Posted on Oct 29, 2020
Is my dd214 not enough proof that I earned an award?
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I was in the reserve years ago. Had a huge break in service and now I'm back in active duty. My s1 is currently telling me that I can't add my awards to my erb without the orders as my dd214 does not have them therefore it's not enough proof. I am currently moving heaven and earth trying to find papers nobody seem to have from 11 years ago. What can I do?
Edited 5 y ago
Posted 5 y ago
Responses: 49
SFC (Join to see)
CPL (Join to see) yes the maximum file retention for personnel documents is 7 years. Theyre not likely to have it still. You adressed the brigade level.
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CPL (Join to see)
SFC (Join to see) I was referred to an hr NCO. I don't know if it was at brigade level sergeant.
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SFC Michael Hasbun
Not necessarily. Only personal awards even have order #'s. Service and campaign awards do not.
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Your DD214 is not the end all for your list of awards. I got out in 1975 and the top award on my DD214 was the ARCOM. But, before I left my last duty assignment I was told by my 1SGT that I had been recommended for the MSM. Never heard another thing about the MSM until 30 years later when I requested a copy of my military records from MilPerCen. Then I learned that I had been awarded the MSM 3 months after I was discharged. I received a copy of the orders awarding the medal and later received the medal with my name engraved on the back of it. You can get your 214 amended with a DD215.
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If the awards are not on your DD 214, and you do not have substantiating documents, then the awards cannot be listed on your ERB. What you can do is submit an SF 180 to the National Archives. If they have them, they will send them to you. Then....BAM.....they can then be added to your ERB
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CPL (Join to see)
Yes sergeant I did submit a request to the national archives. The awards are in my dd 214, what my s1 wants is a 638 for all my awards, come to find out campaign Robinson get only a memorandum usually not a 638. My unit is asking for papers that never existed in order to validate my awards. I was told by my s1 no 638 no awards.
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MSG (Join to see)
CPL (Join to see) - Even a memorandum is justification. For example, Reservists, we get an ARCAM (Army Component Achievement Medal) which is the Reserve version of a Good Conduct Medal. That is awarded via Memorandum and not a 638.
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MSG (Join to see)
CPL (Join to see) - And, as long as the award cert has an Order # and signed by the right level Officer, that works as well. Sounds like you have a very anal S1
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CPL (Join to see)
Yes sergeant, I wasn't planning on giving up, but I was running out of options when I created this thread. I do plan to fight it to the bitter end.
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A good soldier keeps a file of all orders on which he/she is named. I still retain mine, and they can be invaluable when filing disability claims.... Side note: my ETS was 1966....
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LTC (Join to see)
keep at least 2 copies. I have a copy in a safe deposit box at the bank that I update whenever I get an award, orders, etc. saved my butt a couple of times. Lost all my paperwork during a move, they lost one box and it just happened to be the one with my records and lost another copy in a house fire. Always have a backup. I also have everything stored digitally on a flashdrive.
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DD214's are not good source documents because they often contain mistakes therefore are not supposed to be used as proof. I've seen Soldiers get all kinds of things put on their 214 like Air Assault school, sniper school etc..... That they didn't do. Most Soldiers are honest and will correct it, but some won't. I had a SGT get reduced to SPC yet when he got his 214 a year later they still listed him as a SGT so he ran with it. He decided to reenlist some time later and did so as a SGT. His CSM from his new unit called me to ask if he was reduced and did he make his rank back. After I explained what happened and produced source documents for his reduction he was reduced again to SPC.
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Maj James Tippins
Wow. I never thought to look that closely at the DD214. I thought it was accurate. So that medal of honor I have on it isn't legitimate? :->
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CSM Rick Cassel
This one of the things that always got my goat about Big Army and the Guard. I spent 40+ years in the Marine Corps and Guard. Prior to OIF/OEF nobody ever questioned a DD214 as a credible source document for Awards. Then, one or two knuckleheads do something wrong, and we decide the entire system is flawed and assume everybody cheats the system. We end up screwing 96 Joe's for the 4 who had fictitious information on a DD214. IF we are going to say a DD214 is not proof of an Award, are we also going to say Time in Service and Time in Grade are questionable as well?
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If you earned any recommendations, years in service with NG and or Reserve there are ribbons and medals. Go to CO going through the chain of command and or awards bureau for proper guidance. You don't want to become a PX warrior.
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CPL (Join to see)
Thank you Sergeant, I was able to get more supporting documents besides my dd214 since I first started this thread. Thing is, my NCO and myself in person have handed the paperwork to s1 for them to fix this. It still hasn't been done. I am planning on taking it up the chain of command since I'm getting tired of waiting.
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CPL (Join to see)
Thank you sergeant, that was one of the first things I tried when this issue came up
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Unless I'm reading this wrong, you said "as my dd214 does not have them" and that sort of means that no, there is no proof on your DD-214 for something that you might have earned.
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CPL (Join to see)
Perhaps my bad grammar makes this confusing. The awards are listed on my dd214, the order numbers for the awards is not. I do have the 638 for some of them but my s1 hasn't fixed this yet. Not all the awards get a 638 but I was able to find and present some of the memorandums for the other awards. Still no action from my s1 though.
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PO2 Lawrence Janiec
CPL (Join to see) - Gotcha. I don't know what a lot of those numbers are (DD-214 is something any Vet has and SHOULD remember) but best of luck getting it sorted. Sorry I forgot to say that initially, but it's frustrating to not have something you have earned (or paid for) so I totally feel your frustration. Hopefully you'll get what you rightfully deserve soon.
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Depends. I would check with the school, a previous headquarters, morning reports, or ask a colleague who might have been through the course or tour with you. They might have the proof.
I have two DD Form 215s from my last period of active duty just for that reason. I made sure that my two qualification badges were listed and that appropriate devices were correct.
In the Air Force, DD Form 214s are used to verify longevity service, accession training, PME, specialty qualification badges and overseas service. For everything else, you better have your orders or graduation certificates. There's even a printed roster for Good Conduct Medals, and I have a copy of the AF Form that verified the operation qualifying me for a Humanitarian Service Medal. I kept everything and only recently started shredding the duplicates.
As for decorations, remember that anything can be purchased on line and through E-bay these days, so I'm not much of a fan of people who show up with medals and certificates without the citations or orders. I would hedge on the side of a those being fake.
Therefore, if something's missing, make sure you have the orders or certificate, and then make sure it's updated in the system. Don't just wear something without proof. It's a disservice to your peers, your service, and the rest of us. It also short-changes you in the future when you go for replacements of awards, or some family member is doing the family history thing.
Finally, you never know where those records may be helpful to others. Records that I had stored 26 years ago in my footlocker actually helped correct an error about an aircraft on static display at the Air Force Museum.
I have two DD Form 215s from my last period of active duty just for that reason. I made sure that my two qualification badges were listed and that appropriate devices were correct.
In the Air Force, DD Form 214s are used to verify longevity service, accession training, PME, specialty qualification badges and overseas service. For everything else, you better have your orders or graduation certificates. There's even a printed roster for Good Conduct Medals, and I have a copy of the AF Form that verified the operation qualifying me for a Humanitarian Service Medal. I kept everything and only recently started shredding the duplicates.
As for decorations, remember that anything can be purchased on line and through E-bay these days, so I'm not much of a fan of people who show up with medals and certificates without the citations or orders. I would hedge on the side of a those being fake.
Therefore, if something's missing, make sure you have the orders or certificate, and then make sure it's updated in the system. Don't just wear something without proof. It's a disservice to your peers, your service, and the rest of us. It also short-changes you in the future when you go for replacements of awards, or some family member is doing the family history thing.
Finally, you never know where those records may be helpful to others. Records that I had stored 26 years ago in my footlocker actually helped correct an error about an aircraft on static display at the Air Force Museum.
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CPL (Join to see)
Yes sergeant, as of now I'm not wearing any of the awards I have until this is fixed. I was able to find the 638 and the memorandums and presented to my s1 several times. My records are still not fixed as of today at least. I don't want to escalate things but it seems like I have to.
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I am having such an issue with my husbands DD214, he is not eligible per VA because his DD214 doesn’t show he was in Vietnam , it is ridiculous that I cannot get any help on this I have wrote Congress, and talked to so many people and nothing
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CPL (Join to see)
Unfortunately stuff like that takes a long time. They'll be quick to take your benefits away due to erros, but take their time to fix those errors in order for you to get them back
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