Posted on Oct 21, 2016
“I'm going to fail height-weight on purpose and get booted” – how would you handle this?
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This actually happened to me while I was a battery XO in Hawaii. My brigade had just gotten back from OIF and we were in that weird period of tons of people leaving the unit, and tons of new people coming in. I was in the motor pool like a good XO and one of the guys came up to me and asked to chat in private – he was a SPC (E-4) who was on soft shoe profile and had been for a few months. He was also on some PT profile, which many were skeptical of but that’s not the point. He was also quite overweight and in bad physical shape.
“I don’t want to be in the Army anymore,” he told me. “I’m just planning to keep failing height-weight over and over until I get booted out.” So I talked with him and we went back and forth about what’s really going on with him, etc. But he just stayed firm on: (1) wanting to get out of the Army ASAP; and (2) planning to put no effort into passing height-weight, to get booted.
Obviously I know what actions I took here but I don’t want to spoil it for everyone. How would you have responded in this situation?
“I don’t want to be in the Army anymore,” he told me. “I’m just planning to keep failing height-weight over and over until I get booted out.” So I talked with him and we went back and forth about what’s really going on with him, etc. But he just stayed firm on: (1) wanting to get out of the Army ASAP; and (2) planning to put no effort into passing height-weight, to get booted.
Obviously I know what actions I took here but I don’t want to spoil it for everyone. How would you have responded in this situation?
Height and Weight
Army Regulations
UCMJ
Posted 9 y ago
Responses: 259
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Its been a long time since I was in but say goodbye to that honorable discharge!
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A soldier that has lost his motivation and desire to serve is a hard case to crack. In a period of high stress due to a quick training tempo or pending deployment, most units have no time to spend an exuberant amount of energy on such soldiers. Simply counsel him on his obligations and duty. If he can't see that, let him go. There are too many quality soldiers more deserving of your time.
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SFC Casey O'Mally
I completely disagree, CSM. A Soldier that has lost his motivation and desire to serve is a CRITICAL case to crack. Drilling down on this issue and reigniting motivation is important not just for this troop, but the entire unit. Chances are good that if one Soldier is feeling this way so strongly that he is willing to express it openly, there are a half dozen others heading down that path who just haven't made up their minds yet.
Leadership used to be defined as the art of influencing others to accomplish a mission by providing purpose, direction, and motivation. Here is an excellent chance to provide all three.
Leadership used to be defined as the art of influencing others to accomplish a mission by providing purpose, direction, and motivation. Here is an excellent chance to provide all three.
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CSM John Mead
SFC Casey O'Mally I see your point and agree that there may be more to this story than was told. That is the point, the XO only alluded to one problem child. If there are more, then the command has a tough but to crack. You can spend the time to straighten one out, especially if at one point this soldier was stellar. Chances are, with a foot ailment, he mentioned a months old soft show profile and another for PT, he didn't deploy with his unit on OIF. That says serious issues. Of course this is a case of vague details and more to the story than was told, though I would say that with what was told, i wouldnt spend the time trying to.turn this soldier around. If you have the time to do so, you could crack that nut, but the bottom line is, when do you say enough is enough? There are other soldiers to dwell on that need your time.
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I was at my lowest point in my life I had thought to do the same but my Chief reminded me of that contract I signed so I bucked up tightened my belt and finished my contract with honor
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I’d find out what was really going on. It could be a higher paying job on the outside or a true case of “failure to adapt”. There could also be something going on at home that nobody knows about. You really don’t know how to proceed until you know what’s going on.
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If a soldier wants out. They should get out. No question. Why would the army even want a bunch of useless shitbags that don't want to be there?
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SFC Casey O'Mally
Because a lot of the time those "useless airbags" are just misguided and a little bit of leadership can turn that "useless shitbag" into a future leader.
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Well, I would have a real deep conversation with the Soldier because I have ran into individuals like this during my career when they have told me that they hate the Army. Ok, why? How many duty stations have you ever been? You say you hate the Army, but you have only been in one unit/duty station, that's a different story...every unit is different, different leadership, etc. Now, if the Army is not what you expected, that's another story, I get that. But I would at least try to convince him/her to finish the contract, then go about your business. Finish what you started, at least do that.
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A soldier with this attitude is a liability to his unit, particularly when in a high op-tempo unit. The options are equally parts bad and horrid. Give them what they want and it causes a trend that'll be hard to quell (our trend was back pain to get no PT profiles... in excess of 75 people 5 days a week on sick call until the PA added an "oil check" to rule out prostate problems to the screening protocols.) Leave them in place and they show others there aren't consequences for substandard performance.
I think my solution to this problem would have to be a little outside norms... short of like the kid that was picked up AWOL after 6 years (never reported after AIT) sent to his assigned company, 15'ed back to E1 and shipped to Anbar with the rest of us.
Transfer the soldier to the CSM's Logistics Detachment... run by the careerists approaching retirement...
Effectively the permanent party extra duty squad... oh, THEN flag them to prevent positive actions including intra-post transfers until the flag is lifted.
I think my solution to this problem would have to be a little outside norms... short of like the kid that was picked up AWOL after 6 years (never reported after AIT) sent to his assigned company, 15'ed back to E1 and shipped to Anbar with the rest of us.
Transfer the soldier to the CSM's Logistics Detachment... run by the careerists approaching retirement...
Effectively the permanent party extra duty squad... oh, THEN flag them to prevent positive actions including intra-post transfers until the flag is lifted.
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Counseling; and - you might cite UCMJ... an intention plan to get "chaptered out" > that's insubordination, willful misconduct, etc. etc. so under those circumstances, you could let the Soldier know that the characterization of their discharge - as Honorable, or as General Discharge under Other Than Honorable Conditions... which is an available option in an Administration elimination from service - is within the power of the local chain-of-command and that is will matter later in their life... Meanwhile, they could also be charged w/article 92 I believe it is and be court-martialed, or, choose A15 and at FG level be reduced in rank to E-1 (from E-4) so now you are leaving as an E1, with a record and an OTH discharge... those are the "sticks"... the carrott would be > find out why, impress upon the Soldier their duty and commitment, look for other ways to dissuade the individual from that self-destructive path! Good Luck!!
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