Posted on Feb 25, 2014
SFC Anabel Cepero
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I have heard of Soldiers who always have to be taped, even though they are fit. Many say that they don't think the standards are very accurate. Do you think the standards are too strict, too leniant or not accurate?
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Responses: 36
SPC Greg Burnett
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18 year old senior in high school, wrestler, PV2 in the guard, already been to basic.
Went for a body composition test for wrestling to determine what weight we could go down to.
5'10", 200#, came up with 12% with an electronic test where they hooked one lead to our wrist and one to our ankle.
At the time, government health standards called me obese at 175#.
Do the math and my lean body mass was 176#.
Had semi-annual weigh-in that weekend and came up 21% by the tape; 20% allowable although I hadn't finished AIT yet so...
They let me bring in the print out from the other test.
Put me off to the tape real quick like.
5 years later, my college roommate was a biomedical engineering grad student.
He thesis was on body fat testing methods.
His conclusion was that the tape was just slightly more accurate than eyeballing.
I would think the way things are these days there would be some little electronic thingee that could be used.
There's gotta be an app for that. ;-)
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Sgt Luke Charles
Sgt Luke Charles
>1 y
I dont think that the Army believes that waist size is an accurate bodyfat measurement but it is an excellent predictor of health. People with 41+ inch waists are as a GROUP not healthy. Im not talking about wrestling and bodybuilding Im talking about hypertension, heart disease, diabetes, joint pain and hyperlipidemia.
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SGT Thomas Sullivan
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It is not accurate, Period. I am more concerned with appearance while in uniform, PT score, and capability to perform one's job above and beyond.
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1LT Infantry Officer
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There is a big problem with the Army's general population viewing "overweight" as being the problem.  You can make the weight on the screening table and still get flagged for not meeting body fat standards.

The reason the height and weight screening table is so narrow is because making that specific weight at that specific height within that age bracket and gender pretty much guarantees that someone who doesn't look to be over-fat isn't over-fat.

Why does the circumference value suck so much?  Because it is the cheapest, repeatable method of estimating body fat percentage for an individual.  Everything else requires something more than dimestore fibreglass measuring tape.
I personally am a fan of electrostatic resistance scales that measure body fat percentage as a difference in current dropped over the total mass of tissue as defined by height and weight.  This would eliminate the no-neck over-fat population as well.  Problem:  These scales cost money and require maintenance.  Tape is cheap.
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SFC Ralph E Kelley
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Wahoo ... You got me started - I was 230lb, 6 foot tall, never passed tape. Went to be immersion tested semi-annually and came out with an average of 17% body fat every time. I was able to deadlift 250 lbs and do 8 reps. The main problem was in the immersion tank I 'floated' (lung capacity) so they always had me wear a 40 lb vest so I could sink.
The standards are just that - standards - a guide rather than a hard and fast rule. My opinion, expressed with candor and truthfulness was some NCOs and officers were either lazy or unable to understand the 'intent' of the overweight standards was to provide the Services with fit soldiers.
I will say that was only one unit. Every other unit had more sense.
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SSG Sr. Probation And Parole Officer
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I have failed tape I have passed tape its a numbers game. put me next to someone who weighs the same as me and they will look totally different. I have seen people much fatter than me not even have to get taped. like belly hanging out and not get taped.. wtf. then here I am. I am a muscular female. I usually fail cause of my hips.. which are much wider now because I had a kid. surprisingly I weight 20 pound more than I did prepregnancy but clothing is two sizes down. EVERYONE is different. I just know I have to beat the tape every time. BUlk up my neck and try to loose some inches from my wide ass hips. not to mention God gifted me a bubble butt from birth. its unrealistic. so many different body types and I know if I got a caliper test this wouldn't be an issue.
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SFC Healthcare Specialist (Combat Medic)
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I agree that there needs to be a standard and I do not believe that the standard is too strict. However, what they need to change is the taping itself. I have seen people with six pack abdominals fail a tape and people with 40+ inch waists and look disgusting in their uniform pass their tape. I won't say that it is unfair, however, it is HIGHLY inaccurate as (the male standard at least) ws created in 1958 using the science at that time. The US has the most technogically advance military in the world, yet we use these archaic ways to decide if someone is "fit" enough to stay in the Army.
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Sgt Luke Charles
Sgt Luke Charles
>1 y
Im just curious how does a person with six pack abs have a 41+ inch waist? Lennox Lewis who has a 29.6 BMI has a 34 inch waist and Mike Tyson has a 30.7 BMI and also taped at 34 inches are you saying soldiers are carrying more muscle than those two guys? Note those are pre fight weights and measurements but you get my drift. BMI and tape measurements are not the best predictors( although I say they are very good) of who looks fit but they are excellent for predicting who is going to have diseases and disabilities. Show me a guy with a 30 BMI and 41 inch waist and Ill show you a guy with hypertension, diabetes, hyperlipidemia, and other health problems in the near future.
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SFC Healthcare Specialist (Combat Medic)
SFC (Join to see)
>1 y
Sgt Luke Charles - It wasn't the same person. I have seen someone with a six pack fail AND another person with a 41 inch waste pass.
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Sgt Luke Charles
Sgt Luke Charles
>1 y
SFC (Join to see) - Do you happen to know the waist size of the six pack guy? The one fault I do see in the test is that if you have a 19" neck you will pass the tape test easier than most. If you have a 16" neck you need to have a waist smaller than 41" that sounds reasonable to me and health wise if you are going to boot people those who dont meet that standard would be the logical choices. Basically after you do 10 the military wants you out. I think like 80% of the military is under 35yrs of age.
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SFC Healthcare Specialist (Combat Medic)
SFC (Join to see)
>1 y
Sgt Luke Charles - Unfortunately I do not recall. It was quite some time ago, about 3 years. He had definition but was still pretty barrel chested kind of guy. It was probablu around 37-38 inches. Our batallion at the time made medics do all tapings as I guess they thoughy we were specially trained to do so (we're not).
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MAJ Contracting Officer
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The tape is not a standard body fat percentage is the standard, screening weights is simply a time saving tool the fact that you need to be taped should have no bearing whatsoever on your perceptions. All bodybuilders need to be taped, but they have low body fat percentages. If you fail your body fat percentage test then pass the screening weight you still need to be taped until you pass the tape test.
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SGT Richard H.
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I had to be taped at pretty much every weigh-in, and I taped out at about 14-16% every time. I'm not really qualified to say for sure that they are inaccurate, but I can definitely say that they don't encompass people who work out well beyond the standard and have a higher weight without a higher body fat content.
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SSG John Erny
SSG John Erny
11 y
SGT Richard Hanner, we had a rigger who was an honest to god body builder, he got taped every time. One he was getting taped and LT "Safety Sally" was giving him a hard time. He took off his T-shirt and flexed, Her jaw about hit the floor.
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SGT Richard H.
SGT Richard H.
11 y
I was by no means a body builder, but I did hit the gym a couple of nights a week, road march on my own time 1-2 times a week, swim 1-2 times a week, and usually did pushups & sit-ups in my room at lunch, all in addition to unit PT...which was definitely enough to call myself "in shape".
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Sgt Luke Charles
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Edited 11 y ago
The standards are about health there are exceptions to the rules but that is where the tape measurement comes in. Does any one really think that a person who has a 40 inch waist is fit? What is unscientific about the correlation between waist size and bodyfat level? I see someone using Arnold Schwarzenegger as an example Arnold claims his waist was 32 in so it was probably 34 maybe 36 tops lets remember Arnold took steroids and dedicated his whole life to"looking"fit from his teens until he was about 50. Medically people within those weight ranges are healthier than those outside of it that is not true for each individual but VASTLY true overall.
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SGT Kristin Wiley
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Edited >1 y ago
The standards are not accurate. From my experience 80% of women get taped, are Army women really that overweight or are the standards scientifically inaccurate? I would definitely say inaccurate, women in the military have more muscle than the general population. Muscle weighs more than fat, so I would say that we need to be authorized more weight. I do bodybuilding, and I flucate between 5lbs over my standards to within standards. I would assess that I'm on the average to fit side of army women so in an ideal world the 'average' SHOULD easily fit within standards. My body fat is around 24-26%, but with the Army tape test I measure 28-32% depending on the indivdual taping. What bugs me the most though, is that fatbodies can pass our tape test, while fit individuals get condemned by it. If we aren't going to have an accurate standard, the Army needs to define what a neat and professional appearance is so we can remove those who clearly do not fit in this category.
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Sgt Luke Charles
Sgt Luke Charles
>1 y
BMI is not the best measurement but when combined with waist measurement it is an excellent predictor of health men with waists over 40 inches and women with waists over 35 inches are much more likely to have diseases and disabilities. If you are going to draw down the forces those are the wisest people to separate. Is it really common for a female bodybuilder to have a waist over 35 inches?Im no expert but I doubt it.
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SGT Kristin Wiley
SGT Kristin Wiley
>1 y
I agree to an extent, but there are some people who are just built differently. Maybe a height to waist ratio would be more appropriate.
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