Posted on May 15, 2020
SSG Squad Leader
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Open discussion if anyone as an example they have seen, or are dealing with right now. Is their a conflict of interest between UCMJ and our own rights?
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SSG 12 B Instructor
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IMO - Their is zero violations of rights when you voluntarily entering into a contract that holds you to standards within the organization. I see you have sited the 1st and 2nd as your examples in another post. While both of these rights guarantee you the right to have your our expressions and own a fire arm, they do not supersede the right of an establishment to entering into a binding voluntary contract with a person, who with signature and oath, gives said establishment the right to govern their liberties.

What I mean by this is that you are free to express your self through written, verbal and religious beliefs; nothing can take away your freedom to do that. However you signed a contract that you would follow specific protocols that would restrict when this can be done and how it can be done. The military has never said you are not free to express yourself, so long as it is withing your agreed upon contractual parameters. As far as the 2nd, never has the military said that when you serve you are not allowed to own a weapon. There are policies in place on where they can be stored and used. I will tell you all companies have policies such as this. My civilian employer encourages my weapon ownership, but forbids in on their properties.

As far as the COVID restrictions, one could argue that they are over reaching, but this is also not a violation of your rights. There is somewhat of an allowance in law; the justification for law is primarily to the prevention of harm, including paternalistic laws that seek to protect individuals from themselves. So with the restriction they imposed, it would seem the intention is to save us from ourselves. This is like speed limits, or texting and driving laws, even laws such as blood alcohol levels, or drinking age period.

This is all of course only my opinion based on my education and understanding of the law.
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SSG Squad Leader
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Nice

Not sure if the last part is sarcasm but no problem SSG (Join to see)
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SSG 12 B Instructor
SSG (Join to see)
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SSG (Join to see) - Not at all, I like when there is a discussion that provokes emotion from people. Adds value to the experience and I think this one is going to trigger a few people.

(Popcorn is almost ready...)
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SSG Squad Leader
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I think it already has haha SSG (Join to see)
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SSG 12 B Instructor
SSG (Join to see)
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SGT Robert Johnson - I agree with what you are saying about the ethics of a person/soldier and the level they hold themselves accountable to. However, the Army Ethics are the Army Ethics; interpretations and how you choose to live them is the individual soldier. I have been fortunate that during my time active and now guard, I have had exceptional leadership; I know this is not been the case for some.
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SPC Colin Jenks
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I dont feel any rights are violated as a SM. UCMJ affords you a fair a speedy trial of your peers. Which in the military its more of your peers than in the civilian world. You still have the right to free speech, just use your brain. You don't go to rallys and speak in uniform for most things. Freedom of religion? I was once told by a Chaplin, chaplains are huge on their rights and protecting the rights of SMs.
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SFC Domingo M.
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I always believed my constitutional rights were put on hold for the duration of my career. We live under our own Code of Military Justice (UCMJ) and we have an Oath we take every time we sign up, we have a Code of Conduct which tells us how to act in the performance of our duty in most situations. There's not much left up to the imagination.
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CSM Darieus ZaGara
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There is no conflict, the military cannot ascribe to regular rules and laws. You won’t change them. Many SM’s on there first enlistment feel the same, once you re-enlist you make a decision and the rest is mute.
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SFC James Cameron
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I’ve seen things that I would call borderline as far as due process, but you always have the choice of Court Martial in the UCMJ process.

It’s not the system’s fault if the SM doesn’t fully understand or use it. Unfortunately that’s how things go a lot of times.
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SGT Intelligence (S2)
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When you raise your hand you are given the privilege to serve. The trade off is that some small freedoms must be shelved for a time.
Some tall bodily about offering up their lives for this great country but balk at having to agree to certain guidelines.
I’ll try to be as PC here as possible: this commitment to our country and her people is greater than self so if you chose to raise your hand then STFU, pay your dues, do the job, and be great fun for the opportunity.
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SSG Squad Leader
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Like it. I’ll make sure to relay this statement along with the other discussions in here
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SGT Mary G.
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Edited >1 y ago
I came to the personal conclusion about that question while serving that being in the military is about "insuring" everyone's constitutional rights, I considered that UCMJ demands more of us for the purpose of accountability and structure that is essential to how the military successfully functions.
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SGT(P) Automated Logistical Specialist
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You openly gave up those rights so I don't believe there is a conflict.
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CSM Retired Csm....Able To Smile More Pften
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Easy answer? Freedom of speech is strongly limited. Open criticism of superiors can be punishable. Expressing religious opinions on gays, divorce., abortions (other opinionated realms) can be punishable . Tact, timing and audience must be important... These rules were the same with draft or volunteer Army.....officers need be extra careful especially in political comments.....and Facebook & Twitter can be used against you
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SFC Michael Hasbun
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No. All of us signed an employment contract with a behavioral clause. No one forced us to do it. You agreed to abide by the terms of the UCMJ. No one took anything from you.
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SFC Casey O'Mally
SFC Casey O'Mally
>1 y
Looking at it from an "employment contract" POV, the appropriate remedy for infractions should be job based. However violations of UCMJ, including those involving exercisong you Constitutional rigjts in ways which are not illegal in any penal code opens one up to being incarcerated. From the "employment contract" POV, I would say that rights are GREATLY infringed, particularly the 4th Amendment.
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SSgt CASS Test Station IMA Advanced Maintenance Technician, IMA
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Any violation of the UCMJ would be considered illegal and against your "employment contract" which specifically states you will obey the President of the United States and the orders of the officers appointed over me, according to regulations and the Uniform Code of Military Justice. Located in those regulations are your protections for your person, houses, papers and effects against unreasonable search and seizure.
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