Posted on Oct 9, 2014
Counseling a Soldier who isn't in my direct line.
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I didn't see if this was asked before.
But my question is simple, as an NCO can I or should counsel a soldier, or conduct some type of corrective training (regardless of the manner be it push ups or writing an essay), for a Soldier who I am not in their NCO Support Channel. this issue has come up in the units that I have been in, with Soldiers saying that another NCO told them to do something, and the Soldier responds with, "well you aren't in my Support Channel, so I will talk to my NCO first." I know that that is not what right looks like, and I would counsel my Soldier and probably push for an Art 15 for something like that.
I am just looking for some type of clarification though regarding whether or not I have authority to counsel a Soldier who isn't mine, but maybe the same PLT or Company even.
But my question is simple, as an NCO can I or should counsel a soldier, or conduct some type of corrective training (regardless of the manner be it push ups or writing an essay), for a Soldier who I am not in their NCO Support Channel. this issue has come up in the units that I have been in, with Soldiers saying that another NCO told them to do something, and the Soldier responds with, "well you aren't in my Support Channel, so I will talk to my NCO first." I know that that is not what right looks like, and I would counsel my Soldier and probably push for an Art 15 for something like that.
I am just looking for some type of clarification though regarding whether or not I have authority to counsel a Soldier who isn't mine, but maybe the same PLT or Company even.
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Posted 10 y ago
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SFC(P) (Join to see), it's been a while since I was an NCO, but I still have advice for you. If you're talking about on-the-spot corrections, that's an easy one. If you have the Soldier do pushups or some other "task," that should be fine too (in my book, but my book is dated).
One thing I would definitely recommend is contacting the Soldier's NCO and letting the NCO know the details of what happened and how you handled it. Besides it being a professional courtesy, you'll eliminate the possibility that the Soldier might distort the truth about what happened to his/her NCO and potentially cause friction between you and that NCO.
For what it's worth, that's my advice. Let's see what others think.
One thing I would definitely recommend is contacting the Soldier's NCO and letting the NCO know the details of what happened and how you handled it. Besides it being a professional courtesy, you'll eliminate the possibility that the Soldier might distort the truth about what happened to his/her NCO and potentially cause friction between you and that NCO.
For what it's worth, that's my advice. Let's see what others think.
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SFC(P) (Join to see)
CW5 (Join to see), thank you for your insight, that does help me and clears some stuff up.
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When I was a kid, "back in the day" my parents and the other parents in the neighborhood had an agreement. If any of the parents saw any of the kids in the neighborhood acting a fool, they could administer the punishment. Kind of kept us in line. Nowadays, that would not work.
Kind of reminds me of the Army. You have to establish that relationship and understanding with your fellow NCOs. I agree with CW5 (Join to see) , you should definitely advise the SM's NCO. Also, make sure that what you are doing is within UCMJ. NCOs administer corrective action, re-enforcing a skill.
Kind of reminds me of the Army. You have to establish that relationship and understanding with your fellow NCOs. I agree with CW5 (Join to see) , you should definitely advise the SM's NCO. Also, make sure that what you are doing is within UCMJ. NCOs administer corrective action, re-enforcing a skill.
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CSM (Join to see)
And as a note on my RallyPoint skills progression, I just figured out how to mention/tag :)
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I am not sure how it works in the Army, but that wouldn't fly on the AF Side. You have the general NCO Authority to do on the spot corrections, not on the spot punishment, especially for folks not in your chain.
NCO's, under the UCMJ are not allowed to punish, only officers can do that. Smoking someone, even if framed as "corrective action" and not punishment put you in a precarious position of being charged with abuse of authority.
Here is an example. We had a hard charging MSgt (E7) in a previous unit that had just come back from TI duty. He had an issue with an NCO (SSgt/E5) in another duty section of the same unit. He walked in to the SSgt's office, locked them up at attention and proceeded to rail in to this NCO for his perceived infraction in front of the SSgt's troops. Once word got to the 1Sgt and Commander (not from the NCO but from their troops) the MSgt was relieved of all supervisory duties and became a "special project NCO" which was the kiss of death for his promotion. The reason was simple, he abused his position of authority.
I agree with the Chief that contacting their chain is the best thing you can do for anything other then an extremely minor correction.
NCO's, under the UCMJ are not allowed to punish, only officers can do that. Smoking someone, even if framed as "corrective action" and not punishment put you in a precarious position of being charged with abuse of authority.
Here is an example. We had a hard charging MSgt (E7) in a previous unit that had just come back from TI duty. He had an issue with an NCO (SSgt/E5) in another duty section of the same unit. He walked in to the SSgt's office, locked them up at attention and proceeded to rail in to this NCO for his perceived infraction in front of the SSgt's troops. Once word got to the 1Sgt and Commander (not from the NCO but from their troops) the MSgt was relieved of all supervisory duties and became a "special project NCO" which was the kiss of death for his promotion. The reason was simple, he abused his position of authority.
I agree with the Chief that contacting their chain is the best thing you can do for anything other then an extremely minor correction.
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Lt Col (Join to see)
I agree this will never fly in the Air Force. I think in addition to that it is a professional courtesy to bring up any issues to that persons supervisor since they are the ones charged with the ownership of taking care of said person. In some respects usurping their chain of command may cause further issues because now that person will know that at least did not know I did X and may still try to do it again.
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