those who were dedicated to the training, and subsequently the missions they completed.
No your friend is not a veteran, nor was she ever a soldier.
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IMHO you're not a "Veteran" until you've completed your IET and have been discharged from active duty under honorable conditions upon completing your tour of duty (whether it be ETS, Medical retirement, etc). She didn't complete her IET, so in my opinion, she never got past the "candidate" stage.
Now here's a question: if she got any lump sum bonuses for enlisting, are those paid upon completing IET or at the time she signed the dotted line? If it was paid up front, would she have to pay that bonus back because she essentially failed to live up to the conditions of the enlistment contract?
Now here's a question: if she got any lump sum bonuses for enlisting, are those paid upon completing IET or at the time she signed the dotted line? If it was paid up front, would she have to pay that bonus back because she essentially failed to live up to the conditions of the enlistment contract?
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PO3 (Join to see)
I think I wasn't clear in my thoughts when I wrote this. Being doped up on allergy meds will do that to ya!
Does "dropping out of boot camp" count as honorably discharged? If so, THAT is RIDICULOUS.
I would think that once you were in the service and completed a full contract" or at least a deployment and were either separated honorably at the end of your contract, or medically due to injuries sustained, that you would be considered a veteran. If at any point, you did something stupid to get dishonorably discharged, you shouldn't be considered a vet. That title is reserved for those who served honorably... and medical discharges are still honorable.
Does "dropping out of boot camp" count as honorably discharged? If so, THAT is RIDICULOUS.
I would think that once you were in the service and completed a full contract" or at least a deployment and were either separated honorably at the end of your contract, or medically due to injuries sustained, that you would be considered a veteran. If at any point, you did something stupid to get dishonorably discharged, you shouldn't be considered a vet. That title is reserved for those who served honorably... and medical discharges are still honorable.
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PO2 John Crutchfield
If you are kicked out or get medically dismissed from boot camp, you are not considered a veteran. There is no DD214.
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PO1 (Join to see)
If you serve even one day on active duty you receive a DD214. The DD214 reflects the type of discharge you receive whether honorable or dishonorable, etc. It also has an RE- code which is your re-entry code and that determines if you can re-enter service or if you have to have a waiver to re-enter or cannot re-enter, etc. I know this for a fact because my initial enlistment I was discharged during basic training due to a medical issue and I received a DD214. My RE code required a me to get a waiver to re-enter the military which after a 10 year break in service and the medical issue corrected I received a waiver to re-enter service and my prior service time that I had from my initial basic training counts towards my service time. During my 10 year break in service I still was considered a Veteran and I still considered myself a Veteran. Had I done something illegal and been dishonorably discharged that would be a different story but one should never discount another's honorable service even for a short amount of time. By statute, a “veteran” is defined as a “person who served in the active military, naval, or air service, and who was discharged or released therefrom under conditions other than dishonorable.”
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SPC Ronnie Smith
Does "dropping out of boot camp" count as honorably discharged? If so, THAT is RIDICULOUS"
No, it would be an "Administrative Discharge" or "Un-Characterized" and be more clearly defined on their DD-214 as "Failed to meet physical requirements for military duty" or "Failed to be MOS qualified within 24 months" etc...
No, it would be an "Administrative Discharge" or "Un-Characterized" and be more clearly defined on their DD-214 as "Failed to meet physical requirements for military duty" or "Failed to be MOS qualified within 24 months" etc...
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I do not know if just showing up and leaving qualifies for veteran's status. Sounds like a union hall to me.
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Just another example of the "entitlement" generation. People "working" the system to get benefits they do not deserve. Before too long, all of the available benefits will all be spent up. Leaving nothing for those of us who actually did something to EARN that entitlement.
At what time should someone "claim" a title. I dont think I know the answer to your question. I guess one answer would be...when their peers acknowledge it!
At what time should someone "claim" a title. I dont think I know the answer to your question. I guess one answer would be...when their peers acknowledge it!
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There was a different thread previously about veterans status that you may want to read through for some additional insight. The simple truth is there isn't a black and white line dividing who is and who isn't a veteran. I understand your angst, and I have felt the same way at times.
Here is a link to the thread I was referring to:
https://www.rallypoint.com/answers/should-veteran-status-be-reserved-for-those-who-have-deployed
Here is a link to the thread I was referring to:
https://www.rallypoint.com/answers/should-veteran-status-be-reserved-for-those-who-have-deployed
Should veteran status be reserved for those who have deployed? | RallyPoint
This one has come up a lot in conversations with my peers and Soldiers: Should you be allowed to claim veterans status if you have never deployed? Personally, I'm an ROTC graduate who chose to go straight into the ARNG in 2011, knowing full well that my chances to deploy would be next to none with the changing op tempo. Realistically, had I been actively searching out a deployment the whole time, I still may not have gotten one. I'm sure there...
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In my opinion when I was deployed for the second time to Iraq from FT Hood My peers there already had at least two deployments and I just had one at the time. They told me you can't consider yourself a veteran until you have been to both type of combat zone. After my deployment survivor then I was able to consider myself a veteran.
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LCpl Mark Lefler
I think that's too harsh and unfair, alot of people in the service never get to a combat zone, that doesn't mean they do not make important contributions to the military... I can see not counting yourself as a Combat Vet of course, but general vet status if your in the FMF or whatever the army term for it, then one should be considered a vet.
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