Posted on Jul 22, 2016
Can a SGT be pinned SSG without ALC if in the IDES process?
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(EDIT 2: I've gotten great feedback (mostly) and have addressed the issue with my chain of command and HRC. I knew I would retire/separate at the promotion list grade if my MEB results in discharge, but what I found out is that being in the IDES process "holds my spot." If I am retained, I can then go to ALC and will be promoted upon completion. My main concern was that if I AM retained, I would miss that chance, but HRC has confirmed that I will be given the opportunity to attend the school and pin the rank if I'm not separated/retired. Thanks to most everyone for the great feedback and support. I'm officially un-following this thread, so I'll probably miss any further responses.)
(EDIT: Yes, it's about me. Also, I'm not looking for loopholes, I'm not whining about an unfair system, I'm not griping over what I feel is owed to me, I'm just trying to understand the letter of the law to determine if it's worth further effort or if I should just go to my VA exams, take my rating, and call it a day. Please keep the hooah hooah suck it up rhetoric to a minimum, I'm genuinely just trying to get meaningful advice :) )
Scenario: a solider makes cutoff for promotion to E6, but does not show up on the by-name list and is told it's because they have not been to ALC. Said soldier has been in the IDES/MEB/PEB process pending VA exams and ratings to determine if a medical separation/retirement is to occur and therefore cannot attend ALC. I have scoured the MILPER messages and AR 600-8-19. According to AR 600-8-19, the only requirement for promotion to SSG is completion of WLC/BLC, but the MILPER and the new STEP system says ALC is a requirement. The regulation states that IDES exempts the soldier from requirements such as weapons, APFT, and SRR, but not a word is spoken about ALC.
I do realize that if the soldier is promotable at the time of separation/retirement, they will be compensated and separated/retired at the promotion list grade. That's something, at least, but it's kinda crappy in my opinion that they get denied the promotion otherwise for something that may be no fault of their own.
I feel a combat-related injury that initiates an MEB/PEB shouldn't keep a soldier from getting pinned to a rank they've earned, not because they have chosen not to go to ALC, not because they have failed ALC, but because their injury has prevented it. I understand the reasoning, not filling a slot with a soldier that will otherwise not be able to serve the position or is going to potentially separate shortly afterwards, but if there's no concession or exception it feels like the soldier is being punished for shedding blood for their country.
(EDIT: Yes, it's about me. Also, I'm not looking for loopholes, I'm not whining about an unfair system, I'm not griping over what I feel is owed to me, I'm just trying to understand the letter of the law to determine if it's worth further effort or if I should just go to my VA exams, take my rating, and call it a day. Please keep the hooah hooah suck it up rhetoric to a minimum, I'm genuinely just trying to get meaningful advice :) )
Scenario: a solider makes cutoff for promotion to E6, but does not show up on the by-name list and is told it's because they have not been to ALC. Said soldier has been in the IDES/MEB/PEB process pending VA exams and ratings to determine if a medical separation/retirement is to occur and therefore cannot attend ALC. I have scoured the MILPER messages and AR 600-8-19. According to AR 600-8-19, the only requirement for promotion to SSG is completion of WLC/BLC, but the MILPER and the new STEP system says ALC is a requirement. The regulation states that IDES exempts the soldier from requirements such as weapons, APFT, and SRR, but not a word is spoken about ALC.
I do realize that if the soldier is promotable at the time of separation/retirement, they will be compensated and separated/retired at the promotion list grade. That's something, at least, but it's kinda crappy in my opinion that they get denied the promotion otherwise for something that may be no fault of their own.
I feel a combat-related injury that initiates an MEB/PEB shouldn't keep a soldier from getting pinned to a rank they've earned, not because they have chosen not to go to ALC, not because they have failed ALC, but because their injury has prevented it. I understand the reasoning, not filling a slot with a soldier that will otherwise not be able to serve the position or is going to potentially separate shortly afterwards, but if there's no concession or exception it feels like the soldier is being punished for shedding blood for their country.
Edited >1 y ago
Posted >1 y ago
Responses: 24
Not in the new promotion program. The NCOES schools are required for promotion
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SSG Jim Beverly
Yeah that's the answer I keep coming to. It just sucks that I don't have the chance to attend the school because of my MEB. Ah well, I'll still retire a SSG in the end :)
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SSG Jim Beverly
Thank you, sergeant. I admit I was a bit hesitant to post this question, I didn't want to wade through a wall of "too bad, suck it up, those are the rules" comments. I'm happy to say I have gotten nothing but support, honesty, and the meaningful advice I'd hoped for.
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If you made cutoff and meet the requirements to maintain SGT, then yes. But I will be honest, I'm using knowledge that is about a year old and did not research it.
You can not make the next rank if you have not completed the requirements for the current rank.
Also, even if I'm wrong, if your promotable and are medically retired, you should be retired at that rank (meaning SSG in your case).
But I would validate this with your case worker but I'm nearly certain I'm correct.
You can not make the next rank if you have not completed the requirements for the current rank.
Also, even if I'm wrong, if your promotable and are medically retired, you should be retired at that rank (meaning SSG in your case).
But I would validate this with your case worker but I'm nearly certain I'm correct.
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SSG (Join to see)
You owe the Army 1 year from the day you pin SSG. Do you have a year left in the military?
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SSG Jason Trammell
You are correct, I was medically retired due to injuries sustained 3 yrs before retirement, I was promotable to SSG and that's what I was retired as.
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SSG Jason Trammell
SSG Jim Beverly - SGT if you are in the process of MEB/PEB you will not be pinned, I was in ur same situation, I wished I had a better answer. I was in a non- deployable job in the WTU as Transportation NCOIC, with only 5yrs till I made 20. Instead of letting me continue in my current job I was replaced by a deployable soldier and forced to Retire. I was promotable for 3yrs but couldn't take APPT, or be recommended for any schools. I was would accept my fate and keep my head up, accept ur condition promotion when u get out, as I did.
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SSG Kim Wilson
When I had my MEB, because I was on the C10 roster, I got my E6 before I was discharged.
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