Posted on Dec 1, 2013

It's Christmas Ball season. Do you hate it when your CSM makes people where their uniforms instead of civilian attire?

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I actually like the balls. My wife looks forward to it. I do think however that leadership can kill the motivation to go by trying to militarize it too much. That's what we have dining-ins/outs for. Our soldiers (especially females) don't get too many opportunities to dress up for formal occasions. Why not let them do it?

I have the mess dress and I like to wear it. What's wrong with letting some females go out and find a gorgeous gown instead of wearing their ASUs like we do for work?

Let a ball be a ball and not a uniform inspection.

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Posted 12 y ago

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Responses: 14

SGM Matthew Quick

Posted 12 y ago

Killing motivation by "militarizing" a military ball? Are we not in the military?  We should take PRIDE in wearing our formal uniforms? Too often I read about how we're letting our NCOs Corps down by not enforcing standards or letting our standards fall by the way side. Personally, I'd like to see female service members in gowns/dresses, BUT, we can't keep screaming "EQUALITY, EQUALITY" and pick and choose when.

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SSG Robert Burns

12 y

Believe me I'm all about wearing the uniform. That's why I invested in the Mess Dress. However, I do believe for something that is supposed to be a morale building social event, there should be an option.

I think you can still have PRIDE in the uniform without having to wear it everywhere you go. For an event where I can bring my spouse and she can wear this extravagent ball gown with her hair down and nice shoes, jewelry etc. but my peer has to wear her uniform, hair up, no jewlery, its not the same.

For us it really doesnt matter because we have a real equivalent. The mess dress or even the blues for that matter is basically a tuxedo with ribbons on it. We can't "do" our hair. That's about the extent of our showing off.

Im just saying for once, let a woman be a woman and do what women like to do.

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1SG (Join to see)

Posted 12 y ago

I've been in the position to recommend the "uniform" for several of my prior units events, whether they be dining in or ball, or whatever in between. I've always went with all wear the uniform.

We are a uniformed organization and should be proud of that. I have and continue to fail to understand why the question is even brought up when it is never offered as an option to male Soldiers. As with MSG Quick, my opinion is simple, Equality isn't Equality if only applied sometimes.

There are numerous opportunities for Soldiers to wear civilian formal wear, they are more than welcome to attend those events and wear whatever tux, gown, or whatever their heart desires, but for a Army sponsored event the ASU's/Mess Dress is the only option.

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SSG Robert Burns

12 y

1SG, you stated we have numerous opportunites to wear civilian formal wear. Where or when would that be? As far as I understand most balls are with the organization to which you belong. We obviously all belong to the same one. Other than going to a wedding or a funeral, what other numerous opportunities are you referring to? FYI I usually end up wearing my uniform to weddings and funerals as well.

As far as males are concenred, when Ive seen it offered as an option it is offered across the board. The difference is most of us just dont care because our uniform is probably the nicest thing we got and most soldiers cant afford a tux nor like wearing them.

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1SG (Join to see)

12 y

SSG Burns, sorry for writing "over" you, just a configuration thing. I apologize for the lack of clarity. I meant that there are opportunities, not necessarily Army events, that allow one to not wear a uniform/wear civilian formal wear. An example would be, a Daddy/Daughter dance, some of which are on posts. Perhaps a Valentines banquet for the couples. These are but two examples, and while they are not Army events like a Ball, Dining Out or whatever, I wonder what events our civilian counterparts might have for formal wear that we think we might be missing out on?

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Cpl Glynis Sakowicz

Posted 12 y ago

OK, being Marine, I am seriously the wrong person to answer this! We Women Marines, consider the Dress Blues to be the most perfect Ball Gown created, because we are intensely proud of having the honor to wear that uniform... and we get that chance every year in November.

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CMC Robert Young

12 y

Cpl. you are spot on about the Marine Dress Blues. I have never had the opportunity to attend a Marine Corps Ball, but my stepson just got out after four years as a Marine. He still raves about how impressive Marine Corps Balls are, and the photos I have seen reflect a level of espirit de corps everybody else lacks. I would like to be stationed close enough to attend one before I retire.

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SGT(P) (Join to see)

Posted 12 y ago

From a SPC's point of view I prefer having the uniforms so that I can clearly see who to call, "Sir, Ma'am, Sergeant, etc".

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LTC (Join to see)

Posted 12 y ago

I can see both sides on this. The command can clearly decide to require the uniform but I have no issue letting people opt out to dress up.

Have a uniform inspection prior to the event to make sure everyone has them updated so the Soldiers aren't getting over and then have a 'ball'.

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SFC (Join to see)

Posted 12 y ago

I agree. This falls under the whole 'common sense' thing. A Christmas ball should be about building esprit de corps and giving everyone a chance to gather in a social setting. As long as the attire is appropriate for a formal occasion I don't see why you'd need to be up in arms about uniforms versus formal civilian attire.

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1SG (Join to see)

Posted 12 y ago

I strongly disagree that we should allow any Soldiers to wear civilian attire at a military social function. Just like others have said you should be proud of the uniform you put on ALWAYS regardless of gender or rank. Saying it is making a morale building event less morale building is a cop out. It has been building morale for decades with no problem. Its a slippery slope into undisciplined chaos. I was in a BN that decided one year female E4 and below could wear civilian attire; then some disgruntled male Soldier called IG. Suddenly it was all E4s and below. We had PVTs at the ball in zoot suits with feathers in their hats, a male SPC in a kilt because he was Scottish. You say don't let them in; they say I paid for a ticket you don't let me in I call IG. Imagine dealing with that on Monday. Or we could just continue being Soldiers not Civilians like we should.

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SGT (Join to see)

Posted 12 y ago

If it is a dining in the uniform should be worn. It shows we are an organization and looks better to me. Now a dining out there is an option but when ppl violate the dress code and not always dress appealing I see why Seniors recommend wearing the military uniform. We are in an organized profession and must dress and act as such as sometimes being made to wear the dress uniform is what's best.

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LTC (Join to see)

Posted 12 y ago

I like wearing the dress uniform, and my wife and I have always enjoyed military balls and dining outs. I can't speak for females, but I would imagine that if the males service members are in their ASUs then the female service members should be as well, regardless if it looks as feminine as a gown.

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CPT Mike M.

Posted 12 y ago

My Battalion had a ball where people were allowed to wear civilian attire before I got here. I hear it was an absolute disaster. No sense of professionalism when people are out of uniform. Women were wearing dresses that were NOT conducive to a professional event to put it in PG terms and guys there with pimp suits, canes, fedoras with big ass feathers in them, etc. And then being out of uniform their conduct was not in keeping with their profession either. People had to be told during the guest speaker's talk to be quiet because they were talking over him at their tables, laughing and joking and doing basically everything that's a big no-no at a military ball. I get it's supposed to be fun but there is a clear line and it shouldn't be crossed in how we conduct themselves. I think people are more likely to act appropriatly when they're in uniform.

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SSG Robert Burns

12 y

To be frank I'd say that is a complete leadership failure. If people are wearing inappropriate attire then they shouldn't have been let in the door. By allowing them in you are indirectly ok'ing what they are wearing. If a bouncer can do that at a club I'm sure we can too. You can't make souses wear uniforms. So I don't think the uniform has anything to do with it. People act the fool in and out of uniform. They just need to be dealt with. It doesn't sound like the previous leadership was very tough.

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It's Christmas Ball season. Do you hate it when your CSM makes people where their uniforms instead of civilian attire?

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