Posted on Dec 31, 2015
How should a situation in the MCX about wearing a cover in the building be handled properly?
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How should a situation in the MCX about wearing a cover in the building be handled properly?
NEITHER MYSELF OR MY WIFE ARE IN THE HABIT OF TELLING A LIE OR MAKING UP A STORY - IT HAPPENED! FOCUS ON THE QUESTION - NOT WETHER YOU BELIEVE THE INCIDENT HAPPENED OR NOT!
RP Members was this handled properly by the Junior Officer, SgtMaj, or the mother? What would you have done?
THIS WAS A REAL SITUATION THAT TOOK PLACE YESTERDAY 12/30/2015
CORRECTION: I've receive collaboration from another lady who also had firsthand knowledge of this incident in the MCX - "The "youth" was not an AD USMC, but part of a group of Young Marines. Her description of this group is that it is one for troubled youth to attempt to instill discipline and maybe bring them into the fold."
I apologize to all of those individuals that I stood firm on with, that it was young Marine Private (based on all the information I received), but the discussion, question, and feedback on how the situation was handled by the Junior Officer, Sgt Mgr, and Mother have been outstanding - that I don't apologize for - thanks
If anything, I thoroughly enjoyed the story and my wife called me at home immediately following the incident - she knew I would enjoy hearing about it. I just said, "that SgtMaj owns that young Marine!"
RP Members this one comes from the wife that works at Camp Pendleton, CA Marine Base in the MCX.
A young "Youth" Marine was in the check-out line with his mother and "CORRECTION" (put his cover on inside!) He was approached by a AD Marine (Junior Officer) and asked to remove the cover. Immediately the young "Youth" Marine took up the defensive and asked the junior officer "who the F*** are you?" The Junior Officer then got into the young "Youth" Marine's face and told him to have some respect and remove the cover - it escalated into a shouting match in the check-out line in the MCX. Coming from the back of the store there was a loud roar from a Sergeant Major in the Marines (built like a tank according to my wife). He bellowed, "both of you shut your mouth there are families in here!" The MCX went silent and several employees and Marines hit the deck (no kidding). The SgtMaj came to the front and grabbed the young "Youth" Marine the by collar escorting him and the Junior Officer out of the MCX with the Young "Youth" Marine's mother yelling, "don't touch my boy!"
NEITHER MYSELF OR MY WIFE ARE IN THE HABIT OF TELLING A LIE OR MAKING UP A STORY - IT HAPPENED! FOCUS ON THE QUESTION - NOT WETHER YOU BELIEVE THE INCIDENT HAPPENED OR NOT!
RP Members was this handled properly by the Junior Officer, SgtMaj, or the mother? What would you have done?
THIS WAS A REAL SITUATION THAT TOOK PLACE YESTERDAY 12/30/2015
CORRECTION: I've receive collaboration from another lady who also had firsthand knowledge of this incident in the MCX - "The "youth" was not an AD USMC, but part of a group of Young Marines. Her description of this group is that it is one for troubled youth to attempt to instill discipline and maybe bring them into the fold."
I apologize to all of those individuals that I stood firm on with, that it was young Marine Private (based on all the information I received), but the discussion, question, and feedback on how the situation was handled by the Junior Officer, Sgt Mgr, and Mother have been outstanding - that I don't apologize for - thanks
If anything, I thoroughly enjoyed the story and my wife called me at home immediately following the incident - she knew I would enjoy hearing about it. I just said, "that SgtMaj owns that young Marine!"
RP Members this one comes from the wife that works at Camp Pendleton, CA Marine Base in the MCX.
A young "Youth" Marine was in the check-out line with his mother and "CORRECTION" (put his cover on inside!) He was approached by a AD Marine (Junior Officer) and asked to remove the cover. Immediately the young "Youth" Marine took up the defensive and asked the junior officer "who the F*** are you?" The Junior Officer then got into the young "Youth" Marine's face and told him to have some respect and remove the cover - it escalated into a shouting match in the check-out line in the MCX. Coming from the back of the store there was a loud roar from a Sergeant Major in the Marines (built like a tank according to my wife). He bellowed, "both of you shut your mouth there are families in here!" The MCX went silent and several employees and Marines hit the deck (no kidding). The SgtMaj came to the front and grabbed the young "Youth" Marine the by collar escorting him and the Junior Officer out of the MCX with the Young "Youth" Marine's mother yelling, "don't touch my boy!"
Marines
Discipline
Regulation
Military bearing
What Would You Do
Edited >1 y ago
Posted 10 y ago
Responses: 937
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I did not read where the Lt. confronting the young marine was in uniform or not and if he was not, the "who the --- are you," would make more sense. From the Lt's position and not knowing the actual words used, there are several possibilities that come to mind. For example, during my 33-year career, I witnessed far too many "how not to address a subordinate" confrontations. A classic example is the officer/NCO who asks, "Airman, don't you think you need a haircut?" Which will almost always get the "No sir" reply. The correct way would have been, "Airman, you hair is out of limits of the reg., I suggest you get it cut as soon as soon as possible. I now have your name and unit ID from your uniform and will be calling your first sergeant to see if you have complied with my directions." I realize the Army an Marine officers/NCOs are accustomed to hollering (to do that in the AF, unless there is a fire, etc., is seen as unprofessional). Nonetheless, I do not believe a SM would have conducted himself in this manner -- I'm waving my BS flag on this one.
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COL Mikel J. Burroughs
CCMSgt James Helms First, thanks for responding, but I need for you to return to the original question at the top. The dynamic of this Question and post just changed based on a second eye witness from Facebook. I received Facebook confirmation from a civilian lady that witness the event as well (so it did indeed happen), but she said is that the "youth" was not an AD USMC, but part of a group of Young Marines. Her description of this group is that it is one for troubled youth to attempt to instill discipline and maybe bring them into the fold. Based on that the Junior Officer most likely could have avoided the whole situation by not saying anything at all. Sorry for the confusion, but there was some great feedback from a Leadership standpoint throughout the various discussions. My apologies James!
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Being "old school" (meaning 45+ years ago) when you entered indoors your cover came off unless you were on duty, meaning . . . a duty belt and on duty, possibly with a sidearm. There are ways of mentoring a junior member with out making the incident a public display, I did that often as a senior SNCO . . . to great effect. It all comes down to your desire to make that learning experience a positive or a negative learning experience for that junior service member.
Not that it should make a difference (service branch wise), but I was a Marine Corps GySgt at retirement, and during my time as an NCO I felt it was imperative that our values and traditions where reinforced in the junior ranks, and virtually all of my Marines understood what I was trying to teach.
Just my take on things gentlemen.
Not that it should make a difference (service branch wise), but I was a Marine Corps GySgt at retirement, and during my time as an NCO I felt it was imperative that our values and traditions where reinforced in the junior ranks, and virtually all of my Marines understood what I was trying to teach.
Just my take on things gentlemen.
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SPC Charles Batchelor
Isn't there some difference between the branches on how cover is handled? I believe the AF removes cover even when under arms but am not 100% certain on that.
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GySgt Mike Swisher
You have my attention SPC Batchelor, I'm going to check with a recently retired Senior AF colleague and learn from him. I honestly don't know what the difference is between the Air Force and the Marine Corps is in this regard. This will be interesting.
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TSgt (Join to see)
I never did. If I was armed, I had a cover on. Nobody ever corrct d me.
Of course, this may have been because I was born at San Diego and not Lackland.
Of course, this may have been because I was born at San Diego and not Lackland.
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There's a reason that "youth" was in that program. His mother was part of the problem. Getting in his face didn't help the Jr officer though, it probably triggered the kid even more and didn't instill respect.
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I would have followed the Marine outside and addressed there away from civilian counterparts. Making a scene in front of civilians makes both parties look bad. Not to say I would be light on the young fellow but a one on one is better to get your point across and respectfully so.
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I don't know, my own mother would have reminded me to take my hat off (even a civilian hat) when I went inside. I was raised better than that, she would have said.
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PO2 Dan Shulla
It's an old tradition within the Navy Medical community to uncover when entering a medical facility out of respect for the wounded or dying. This for everyone in uniform (unless wearing guard belt) and civvies
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I don't care what military you're in if you're a drill sergeant tells you to do something you do it and keep your mouth shut and learn respect
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