Posted on Sep 12, 2016
LTJG Jftoc Watch Officer
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1. A service member was knocked down and put on restriction for a DUI and falsifying official documents. Service member was allowed to continue service.

2. Same service member was arrested for DUI several months later. Service member was knocked down to E1, placed on restriction, and scheduled for discharge.

3. A week after service member was released from restriction they were stopped by police for leaving base illegally, speeding, and DUI. Service member was arrested.

Service member was already an E1 and being processed for discharge. What can and should the Chain of Command due to this person? Service member has reset the command's DUI counter to 000 three times.
Posted in these groups: 9efe7c3e DUIMilitary men Discharge140114202911 large Alcohol039676ce0a0d028a0130c8e92856985b PoliceUcmj UCMJ
Edited >1 y ago
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Responses: 53
SGT Chris Howe
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Soldiers should not be treated any differently legally than anyone else just because of the career they chose. I have worked in and with military law enforcement for well over 20 years now and this has always been an issue. NJP is crap. Outside the fence line people are processed through the JUDICIAL system for all criminal acts. Now these things may not be prosecuted in court due to plea deals and such, but they go through a judicial process. I'm sorry, but an infantry CPT doesn't know a damn thing about the law and allows things to go because the Soldiers NCO says a he's a good troop. He has a 300 PT score, fires expert on all assigned weapons, he can't possibly be a wife beater or a habitual DUI. As an evidence custodian it would make me absolutely livid seeing commander's actions returned stating no action taken due to lack of evidence, however at no time did I ever get a request for evidence. It has bothered me for years. The UCMJ has its purposes in cases that are military specific such as AWOL or disrespect or dereliction. It has a role in an overseas environment. NJP has a role in cases where law enforcement has been involved. But all cases involving LE and an arrest or apprehension should be required to go through the military JUDICIAL system not NJP. in the end sentencing can be lightened, but it ensures that that crime goes on the individual's record. Case in point, I know of a cas where the female service member stabbed her husband during a DV assault. Because she was already being chapters, the chain of command did nothing. Six months later I went to pick my 3 year daughter up from day care and guess who was working there. When these cases don't go through the judicial system, they don't get reported outside the fence line and things like this occur. People with multiple DV cases against them get NJPd instead of court-martialedwhich means no DV convictions, which Lautenberg doesn't apply and they continue on in the military with access to firearms, they continue to purchase guns, they get out and go into Law Enforcement or security positions with guns. They get jobs dealing with kids and such because an infantry CPT has no understanding or care beyond he's a good troop I the foxhole or it's easier to just kick them out then it is no longer our problem. No, now it is the problem of the rest of society.
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SSgt Jim Gilmore
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The member should be tried at Court Martial. If convicted, placed into a mandated or forced substance abuse program and confined for the duration of the program and be given a Big Chicken Dinner (BCD).
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MSG Military Police
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"Repeat" seems to be the operative word there. Bye bye.
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SSG Squad Leader
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They can spend there last days in the military on extra duty and restriction.
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LTJG Jftoc Watch Officer
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Is that enough for someone who was already on extra duty and restriction awaiting discharge processing for a previous DUI?
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SSG Squad Leader
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Bad-conduct discharge, forfeiture of all pay and allowances, and confinement for 6 months. That is the max punishment for DUI without personal injury. So is it worth it to the unit to court marshal this Soldier for this. With this information I don't know I do kind of think that this Soldier also if I read this right the last DUI happened off post and then the civilian police can and should pursue charges.
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1SG Air Defense Artillery (ADA) Senior Sergeant
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THE PROBLEM WITH SOLDIERS EXPERIENCING THESE TYPE OF MULTIPLE VIOLATIONS WITHIN OUR MILITARY BRANCHES IS THAT THEY ARE EXPERIENCING SOMETHING THAT IS GOING ON IN THEIR LIVES THAT THEY DONT KNOW HOW TO RESOLVE AND THEY CARRY THIS UNRESOLVE AROUND WITH THEM THROUGHOUT THEIR DAYS AND NIGHTS, THE ALCHOHOL IS THE QUICKEST WAY IN THEIR REACH WITHOUT INVOLVING OR REACHING OUT FOR HELP FROM A HUMAN BEING WITHIN THEIR CHAIN OF COMMAND OR A HUMAN INTERACTION AGENCY WITHIN THE MILITARY SERVICE. THESE TYPE OF SOLDIERS FEEL LIKE TIME IS NOT ON THEIR SIDE TO GET THE HELP THEY NEED TO FEEL WHOLE AGAIN SO THEY JUST GO ON TRYING TO PSYCHOLOGICALLY PUT THEIR PROBLEM ASIDE WHILE TRYING TO BE A SOLDIER AND HOPING THAT NO ONE WILL DISCOVER THAT THEY ARE HAVING A PROBLEM IN THEIR LIVES THAT IS CAUSING THEM ANGER, EMBARRASSMENT, FRUSTRATION, RESENTMENT, OR PERHAPS WORRYATION. I DONT KNOW WHAT THIS SOLDIER'S PROBLEM IS BUT, MOST OF THE TIME ITS EITHER FINANCIAL, FAMILY, A LOVER, A SUPERVISOR, A PEER, OR SOMETHING AS SIMPLE AS TIME.WHATEVER IT IS THIS SOLDIER CANT HANDLE IT BY THEMSELVES BECAUSE THEIR BEHAVIOR DISPLAYS IT. SO, WHAT WE AS MILITARY LEADERS HAVE TO DO IS BE MORE VIGILANT IN THE WAY WE DEAL WITH THESE TYPE OF ISSUES WHEN OUR SOLDIERS ARE DISPLAYING THESE BEHAVIORS.THESE SOLDIERS ARE TRYING HARD NOT TO HAVE TO TALK TO ANY BODY ABOUT THEIR PROBLEMS WHICH IS CAUSING THEM LEGAL PROBLEMS ON TOP OF THEIR OTHER PROBLEMS. YEA, THE QUICKEST THING FOR US TO DO IS TO ARREST THEM AND OR KICK THEM OUT OF THE MILITARY, BUT IS THAT THE ANSWER OR MESSAGE THAT WE WANT TO SEND OUT TO OUR SOLDIERS ? THE ANSWERE SHOULD BE NO!!! NOT IF WE CARE. I SAY GET THE SOLDIER SOME REAL HELP, IT SHOULD BE MANDATORY TO PLACE THIS TYPE OF SOLDIER INSTEAD OF IN JAIL, PLACE HIM OR HER IN AN INSTITUTIONAL PROGRAM THAT GETS TO THE SOLDIERS ROOT OF THEIR PROBLEMS THEN GIVE THEM OR HELP THEM GET THE HELP THEY NEED TO GET BACK ON TRACK AS A SOLDIER.IM SURE THEY WILL BE MORE GREATFUL OF THAT RATHER THAN THE SHAME AND EMBARRASSMENT THAT THEY WILL SUFFER KNOWING THAT THEY HAD A PROBLEM THAT IF THEY KNEW THEY COULD GET RATIONAL HELP WITHOUT BEING EMBARRASSED THEY WOULD PREFER THAT ALTERNATIVE GIVEN THAT OPTION. THE PROBLEM IS THAT A LOT OF SOLDIERS ARE NOT GIVEN THAT OPTION. IM NOT SAYING THIS IS THE PROBLEM FOR THIS SOLDIER BECAUSE I DONT KNOW ENOUGH ABOUT THIS SOLDIER BUT IF THIS IS THE CASE IN THIS MATTER THAT IS MY RECOMMENDATION AS A LEADER. AND IM SURE THAT THIS SOLDIER DID NOT WASTE THEIR TIME WITH A VISION TO SIGN THEMSELVES INTO THE MILITARY TO PUT THEMSELVES THROUGH THIS TYPE OF HUMILIATION. MAKE THEM WHOLE AGAIN, THATS WHAT SOLDIERS AND LEADERS DO, YOU NEVER KNOW, THAT SAME SOLDIER COULD IN TURN BE AN ADVOCATE FOR OTHER SOLDIERS. THANK YOU FOR LISTENING TO MY RESPONSE OF THIS TYPE OF ISSUE.
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SPC Matt Henry
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The military needs a 24/7 sobriety program to reduce repeat DUI's. Upon arrest for DUI the service member is ordered to abstain from any/all alcohol consumption and to submit twice a day for a Portable Breath Test to identify alcohol consumption. Tests are at 12 hr intervals 0500-0700 then at 1700-1900 hrs.

Response for failures is incremental beginning with 24 hr confinement through 1 week confinement. Enforcement as a UCMJ Article 92 violation - failure to follow a written order. These programs can identify service members with alcohol problems and allows for additional help through ASAP or other resources. The program also identifies the alcohol use independent of driving!! Failure from the program results in jail for the full term of the initial conviction (usually 1 yr or less for a first offense). Failure from the program would also result in a BCD.

There are currently 14 states using some form of these programs - they have a better than 99% success rate for all Portable Breath Tests - program participants DO NOT DRINK. If they don't drink they don't Drive Under the Influence! Participants in these programs indicate once they stop drinking they begin to make better, sober, decisions in all aspects of their lives.

These programs will reduce your repeat DUI's and can be expanded to any/all alcohol related offenses. For example the service member who gets drunk and fights with the spouse (or neighbor, or anybody). Any offense with alcohol involvement can result in signing up for the program.

This is a very brief outline for what would be a much more complicated program but these programs are in effect and very successful in the civilian world and should be used in the military environment.
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LTJG Jftoc Watch Officer
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SPC Matt Henry this is already in place - at least, in the Navy.
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MSgt Michael Smith
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Easy --you are done.
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PO1 David Swift
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There has to be a point were enough is enough of this type behavior and time for him to be separated.
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SCPO Jason McLaughlin
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Couple of things that do not jibe.
One: conviction of DUI is an automatic loss of on base driving privileges.
Two: conviction of multiple DUI's would result in a suspended license.
Three: conviction of multiple DUI's there is no way an E-1 would be able to afford the car insurance.

I did not see the above offenses listed. Is this a hypothetical situation?
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LTJG Jftoc Watch Officer
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Senior, all of those were factors. The Sailor had no driving privileges, and a suspected license. I don't know about the car insurance factor, but I would assume the same.. Just more charges to bring up.
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SN Kevin Neff
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He sounds like he wanted to get out and this was his only way. They gave him one too many chances to try and change his ways, but his actions sound deliberate. No SM is that dumb I would hope.
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LTJG Jftoc Watch Officer
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Unfortunately..
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