Posted on Dec 31, 2015
How should a situation in the MCX about wearing a cover in the building be handled properly?
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How should a situation in the MCX about wearing a cover in the building be handled properly?
NEITHER MYSELF OR MY WIFE ARE IN THE HABIT OF TELLING A LIE OR MAKING UP A STORY - IT HAPPENED! FOCUS ON THE QUESTION - NOT WETHER YOU BELIEVE THE INCIDENT HAPPENED OR NOT!
RP Members was this handled properly by the Junior Officer, SgtMaj, or the mother? What would you have done?
THIS WAS A REAL SITUATION THAT TOOK PLACE YESTERDAY 12/30/2015
CORRECTION: I've receive collaboration from another lady who also had firsthand knowledge of this incident in the MCX - "The "youth" was not an AD USMC, but part of a group of Young Marines. Her description of this group is that it is one for troubled youth to attempt to instill discipline and maybe bring them into the fold."
I apologize to all of those individuals that I stood firm on with, that it was young Marine Private (based on all the information I received), but the discussion, question, and feedback on how the situation was handled by the Junior Officer, Sgt Mgr, and Mother have been outstanding - that I don't apologize for - thanks
If anything, I thoroughly enjoyed the story and my wife called me at home immediately following the incident - she knew I would enjoy hearing about it. I just said, "that SgtMaj owns that young Marine!"
RP Members this one comes from the wife that works at Camp Pendleton, CA Marine Base in the MCX.
A young "Youth" Marine was in the check-out line with his mother and "CORRECTION" (put his cover on inside!) He was approached by a AD Marine (Junior Officer) and asked to remove the cover. Immediately the young "Youth" Marine took up the defensive and asked the junior officer "who the F*** are you?" The Junior Officer then got into the young "Youth" Marine's face and told him to have some respect and remove the cover - it escalated into a shouting match in the check-out line in the MCX. Coming from the back of the store there was a loud roar from a Sergeant Major in the Marines (built like a tank according to my wife). He bellowed, "both of you shut your mouth there are families in here!" The MCX went silent and several employees and Marines hit the deck (no kidding). The SgtMaj came to the front and grabbed the young "Youth" Marine the by collar escorting him and the Junior Officer out of the MCX with the Young "Youth" Marine's mother yelling, "don't touch my boy!"
NEITHER MYSELF OR MY WIFE ARE IN THE HABIT OF TELLING A LIE OR MAKING UP A STORY - IT HAPPENED! FOCUS ON THE QUESTION - NOT WETHER YOU BELIEVE THE INCIDENT HAPPENED OR NOT!
RP Members was this handled properly by the Junior Officer, SgtMaj, or the mother? What would you have done?
THIS WAS A REAL SITUATION THAT TOOK PLACE YESTERDAY 12/30/2015
CORRECTION: I've receive collaboration from another lady who also had firsthand knowledge of this incident in the MCX - "The "youth" was not an AD USMC, but part of a group of Young Marines. Her description of this group is that it is one for troubled youth to attempt to instill discipline and maybe bring them into the fold."
I apologize to all of those individuals that I stood firm on with, that it was young Marine Private (based on all the information I received), but the discussion, question, and feedback on how the situation was handled by the Junior Officer, Sgt Mgr, and Mother have been outstanding - that I don't apologize for - thanks
If anything, I thoroughly enjoyed the story and my wife called me at home immediately following the incident - she knew I would enjoy hearing about it. I just said, "that SgtMaj owns that young Marine!"
RP Members this one comes from the wife that works at Camp Pendleton, CA Marine Base in the MCX.
A young "Youth" Marine was in the check-out line with his mother and "CORRECTION" (put his cover on inside!) He was approached by a AD Marine (Junior Officer) and asked to remove the cover. Immediately the young "Youth" Marine took up the defensive and asked the junior officer "who the F*** are you?" The Junior Officer then got into the young "Youth" Marine's face and told him to have some respect and remove the cover - it escalated into a shouting match in the check-out line in the MCX. Coming from the back of the store there was a loud roar from a Sergeant Major in the Marines (built like a tank according to my wife). He bellowed, "both of you shut your mouth there are families in here!" The MCX went silent and several employees and Marines hit the deck (no kidding). The SgtMaj came to the front and grabbed the young "Youth" Marine the by collar escorting him and the Junior Officer out of the MCX with the Young "Youth" Marine's mother yelling, "don't touch my boy!"
Marines
Discipline
Regulation
Military bearing
What Would You Do
Edited >1 y ago
Posted 10 y ago
Responses: 937
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The only correct response from the offending Jr Marine should have been Aye, aye, SIR! But, the Officer could have, should have handled the situation much differently. There is the old Corps storey of COL Puller witnessing an exchange between a Jr Officer and an Enlisted Marine.
The Enlisted Marine failed to salute and offer the greeting of the day as the Jr Officer passed him, the Jr Officer placed the Marine at attention and ordered him to perform 100 Salutes with the proper greeting of the day. And started to walk off, where upon COL Puller stopped the Jr Officer and said, "Very good spot correction Lieutenant, but with every salute that CPL is rendering recognizing your Rank, a proper salute will be returned by you as the Marine corps regulation, Leadership and decorum requires." The action was carried out correctly as COL Puller stayed and reviewed. Of course, the dialogue was certainly different, but the story was told to us by our Senior Drill Instructor.
I'm from an "Older Corps" 77'-83', but not in my wildest, delusioned mindset would I ever think of showing that kind of disrespect to an Officer, Jr or otherwise.
The Enlisted Marine failed to salute and offer the greeting of the day as the Jr Officer passed him, the Jr Officer placed the Marine at attention and ordered him to perform 100 Salutes with the proper greeting of the day. And started to walk off, where upon COL Puller stopped the Jr Officer and said, "Very good spot correction Lieutenant, but with every salute that CPL is rendering recognizing your Rank, a proper salute will be returned by you as the Marine corps regulation, Leadership and decorum requires." The action was carried out correctly as COL Puller stayed and reviewed. Of course, the dialogue was certainly different, but the story was told to us by our Senior Drill Instructor.
I'm from an "Older Corps" 77'-83', but not in my wildest, delusioned mindset would I ever think of showing that kind of disrespect to an Officer, Jr or otherwise.
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I don't doubt anything with regards to disrespect these days. Too many of our young people have grown up to entitled or offended and expect instant gratification. It starts in school when a teacher corrects an action and the parents threaten the teacher and school. It continues with telling kids they don't have to listen to a cop or start a conversation with 'I know my rights'. The parent in this case should have said, 'Listen to the Lt...take off your 'hat'." The Lt probably had steam coming out of his ears. He'd have been doing all of us a great deal of discredit if he'd have just shook his head and ignored it.
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It would seem that the "Youth Marine" copped an attitude which is probably part of why he was in the program but I am sure that those in that program must have some identifier on their uniform that lets everyone know that they are not full Marines so the shave tail Jr officer should have recognized that and acted accordingly. Every military member knows that confrontations like what is described here should be removed from public scrutiny. That is what the junior officer should have done in the first place. I do not understand though, how a person involved in a civilian/Marine Corp intervention program has Exchange privileges, especially with a civilian mother in tow. That seems what is wrong with this whole scenario.
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The Young Marines is not a group intended for at-risk or troubled youth. It’s simply a military-oriented youth program sponsored by the Navy and Marine Corps League. One is supposed to be free of a criminal record and in good academic standing prior to “enlisting.” Unfortunately, many parents enroll their disrespectful and misbehaving miscreants to instill “discipline and respect” instead of actually parenting themselves. If one of my boys had’ve done that at the AAFES PX, that cover would be so far up their butt their eyes would turn Multicam. Shameful that the mother would try to protect a child who has the gall to speak that way to anyone.
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not to over stay my welcome... or comments. I also did a part time on "the love boat" during desert storm in Bahrain... basically, baby sitting an bouncing. our commander had made it unnecessary to wear a cover in our so called "area". we had access to the naval port in that theater and went there quite a few times to get supplies (beer). one day , we were called out by a naval noncom about our lack of head attire. we informed him that we weren't required to wear it in our operation. his reply was that regardless on this post we were. no fights... no scuffles... no calling home. the next time we went we wore our cover. simple respect. nothing more or less. keep it simple people... it's not a battle of egos.... it's the same battle and we are all fighting it. never saw a winning team that fought amongst themselves... especially over trivial stuff.
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SPC Stephan Baker
side note.... there is irony here... us being M.Ps. we were armed and in that sense would not have to remove our cover indoors and yet were called out for not wearing one outside lol
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I have a problem with today's people they are so crude they don't even know how to wear a cover they either wear one too large, backward, and "NEVER" take it off even when in church or at the dinning table. I'm from old school I have a little respect when I enter a building Mine comes off. " When I mom was alive and you entered her home she would direct you to a Hat rack and the first think she always asked are you hungary do you want something to eat? You better be sure to go and wash your hands prior to seating yourself at her table as well other wise she would excuse you to go do so.
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Tactfully, offering the offending individual the opportunity to correct themselves. Hopefully they will see it as a learning opportunity, and not as some meddling soul that had nothing better to do.
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This is still alive so I will add my two cents. When I was a young 1LT (1984), I had a SP4 mouth off at me in the mess hall with no NCOs around. I locked him up and explained that just because it was a mess hall, SP4s don’t talk back to LTs. I wasn’t loud but I had Soldiers from my platoon there. It would have set a bad precedent if I just blew it off. Of course if one of our NCOs had been there, it would have been bloody. The post CSM called down to the unit the next day and said that he wanted me to report to him and apologize for embarrassing the SP4. I told him, that if he wanted me to report to him, he needed to go through my chain of command. The CSM must have checked the E-4’s story because I never heard anything. I heard later that the E4 was in the process of being kicked out. The bottom line is that there were probably a lot more details in the story. There is a time and place for LTs to stand up to CSMs, but make absolutely sure that you are correct.
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