Posted on Jul 31, 2015
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Soldier with PTSD after three tours shoots fiance and then himself. How can we get to soldiers before this type of tragedy? How do we identify them if they are not requesting help for themselves?

http://www.aol.com/article/2015/07/30/pregnant-woman-shot-to-death-in-murder-suicide-unborn-baby-surv/21216015/
Posted in these groups: 78568930 PTSD
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PO2 Brandon Boucher
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Unfortunately unless that ask for help or acknowledge they need help, it isn't something that we can "force" people to do. Admitting that you are suffering is something that the military beats out of you very quickly, but when you transfer to civilian life, we have no way of putting back the fact that it is ok to ask for help.

The only thing that I've been able to is offer a Group Session for Combat Veterans to discuss things and help with any challenges they might have. This is independent of the VA. I also teach mindfullness and meditation techniques that I myself have had tremendous personal experience with.

It is a sad state when our warriors aren't welcomed or feel safe asking for help when they transition to civilian life.
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Thank you for your reply. I'm happy to hear about your sessions independent of the VA.
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PO2 Brandon Boucher
PO2 Brandon Boucher
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They have to be, the VA is mired in so much Redtape that we have to take matters into our own hands before we end up loosing more and more of our brothers and sisters to a system that was never designed to turn a warrior back into a civilian. They expect us to be able to kill without mercy or hesitation and then when we are used up they simple say thanks, go be with other humans that won't understand what you have been through....we need to take matters into our own hands.
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The issue, as I've written extensively about, is that DOD, and in particular Army, deny the existence of PTSD as a corporate culture. There are several factors involved. They include "Huah Huah three bags full" (to misquote a nursery rhyme...), the fear of $$ cost of dealing with it, the fear of hits to readiness if too many soldiers fall out due to PTSD and just plain bad leadership, among others...

The only way for this to change is if the President/CINC, Congress and SECDEF along with the Service Secretaries, make a concerted effort to confront the problem. This will, however, have a huge dollar cost to accurately assess and treat every soldier and other active duty person with PTSD. It will also have a huge readiness cost in terms of soldiers taken off deployability, and there will be some goldbrickers...

Sadly, as in everything else, there is a cynical Dollar calculus that pertains. In the corporate liability world, they tend to value life at $1 Million. Deadly products won't change until the assessed life cost far exceeds the cost of making the changes to their products.

Because Federal dollars are limited, and with a very stingy Congress in place that won't work with the President anyway, they are highly unlikely to free up the money needed to adequately deal with this...

After all, if an SGLI claim is $400K, that's a lot cheaper than a lifetime of treating a soldier for PTSD...
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Thank you for your reply, we do need to change. Numbers, money, funding, soldier readiness... drives everything.
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MSgt Curtis Ellis
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This is a hard one, but bear with me... You would have to have more than just your basic & everyday knowledge of someone to do this. Me (I don't mind), for example, spent the majority of my time "alone" and I learned to hide it well from those around me, that is, except for my family. No one else even had a clue (discovered this afterwards)... In fact, no one would know until I had a life changing situation happen that forced me to seek help... The "true loners" are a hard group to reach because they let no one in and can effectively function normally around anyone or any group of people... To me, and for the case posted above, the best person to catch and report this early (my opinion only) can only be those individuals who are more than closest to that person. Family members, parents or usually a spouse, or, given their age, their children. They, more than often know what is happening, and will "keep it in the family", until it gets unbearable or in most of these cases, too late... I use myself as an example as it's the best way I can explain it, as my ex and boys all knew... I "convinced" my ex I was "fine" and she, in turn, "pushed" it to my boys... Until she had had enough... No, other than verbally, I didn't "harm" anyone, but the truth is, verbally as well as other actions, does harm... I was really out there and so fixated on myself, I couldn't realize the damage I was doing to my family, and they never said a word... It's hard to seek help when you really have no flipping clue of whats going on with you... What you learn in the courses and classes doesn't even come close to describing it, and it's not until you finally go for treatment for something unrelated, and a nurse asks you "the right" question that, without thinking, you answer, does it finally click and you finally realize "Hey, I really do resemble that!!!". Either that, or you get the post above... I am one of the fortunate ones... What I write here doesn't even begin to cover what was going on with me, and it's different for everyone, but I will honestly say, had my ex (not blaming her or my boys) had acted sooner, maybe I would have gotten treatment sooner... So yes, I think getting the soldiers family to be willing to "out" their soldier (that's the way their going to feel... ask my boys) may significantly reduce suicide/murder-suicide by our Vets, but how to convince blood to turn in blood? Other than making it mandatory that family members attend these briefing and classes with their Soldier, Sailor, Airman or Marine, (which would be preferred) that one, I can't answer, as I was able to "accidentally" get the help I needed through no fault of anyone...
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MSgt Curtis Ellis
MSgt Curtis Ellis
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CPT (Join to see) - I think any program would be helpful, but I also know that we have quite a few of them in place that tags the service member at least once or twice a month directly or indirectly, so I'm not sure how to answer this. I've lost two military brothers in scenarios similar to the above, and taken my own spiraling experience, come up with an idea that may assist, but due to legal and other reasons, we cant employ, and I think, therein lies the issue; what we can and cant do, not just for our brothers, but for their families as well. I've always been taught that "the family is just as much of that soldier as the soldier is of himself", I just wish that training, specifically, was effectively extended to them as well... It won't eliminate it every issue, but I do feel that it would be beneficial. I hope this make sense, and thank you for your comment/question.
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MSgt Curtis Ellis - I lost my brother to this and a squad leader, what you are saying does make sense.
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SMSgt Tony Barnes
SMSgt Tony Barnes
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One thing is to help soldiers to understand that seeking help is okay. Talk them into allowing a medical board. So many suck it up and ETS with no benefits. I work in the Army Wounded Warrior (AW2) program and I can certainly get guys help. Doesn't mean we haven't lost some good clients to the ravages of PTSD...but, we try our best to get them tied into resources that will help...deeply help.
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MSgt Curtis Ellis - thank you for sharing your story.....i hope someone reads it and maybe gets a little bit of a wake up call before they travel the same road....God bless and keep you safe.
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