Posted on Feb 7, 2014

Double Standards for senior and junior ranks?

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Whats your opinion on military double standard? For example, Im a SPC(P) and if I was to fail a height/weight I would be flagged and barred, plus I'd lose my promotable status. If a SFC or MSG was to have the same scenario, would they face the same repercussions? Do you believe standards should be enforced Army wide regardless of rank?

Another example, theres a MSG I know that got a DUI after his SFAAT mission and his only being "forced retired". I would like to hear other peoples opinions on this.

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Edited 12 y ago

Posted 12 y ago

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Responses: 20

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SSgt (Join to see)

Posted 12 y ago

am sure you have heard of RHIP but that is not a good example of leadership to be out of shape and being cavalier about it. I cannot imagine a Senior NCO being marginal. If they are true leaders they lead by example. I was very athletic and personally felt expectations should be higher for us NCOs and not think that RHIP is a good role model.

So my answer is that they should be tip top and I bet I could beat most older NCOs in fitness.

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SFC Randy Purham

Posted 12 y ago

I concur with 1SG Rink's response. However, I would consider that person's service to the military in consideration and other factors, such as the overall situation and the state-of-mind of the individual. Now, in terms of it being a double standard across the board, YES. There is, in fact there's a triple standard, because Officers fall into a different realm of punishments than enlisted do. There should be an overarching categories of punishments for infractions that are fitting across the board and instead of it being up to units on how they handle it - which leaves room for continued behavior in follow on assignments - would streamline the perception of favoritism and "getting off the hook". Situations like DUIs, SHARP/EO, and Drugs should remain to intolerable and unacceptable acts in which the person has conscientiously decided to error in and should be punished IAW UCMJ guidelines - regardless of service tenure. APFT, HT/WT and other administrative infractions of that nature should be unified - once again, regardless of rank/time served.

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SSgt (Join to see)

12 y

I am older than most here but 1st Sgt Rink is a guy I would die for. I have confidence in him and I know most enlisted would too. It is a character thing as I see. I love any NCO who would die trying to make a good impression. If anything I am not disingenuous because officers and senior NCOs have the terrible burden of having to shoulder of a DEAD or injured persons.

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SSG (Join to see)

Posted >1 y ago

The standards apply to ALL ranks and they will be flagged if not.
Regarding that MSG's DUI, I am quite sure he is getting article 15 in addition to GOMAR; pretty much impossible to retire. He may be busted all the way down to private but you can't see that.
Just what you saw isn't the same as what he actually gets.

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SGM Bill Frazer

Posted >1 y ago

They are- I have seen it, where MSG's took retirement rather than get barred. Of course you do understand that the older you get the easy it is have a profile, right?

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MSG Frank Kapaun

Posted >1 y ago

It was my observation that officers, especially O4s and above were allowed to get away with some sketchy shit. The CSM/SGM rank was also a protected class and allowed to get away with damn near anything.

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MSG Brad Sand

Posted 11 y ago

SSG(P) (Join to see)

They would and should. I believe the standards should be enforced, but there also needs to be a level of common sense applied as well.

The example of the MSG with the DUI, he was forced to retire...what more would you want to happen? Is it your opinion that getting a DUI should have caused the Army to discount his 20 plus years of service? Sergeant, some people think I'm hard, but I do not have anything on you?

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LTC (Join to see)

Posted 11 y ago

I know of several officers that have been flagged for failing a PT test. Is it perfect? No, but it depends on the unit.

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SFC Michael Hasbun

Posted 12 y ago

How to put this gently....

The average SPC will have two to four years experience. Maybe one or two deployments, minimal schooling, minimal education, minimal experience...

That SFC or MSG will likely have triple to quadruple your experience, schooling, education and training. To put it bluntly, they are worth more to the Army than five of you. The loss of a senior NCO eliminates countless years of investment. A SPC has thousands of youngsters ready to take his place at a moments notice. In short, expendable and interchangeable.

To use a sports analogy, it's like comparing your bat boy to your all star...

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SSG Charles Coats

Edited 12 y ago

Posted 12 y ago

SPC (P) Hildago,

While this may be an extreme example (but is certainly not an outlier) and is not related to PT/HT/WT, it serves to underscore the overall point you're trying to make:

http://www.armytimes.com/article/20120701/NEWS/207010309/Colonel-s-sentence-bigamy-case-draws-outrage

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SGT(P) (Join to see)

Posted 12 y ago

Has anyone mentioned re-education? IF it's a first offense, shouldn't one be afforded the chance to redeem themselves. This goes for all ranks. Obviously, there has to be a punishment but it should include rehab and a chance to change.

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SSG(P) (Join to see)

12 y

Good point. I agree that there should be a second chance for soldiers that have made a mistake in judgment, regardless of rank.

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SSG(P) (Join to see)

12 y

Good point. I agree that there should be a second chance for soldiers that have made a mistake in judgment, regardless of rank.

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Double Standards for senior and junior ranks?

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