Can a Commander retroactively flag an SM with an unsigned PT card and never having been counseled?

As said a few times in here. yes a flag can be initiated. It just amazes me to no end. Once the mention of flag comes about, thats when the Soldiers are worried about failing a PT Test. How about doing the bare minimum needed to just Pass the PT test? then there is no worry about a flag. Then all of a sudden the SM wants to dig into regs anf find out what their options are. The Army is easy. Be in the right place, in the right uniform, PASS a PT test whenever directed, and qualify with your weapon. Easiest job i ever had!!!!!!!!!!

If the Soldier failed and it was a record APFT, then they get flagged. No amount of barracks layering will change that

I was once flagged for PT failure despite the fact that I had knee surgery the week before the PT test and was on profile and they never even told me I was flagged. I simply didn't make the promotion list and they kept giving me the run around when I asked why. I only found out about it a couple of years later when I got commissioned and had free access to my 201 file and saw the paperwork where I had been flagged. illegal as hell but they did it anyway. In this case they could retroactively counsel the SM for failing the test but since the card wasn't signed it would be hard to make the flag stick if the SM wanted to challenge it.

The idea is not to fail the APFT. End of story!

Well, I presume the last RECORD APFT on file is 8+ months old, so I suppose the SM could be ordered to take a RECORD APFT at any given time from this moment forward. So the flag could be initiated right here and right now without any retroactive drama. What would be the benefit of a retroactive action in this case? Take away a promotion? Create a paper chain of the command's inaction from prior? Bring to question the complexities of an inconsequential negative action and raise the visibility of the command's potentially hostile motivation?

I don't know if this is AC or RC, but as a RC Commander I prided my staff's ability to execute flags and chapter packets that STUCK. That said, it still took the CG's approval of anyone I pushed upwards to kick out.

Where I'm going is I had a soldier that didn't pass the APFT for FOUR YEARS. The CG wasn't kicking anyone out for APFT (you had to pop hot for drugs or get convicted of a crime to get kicked out). So I can see the motivation being low for "flagging" SM's. There are multiple ways to the same end though. That SM's ETS date was coming, and he wanted to re-enlist. Well, not with a properly executed flag. Not even a CG's inaction was going to save him. He needed MY waiver to re-enlist. NOPE I wouldn't give it. He had TWO WEEKS before ETS to provide a RECORD PASS APFT.

He hadn't passed in FOUR YEARS, and sure as hell wasn't going to pass in TWO WEEKS.

Well, I was wrong!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! He PASSED!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Flag removed, my signature wasn't part of the re-enlistment process (since he wasn't flagged). I assure you no one did this SM any scoring "favors". Sr. Company leadership wanted him gone, and I thought I had an ACE up my sleeve.

Funny how certain things motivate SM's

I digress..............

Bottom line: SM is wrong for failing APFT. CoC is wrong for not adhering to the phases, principles, components and types of training outlined in FM 7–22 as required by AR 350-1. Is this really a road the Commander wants to go down? From where I'm sitting it looks like the possible negatives he could face are greater than what the SM could face for PT failure, should this SM want to push the issue.

Can they flag? Yes. Will it hold up if the SM goes to JAG over it? Most likely not since 6 months have passed and the PT card was not signed. Did the card even say for record or for diagnostic on it? Lots of wiggle room on this one for the SM, but I can understand the CO wanting to get it done because you now have a soldier who doesn’t have a valid PT test on the books and is now on a profile and won’t be able to take one.

Short answer is yes they can flag them. To initiate the flag using a DA 268 doesn't require you submit any of the documentation with it. The unit is suppose to maintain the supporting docs for length of the flag. However if you fail a record APFT you should expect to be flagged.

There is no statute of limitations on a flag, yes they can still do it.
They can go back to the OIC of that test and get the 705 signed.
It is an administrative flag, so the flag can be imposed prior to the counseling session.
The counseling still has to happen, but neither the delay in flagging or delay in counseling is grounds to have the flag dismissed.
It has also been six months, the Soldier is already due another APFT, passing it prior to the flag action would be the best course of action here.

The DA 705 should be completely filled out as a substantiating document before the SFPA is coded. If the Soldier has not passed an APFT 8 months for Soldiers on orders and 15 for MDAY/TPU the Soldier can also be FLAGGED. AR 600-8-2 is the reg you want to read. Something's are worth fighting and some are not. Do PT!

b. “Army Physical Fitness Test failure” (Flag code J). Initiate a Flag when a Soldier fails a record APFT or when,
through the Soldier’s fault as determined by the commander, the Soldier fails to take the APFT within the time
prescribed by existing regulations, or when directed by the commanding officer (as provided for in AR 350–1). A Flag
is not required for a Soldier who has a permanent or temporary profile that precludes taking the APFT or is unable to
undergo an APFT because of conditions beyond the Soldier’s control (as determined by the commander). Soldiers with
a profile effective after the APFT will remain flagged until a record APFT is passed. A Flag is not required when the
commander determines the Soldier cannot be administered an alternate APFT because of conditions beyond the
Soldier’s control. Soldiers who become pregnant after being flagged for failing an APFT (as determined by a
physician) will remain flagged until successfully passing an APFT. Remove the Flag (code E) on date of compliance.
If, as determined by her primary care provider, the Soldier was pregnant at the time of APFT failure, the commander
will immediately remove the Flag (code Z).

2–6. Notification
The flagging authority, unit commander, or first line supervisor will counsel all Soldiers on active duty, in writing,
upon initiation of any Flag within 2 working days unless notification would compromise an ongoing investigation.
Soldiers not on active duty will be counseled regarding initiation of a Flag prior to the conclusion of the first training
period following the date the Flag was initiated. Counseling should include reason for the Flag, requirement for Flag
removal, and action prohibited by the Flag. All flagged Soldiers will be provided a copy of the DA Form 268 when the
Flag is initiated and when it is removed. Notifications for HQDA initiated flags may be delayed to protect against the
unintentional early release of a promotion board’s results.