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Do you call at ease for an E7 that you work for? Here is the change of command where I work. I work for an E7 who reports to another E7 who reports to the 1SG. Now its my understanding that you call at ease for someone in the position of 1SG or CSM. Am I wrong?
One day out of the blue the E7 that I work for, walked in the room and said .. so you guys **cking with me. So you guys arnt going to call at ease.I out rank you. Lets try this again. There were about 8 Staff Sergeants that were looking around at each other like is he really doing this.. So he walked back in an someone called at ease. After the meeting all the Staff Sergeants were talking about it. None of us have ever called at ease for an E7 that wasnt in a 1SG position. All the E6's that I work with have been in at least 14 years. So now im wondering have we been doing wrong all these years?
One day out of the blue the E7 that I work for, walked in the room and said .. so you guys **cking with me. So you guys arnt going to call at ease.I out rank you. Lets try this again. There were about 8 Staff Sergeants that were looking around at each other like is he really doing this.. So he walked back in an someone called at ease. After the meeting all the Staff Sergeants were talking about it. None of us have ever called at ease for an E7 that wasnt in a 1SG position. All the E6's that I work with have been in at least 14 years. So now im wondering have we been doing wrong all these years?
Posted in these groups: 
Customs and Courtesies
Customs and Courtesies
Posted 11 y ago
Responses: 30
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Outside of training or heavy formal occasions not typically no, but there has been an established working relationship and the fact that there are officers in our office as well. Will I stand at parade rest? Yes. Does the SFC usually dismiss it and tell me to relax? Also yes.
I call at ease for the 1SG and up, unless I am in my legal office as there is usually an MAJ - COL in the office. However I recently worked in a BLO where even with officers present we called at ease for the brigade CSM which I had not experienced previously.
Most CSM's I have seen immediately waive off and have discouraged the call because when they walk into the office they know we're busy and may be interacting with persons in the office or over the phone regarding the UCMJ or scheduling legal services and they don't want to interrupt that. A lot of E8's and E9's know that their presence is acknowledged and in a work setting don't typically need the ego stroking that comes with calling at ease in an office full of busy people that are working for brigade commanders and higher. That said, we're in a unique circumstance of understanding and can't forget the courtesies when we walk out of our AO.
We did have one that went off when no one called at ease and only acknowledged his presence with good morning sergeant major. The CSM didn't know that there was a BG in the room who was meeting with the JA's. The CSM found out real quick then the BG turned and said, "Good morning sergeant major, here for legal?" Almost laughed out loud at that, but we were busy setting up a board so back to work we went. Though funny enough I had a MG order us not to call the room to attention when I was working in his AO because, "We all have too much damn work to do for that kind of nonsense!" and he made sure to let everyone including the CSM know that no one was to call the room to attention while he was walking about.
I did have an SFC not in my lane grill me about courtesies regarding a MSG who was in my lane and why I referred to the MSG as "Mas'r Sarn't" rather then just "SaaarGent" and why I didn't call him by his full rank of Sergeant First Class. My reasoning at the time was well quite frankly SFC is a mouthful and a MSG was an E8 and I figured he deserved the courtesy from me even if he wasn't due one by regulation. Seemed to annoy said SFC and after the grilling I was approached by the 1SG who was in the SFC's lane and told me not to worry about it and that he's just a salty cuss. Apparently he had been watching the entire encounter, so I rogered Top and kept on my way as Top walked towards the SFC. What happened next I don't know, not my business at any rate.
So all those experiences figured, seems like that SFC was just on a trip.
I call at ease for the 1SG and up, unless I am in my legal office as there is usually an MAJ - COL in the office. However I recently worked in a BLO where even with officers present we called at ease for the brigade CSM which I had not experienced previously.
Most CSM's I have seen immediately waive off and have discouraged the call because when they walk into the office they know we're busy and may be interacting with persons in the office or over the phone regarding the UCMJ or scheduling legal services and they don't want to interrupt that. A lot of E8's and E9's know that their presence is acknowledged and in a work setting don't typically need the ego stroking that comes with calling at ease in an office full of busy people that are working for brigade commanders and higher. That said, we're in a unique circumstance of understanding and can't forget the courtesies when we walk out of our AO.
We did have one that went off when no one called at ease and only acknowledged his presence with good morning sergeant major. The CSM didn't know that there was a BG in the room who was meeting with the JA's. The CSM found out real quick then the BG turned and said, "Good morning sergeant major, here for legal?" Almost laughed out loud at that, but we were busy setting up a board so back to work we went. Though funny enough I had a MG order us not to call the room to attention when I was working in his AO because, "We all have too much damn work to do for that kind of nonsense!" and he made sure to let everyone including the CSM know that no one was to call the room to attention while he was walking about.
I did have an SFC not in my lane grill me about courtesies regarding a MSG who was in my lane and why I referred to the MSG as "Mas'r Sarn't" rather then just "SaaarGent" and why I didn't call him by his full rank of Sergeant First Class. My reasoning at the time was well quite frankly SFC is a mouthful and a MSG was an E8 and I figured he deserved the courtesy from me even if he wasn't due one by regulation. Seemed to annoy said SFC and after the grilling I was approached by the 1SG who was in the SFC's lane and told me not to worry about it and that he's just a salty cuss. Apparently he had been watching the entire encounter, so I rogered Top and kept on my way as Top walked towards the SFC. What happened next I don't know, not my business at any rate.
So all those experiences figured, seems like that SFC was just on a trip.
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I once had a 1SG whose rule was that the CQ, or CQ Runner call Attention when the CO entered the barracks, or At Ease if the 1SG arrived first.
He had some kind of German aristocratic bloodline in him and he liked to be treated that way. You also treated the 1SG's wife the same, you stood at Parade Rest to speak to her. I found out the hard way about this unwritten company rule as a young E-5. I was going through in processing, and this older lady came into the barracks and asked me a question. I was doing something at the time but I looked up from what I had been doing to see who was talking, but when I answered I had turned my attention back to what I had been doing while I answered her question. Next thing I know the 1SG is looking down his nose at me snarling about showing his wife the same courtesy as I would him.
These Barracks are in Germany, they are the big 4 story huge buildings with granite floors, and everything echos. I'm sure they heard everything on the 4th floor that the 1SG had said to me in his 5ish minute block of instruction in customs and courtesies, and how they were to be shown to his wife.
She stood behind him smirking at me the entire time...I'd been in country about 3 days.
Eventually enough anonymous notes got slid through the BC and CSM's car windows that something had to be done, we heard he retired from the Army in Germany and was working for his father in laws shipping conglomerate.
It got to the point where we would post 3 guys by the entrances so we wouldn't miss the 1SG coming in the barracks, he would try to come in and catch the CQ or Runnee sleeping.
He had some kind of German aristocratic bloodline in him and he liked to be treated that way. You also treated the 1SG's wife the same, you stood at Parade Rest to speak to her. I found out the hard way about this unwritten company rule as a young E-5. I was going through in processing, and this older lady came into the barracks and asked me a question. I was doing something at the time but I looked up from what I had been doing to see who was talking, but when I answered I had turned my attention back to what I had been doing while I answered her question. Next thing I know the 1SG is looking down his nose at me snarling about showing his wife the same courtesy as I would him.
These Barracks are in Germany, they are the big 4 story huge buildings with granite floors, and everything echos. I'm sure they heard everything on the 4th floor that the 1SG had said to me in his 5ish minute block of instruction in customs and courtesies, and how they were to be shown to his wife.
She stood behind him smirking at me the entire time...I'd been in country about 3 days.
Eventually enough anonymous notes got slid through the BC and CSM's car windows that something had to be done, we heard he retired from the Army in Germany and was working for his father in laws shipping conglomerate.
It got to the point where we would post 3 guys by the entrances so we wouldn't miss the 1SG coming in the barracks, he would try to come in and catch the CQ or Runnee sleeping.
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I disagree with some of the posts. So here are my two cents. As some of our fellow NCOs have so kindly pointed out, it is actually proper to call at ease for an NCO when he/she is senior in grade to those in the room, when the NCO enters the room (see comments for reference). It’s not about a power trip or ego as some of my peers have pointed out. It’s about tradition, proper decorum, and extending respect. Now I will ABSOLUTELY concur that the SFC (not E-7...that’s a pay grade) is probably out of line and unprofessional in the methodology utilized in making the correction. The bottom line is, even if you’re wrong, I will not degrade or belittle you while I make the on-the-spot correction. This is a hallmark of professionalism. Unfortunately, some of us chose to scream at our people to make our points. That isn’t necessary and only degrades command climate at best or incites division and subversion at worst.
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SGM (Join to see)
As a caveat-and my apologies for not adding this earlier-the “at ease” is generally only offered at the beginning and end of the senior person’s duty. Not upon every entry and exit. That would result in work stoppage. Additionally, the courtesy extends beyond the unit. For example, if the 1SG is already at work and the company called at ease, then later in the day, the BN CSM, the BDE CSM came in, you would call at ease when they each came and left unless they came in together. In that case, you call at ease for the most senior person.
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According to doctrine, he's right and absent anything supplementing or clarifying that doctrine further that's what you should fall back on.
I'm willing to bet, unless your unit just stood up or something, there is an SOP somewhere that delineates, when and where that's appropriate and how it should be handled. My first unit's SOP specifically stated the company commander and first sergeant at the beginning and end of the day only and anyone who out ranked them while within the administrative company area. Common areas like the platoon rooms where the squad leaders had their desks were situational. If training was occurring, we wouldn't stop. Downtime, "at ease" for anything E8 or higher. Work areas like supply, arms room, motor pool, warehouse were exempt. If somebody that important was coming, he/she probably had an escort from the local hq, and if they didn't it's because they didn't want the attention.
But like I said this was in the unit SOP. I called my old man (retired 1SG 13z) for his combat arms opinion and he just laughed. I asked my brother (former 11b) and he said some units have privates do it for specialists. Check the SOP. Even check the old ones, most company commanders say "unless otherwise directed or updated all rules and SOPs are in effect"
It's a nice catch all.
I'm willing to bet, unless your unit just stood up or something, there is an SOP somewhere that delineates, when and where that's appropriate and how it should be handled. My first unit's SOP specifically stated the company commander and first sergeant at the beginning and end of the day only and anyone who out ranked them while within the administrative company area. Common areas like the platoon rooms where the squad leaders had their desks were situational. If training was occurring, we wouldn't stop. Downtime, "at ease" for anything E8 or higher. Work areas like supply, arms room, motor pool, warehouse were exempt. If somebody that important was coming, he/she probably had an escort from the local hq, and if they didn't it's because they didn't want the attention.
But like I said this was in the unit SOP. I called my old man (retired 1SG 13z) for his combat arms opinion and he just laughed. I asked my brother (former 11b) and he said some units have privates do it for specialists. Check the SOP. Even check the old ones, most company commanders say "unless otherwise directed or updated all rules and SOPs are in effect"
It's a nice catch all.
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We would call it for our first sergeant in the mornings back at the battery before pt. Or when Smoke wanted to see all the Chiefs and we knew it was going to be a butt chewing... On the trail we taught the joes to say it every time they saw an drill or nco. But man o man did that get annoying. Annoying to the point that we would say " carry on" before they had a chance to call it. But of course any good Soldier will always call at ease for the TOPS and CSMs.
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I remember an E-7 who would come over to the CQ area every evening and would get mad if the CQ Soldiers did not call at ease. We informed the 1SG about this situation because we didnt know if he was correct or not. To our surprise, one evening our 1SG was hiding behind the CQ door and waiting for the E-7 to show up. I have to say that was the funniest scene ever. First time I saw an E-7 getting his ass chew out by a 1SG.
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SSG Williams,
Several points of interest that I would like to address pertaining to your question! While I understand the topic very well, I believe we should practice using rank rather than pay grades to identify or define people as opposed to their pay grade, which the later essentially does not define a person. I have always taken this position and know that many people in conversation refer to Soldiers by pay grade which is a bad practice, in my opinion. Nonetheless, the general rule applies as stated by SFC Jerry Crouch, however, in most cases this used in mixed company of ranks where junior enlisted Soldiers are present. In the moment, the best response is to adhere to the standard that is being projected by the senior ranking individual---in this particular situation. At the rank of Staff Sergeant, I would imagine it has been several years since you or any of your colleagues have been in Basic Training or Advanced Individual training so it is easy to assume the standard is only the way you previously perceived it to be. Perhaps, at your current rank you feel that you are all worthy of mutual respect amongst your fellow NCOs, which is very reasonable!
Consider the Golden and Silver Rules:
- One should treat others as one would like others to treat oneself.
- One should not treat others in ways that one would not like to be treated.
Now, the reason I believe this topic is worthy of discussion as it pertains to our values! The senior ranking person as well as those subordinates must consciously recognize that our respect and approach in any situation has the potential to negatively impact others and the situation. However, I believe the best way to address this topic at the unit level is to conduct NCO professional development, seeking guidance from the CSM, 1SGs, and NCOs at every level, researching the regulation, and using scenario based examples to capture the outcomes of behavior. Ultimately, we shouldn't lessen our military bearing or forget we are in the Army, but also, the value gained may enlighten everyone by making them aware of their actions. This will combat against toxicity and enhance the effectiveness of the work environment.
Several points of interest that I would like to address pertaining to your question! While I understand the topic very well, I believe we should practice using rank rather than pay grades to identify or define people as opposed to their pay grade, which the later essentially does not define a person. I have always taken this position and know that many people in conversation refer to Soldiers by pay grade which is a bad practice, in my opinion. Nonetheless, the general rule applies as stated by SFC Jerry Crouch, however, in most cases this used in mixed company of ranks where junior enlisted Soldiers are present. In the moment, the best response is to adhere to the standard that is being projected by the senior ranking individual---in this particular situation. At the rank of Staff Sergeant, I would imagine it has been several years since you or any of your colleagues have been in Basic Training or Advanced Individual training so it is easy to assume the standard is only the way you previously perceived it to be. Perhaps, at your current rank you feel that you are all worthy of mutual respect amongst your fellow NCOs, which is very reasonable!
Consider the Golden and Silver Rules:
- One should treat others as one would like others to treat oneself.
- One should not treat others in ways that one would not like to be treated.
Now, the reason I believe this topic is worthy of discussion as it pertains to our values! The senior ranking person as well as those subordinates must consciously recognize that our respect and approach in any situation has the potential to negatively impact others and the situation. However, I believe the best way to address this topic at the unit level is to conduct NCO professional development, seeking guidance from the CSM, 1SGs, and NCOs at every level, researching the regulation, and using scenario based examples to capture the outcomes of behavior. Ultimately, we shouldn't lessen our military bearing or forget we are in the Army, but also, the value gained may enlighten everyone by making them aware of their actions. This will combat against toxicity and enhance the effectiveness of the work environment.
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Technically speaking, yes you should. Does that always happen? No, infact it probably rarely happens.
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1SG Michael Blount
Calling at ease when ANY NCO walks into the AO is a way of life in BCT-land. We need to retain that level of discipline when people go from BCT/AIT to their units.
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SFC Jerry Crouch. I've been out for awhile so thank you for citing the FM. When I was assigned to the MPI Office we had an E-7 NCOIC so he was afforded this respect when he came into the office at the start of the duty day.
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