Posted on Jan 8, 2018
Cadet SFC Rev. David Doellinger
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Posted in these groups: Us army ranks 319 CommissionThcapm08l9 ROTC
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Responses: 6
LTC Jason Mackay
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Edited >1 y ago
Great question. It is highly contradictory.
- ROTC literature says you aren't....it is an elective.
- AR600-20 assigns cadets a place in the chain of command
- your contract is an enlistment for 8 years in the Army Reserve, assigned to the ROTC COntrol Group (2A Da Form 597-3)
- when you commissioned, you are conditionally released from the reserve component for the purpose of accepting a commission.
- during full mobilization, if you have graduated from ROTC Advanced camp you are recalled, commissioned, and sent to BOLC for training in order to put you in a unit. If you are contracted but not a Advanced Camp Graduate, you are sent to OCS or serve in an enlisted capacity (AR145-1).
- you are issued a military ID card and draw pay.
- you don't accrue time in service.
- if you are injured, you aren't eligible for VA services nor long term treatment.
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LTC Jason Mackay
LTC Jason Mackay
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CPT Enrique M. - they change from the ROTC Control Group to a TPU, IMA, or IRR.
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CPT Lawrence Cable
CPT Lawrence Cable
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LTC Jason Mackay - As an SMP, even though they are if fact enlisted, you are attached to that unit but not on the TO&E, so again you get the not regularly assigned. I'll take your word about Korea, although I personally wouldn't have let a new 2LT lead a combat patrol right out of the gate, let alone a cadet.
Any JAG officers out there that want to offer a legal opinion?
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LTC Jason Mackay
LTC Jason Mackay
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CPT Lawrence Cable - all your points support my premise: it is vague and nebulous whether Cadets are "in" the Army.
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1LT Health Services Administration
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Hello, contracted cadet here. For SMP cadets like myself I will say yes. I have unit, I am still expected to drill, follow army rules and regulations and I can still be punished under UCMJ. Deployable? No. As to commission you need your degree and deploying would hold this up so contacting makes you non-deployable. However, if you are not SMP I'll say no. Yes you are expected to follow Army rules and regs, follow your chain of command etc. But if you get kicked out or fail out, you're free (might have to pay back some money though). However if I leave the program for whatever reason, I am still obligated to finished my original enlistment contract to my ETS or extension if one was signed, which usually has to happen to get your full pay. I also occur TIS. Non SMP do not.
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LTC Plans Officer (G5)
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Edited 4 y ago
If they are drilling in an Army Reserve or National Guard unit as an Simultaneous Membership Program (SMP) then they are in the Army (Selected Reserve capacity).

If they are just an ROTC Cadet, but contracted then they are not officially "in the Army" as LTC Jason Mackay outlined- it is a very grey area. Some people consider them in the Army, but they are just in training.

Cadet Command is a separate part of the Army anyways since they don't fall under Forces Command (FORSCOM) or Training and Doctrine Command (TRADOC) like other Soldiers do. Cadets go to training but are only provided meals and lodging, but not pay (since they are not in the Army officially).
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Capt Daniel Goodman
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Edited >1 y ago
That's an interesting question...when I was on Army ROTC scholarship, I got a 3-yr in my 2nd yr undergrad, I wasn't able to finish the program, and went USAF OTS instead back when it was at Lackland after I finished my bachelors, before it got moved to Maxwell...I'd most definitely say yeah, purely from an experiential standpoint, obviously, that's not law, per se, of course...I spoke with an attorney once who'd been in Army ROTC during Vietnam, he was physically needed, he'd been on scholarship, he couldn't finish the program, he was told he'd been activated, he said he was still in school and was flat out told no, that they needed a body, and he was going to be used, so the whole activation thing for him, at least, was actually invoked, rare as that might be, I gather...now, in my case, they didn't activate me, in similar fashion, that was long before I had the discussion with him about what happened to him, though, I gather, they certainly could've used me if there'd been a similar need, when I was released from the program, I was actually given my honorable discharge, plus, all my records are actually on file from Army ROTC at NPRC in St. Louis, so, and I entirely realize this is purely my own viewpoint, I'd, as I'd said, most definitely say yeah, for sure...I entirely grant I could be wrong, and he was the only instance I'd ever personally run across of someone who'd been so activated, he wasn't used in Vietnam, he'd been sent to Germany, he'd said, then he'd gone back to finish his undergrad, then went for law, however, it it happened to him, which I know for a fact it apparently did, I'd be quite certain it could certainly happen to others as well, by all means, it'd depend on circumstances, certainly, of course, however, I'd by no means place it outside the bounds of legal reality, you know? I just figured you'd find that an interesting story, if nothing else, OK?
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