Posted on Sep 14, 2019
PFC Soldier
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I was wondering if this gun control stuff comes down to it, could soldiers disobey an order to take someone’s weapons on the grounds that it violates the constitution?
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LTC Jason Mackay
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Edited >1 y ago
This is a fools errand of a question. AR600-20 is the source of an officer's ability to issue orders and an NCOs ability to supervise. The MCM is the source on UCMJ particularly Article 92. Most of what you are looking for is not regulation but federal law. Much of it covered in the DSCA I and II joint course.

Posse Commitatus prevents Title 10 Active Duty military or state forces under federal control from enforcing the law unless the Insurrection act is in effect. There is an extremely narrow range of circumstances where Title 10 forces can enforce laws, which weapon confiscation would fall under. It requires a request from the state and a presidential order. It happened during the LA Riots, and they "read the riot act" and the crowd did not disperse. Federal troops restored order in conjunction with beleaguered law enforcement.

State forces under control of the governor may enforce the law in accordance with state law. Each state varies a little. The key term is State Active Duty (SAD). Title 32 authority is a gray area.

Just because it happened before does not mean it was legal or a lawful order. The Obama administration distributing fuel in NYC during Sandy was illegal...and an election year. Katrina was a whole series of made up stuff.

Coast guard can enforce law by Title 14 Authority
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SSgt Joseph Baptist
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If youa re an MP, and are enforcing a military regulation/UCMJ on post, or against a military member, it could be legal.
If you are a Guardsman, and you are placed on state orders to support civilian LE to do this, it might be a lawful order, depending on the circumstances.
If you are a reservist or active duty, and Martial Law has not been declared, it is a violation of the Posse Commitatus Act for you to be enforcing civilian laws.

Think about how your oath was prioritized, and use your ethics and integrity to make your choice.

If you disobey an order - no matter how blatantly unlawful - you should expect there to be repercussions, at least in the short term.

If it gets to the point where a "President Beto" is ordering the Army to disarm American citizens, and unit commanders are actually going along with that BS, then things are probably at the point where within the unit, either those obeying, or those refusing, will likely be shot by those with opposing views.
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MSgt Operations Intelligence
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In my opinion, it would be an unlawful order. We took an oath to "Support and Defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies....". The Constitution is the law of the land and any order given that violates the law is unlawful.
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CPL Earl Kochis
CPL Earl Kochis
>1 y
Msgt Thomas you are correct our oath comes in several parts the first part overrules the rest! If our leaders orders violate the Constitution they are unlawful that includes all the way to the President! You are to follow lawful orders only also those orders must be Morally sound! The question on morally sound is by whose morals?? This is where the dilemma falls! But the answer to that one is simple if the order defies military values of that branch it is immoral!! So memorizing your branches values is important!
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CPT Michael Theimer
CPT Michael Theimer
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What training are officers getting today about unlawful orders?
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