Posted on Jul 19, 2021
If you sling a rifle behind your back, with muzzle up, should it ever point over your left shoulder?
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My customer is buying an illustration of a modern-day US military troop facing the viewer, and saluting.
ACROSS the troop's back, there is a slung M4. It's not just hanging by a strap off the shoulder; it is diagonal.
My customer wants the muzzle to point up and to the left, because if it points to the right, the salute covers the muzzle. I suggested that this is incorrect.
Technically, this illustration will likely be used for branding purposes for my client's startup company, and thus it may be seen by consumers in the military. So I feel it should be accurate.
What do you say?
ACROSS the troop's back, there is a slung M4. It's not just hanging by a strap off the shoulder; it is diagonal.
My customer wants the muzzle to point up and to the left, because if it points to the right, the salute covers the muzzle. I suggested that this is incorrect.
Technically, this illustration will likely be used for branding purposes for my client's startup company, and thus it may be seen by consumers in the military. So I feel it should be accurate.
What do you say?
Rifles
Rifle Shooting
AR-15
Edited >1 y ago
Posted >1 y ago
Responses: 6
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I think it is irrelevant unless this is part of an instruction for new troops. It's just an illustration someone wants and they want to see the rifle muzzle in addition to the salute.
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MSgt Matthew Cates
Thank you for your reply. Technically, this illustration will likely be used for branding purposes for my client's startup company, and thus it may be seen by consumers who are in the military. So that is why I feel like it should be very accurate, and am trying to gauge opinion on if it would be "wrong" for the muzzle to ever point left.
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SFC Marc W.
I see what you're saying.
Take it for what it's worth, my opinion is that relatively few people seeing it will be veterans, of those that do see it, how many are going to notice the discrepancy, and of those that do notice, how many are going to care? I think when it's broken down that far among likely observers it is unlikely this discrepancy will dissuade them from the company.
But I do respect the attention to detail, as I am the same way, now-a-days I just have to tone it down and determine if it's worth the extra time and possible notice.
Take it for what it's worth, my opinion is that relatively few people seeing it will be veterans, of those that do see it, how many are going to notice the discrepancy, and of those that do notice, how many are going to care? I think when it's broken down that far among likely observers it is unlikely this discrepancy will dissuade them from the company.
But I do respect the attention to detail, as I am the same way, now-a-days I just have to tone it down and determine if it's worth the extra time and possible notice.
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Right shoulder, muzzle up, not cross the back. Left hand across chest, holding sling to salute.
Present arms . In formation, or parade.
Never saluted with m4 always carried it low ready. And don't salute in combat areas.
That was circa 1983. Except m4. That was 2013
Present arms . In formation, or parade.
Never saluted with m4 always carried it low ready. And don't salute in combat areas.
That was circa 1983. Except m4. That was 2013
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SGT (Join to see)
When I was in, that was the regulation. In FTX and combat, SOP for infantrymen is no saluting period.
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Personally, I'm not a fan of the muzzle pointing up when slung diagonally over the shoulder. But, if the customer is wanting it that way as an image for their company, then it is what it is. If we are wanting to discuss accuracy and how it will potentially seen by current/past SMs, lets look at movies and television shows where they show military folk in garb that is all chewed up. That still doesn't stop us from watching them.
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Cross body sling arms is and has been taught and the orientation of the barrel can vary depending on the situation. I have attached formal training guidance from the Marine Corps training Command. There is no reason to overthink this. https://www.trngcmd.marines.mil/Portals/207/Docs/wtbn/MPMS/0300-M16-1004_Demonstrate_Weapons_Carries_LP.pdf?ver=2015-06-15-115140-450
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Not enough information. Is this trooper a courier carrying a Springfield during the Civil War? Is he guarding an ammo dump with a M-1 Garand? Does he have an M-16 slung on his person at a Firebase in Vietnam? Is he carrying an M-4 in Kandahar at TOC?
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SFC Casey O'Mally
MSgt Matthew Cates - If it is a modern day troop, he isn't slinging an M4 across his back. Sling arms (over the shoulder) for parades and such. Slung across the front or carried in the hands for everything else. I literally cannot recall a single time since 9/11 that I slung a rifle across my back - and I was a POG for most of that time.
So.... either way, it is going to be inaccurate - go with whatever the customer wants.
So.... either way, it is going to be inaccurate - go with whatever the customer wants.
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MAJ Ronnie Reams
Tradition has it that rifles are slung muzzle up and short weapons, carbines, SMGs, etc are muzzle down over the shoulder.
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The only time you should sling the rifle this way is in a tactical environment where saluting us a no-no. Thus, this situation should not arise IRL. That is to say, if you are where you may need to salute, it should be slung directly from the right shoulder, or held at port arms and you should either render the salute or present arms as you were taught in basic training.
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