Posted on May 3, 2023
Should a command give troops a comp day after working 24 hours doing range operations and then dealing with a missing arms room item?
1.23K
20
12
4
4
0
For a day of blank and live, day and night fires we reported at 0600. From there we did everything a got back to the company at 0200. Due to a arms room issue, (a missing item) we did not release until 0530. We were told to be back at 1300. Was this the correct call or should we just have been compensated the day for working about 24 hours?
Posted >1 y ago
Responses: 7
4
4
0
I have seen temptation in command teams to never try and stray too far from the norm, because, well, hell, I don't know, just because they think something bad will happen I suppose. There are certainly commanders and first sergeants who are looking out for their careers and make decisions with that frame of mind always at the front and center.
If what you're asking is, "in this example how best do we take care of our people while handling the demands of our mission?" then there's nothing wrong with either choice and context of what's due that week and what's currently going on in the BN will dictate the course of action. Obviously, the comp day provides more rest. But, maybe there's an opportunity for a quick AAR that didn't happen the day before. Maybe the command team sees Friday is just around the corner and thinks they can call a half day now and get the battalion command team sold on a three day weekend to make up for the long hours. Maybe there's just some things that have to get done and a comp day risks failure. You're right to see the tension. In leadership there is always tension. We should be disciplined, but generous. While there's a lot of right answers to this question, I think there's only one real wrong answer. And that would be brining everyone back in with the late work call because they didn't earn a comp day due to that missing item, or some other issue with yesterday's performance. We ought never take time from Soldiers in that spiteful sort of way.
But, if what you're asking is how long can we work ourselves and our Soldiers, then the answer is however it long it takes to get the mission done. Some divisions say people-first, but that's meant with a grain of salt. The mission is always first. If it's not, battles are lost and the effects lead to needless deaths. Hard stop. People-first means something more akin to "place others before yourself." Fleshing this out, I take that as don't sacrifice others for anything but the mission, don't beat people to a pulp with training and tasks for the sake of good metrics, and lastly balance out the demands of training and the need for readiness.
I'm probably speaking on several things you already know, but I hop this helps to connect some more dots.
If what you're asking is, "in this example how best do we take care of our people while handling the demands of our mission?" then there's nothing wrong with either choice and context of what's due that week and what's currently going on in the BN will dictate the course of action. Obviously, the comp day provides more rest. But, maybe there's an opportunity for a quick AAR that didn't happen the day before. Maybe the command team sees Friday is just around the corner and thinks they can call a half day now and get the battalion command team sold on a three day weekend to make up for the long hours. Maybe there's just some things that have to get done and a comp day risks failure. You're right to see the tension. In leadership there is always tension. We should be disciplined, but generous. While there's a lot of right answers to this question, I think there's only one real wrong answer. And that would be brining everyone back in with the late work call because they didn't earn a comp day due to that missing item, or some other issue with yesterday's performance. We ought never take time from Soldiers in that spiteful sort of way.
But, if what you're asking is how long can we work ourselves and our Soldiers, then the answer is however it long it takes to get the mission done. Some divisions say people-first, but that's meant with a grain of salt. The mission is always first. If it's not, battles are lost and the effects lead to needless deaths. Hard stop. People-first means something more akin to "place others before yourself." Fleshing this out, I take that as don't sacrifice others for anything but the mission, don't beat people to a pulp with training and tasks for the sake of good metrics, and lastly balance out the demands of training and the need for readiness.
I'm probably speaking on several things you already know, but I hop this helps to connect some more dots.
(4)
(0)
MSgt (Join to see)
SSG (Join to see)
Mission first, People always, is the phrase I learned becoming a leader. Not taking care of your troops can hinder the the primary goal, the mission. That doesn’t mean there won’t be difficult days. 1LT (Join to see) makes a lot of valid points especially balancing out the demands of training and the need for readiness while not sacrificing your troops health and effectiveness.
Mission first, People always, is the phrase I learned becoming a leader. Not taking care of your troops can hinder the the primary goal, the mission. That doesn’t mean there won’t be difficult days. 1LT (Join to see) makes a lot of valid points especially balancing out the demands of training and the need for readiness while not sacrificing your troops health and effectiveness.
(1)
(0)
4
4
0
They hol you long and so compensated you with at very late 1st call, don't whine- Command can regulate you day any way the have to.
(4)
(0)
SSG (Join to see)
Knew someone was going to say I was whining.....I understand the logistics of needing to regulate days certain ways at times. But you comp CQ and staff duty for a similar shift. So why not do the same in this situation? What's the best answer to give to the men? Saying to not whine solves nothing and closes doors for communication and understanding.
(3)
(0)
SFC Casey O'Mally
SSG (Join to see) I worked CQ on September 10 2001. My shifted ended at 0900 on September 11, 2001.
Want to guess where I was at 0901? Hint: it was not in my rack.
After my "24 hour" shift, which was actually 27 when you count the PT the morning before, I went right on to a normal day of work, prepping to go to war. I *was* released earlier than the rest of the Company that day - at around 1830.
Unforseen and exceptional circumstances may cause the "norm" to be suspended. No one planned the missing item, therefore schedules got messed up.
Your Command took that into account as best they can. But there is a HUGE difference between giving one or two Soldiers the next day off and giving the whole Company the day off. There is still a training schedule. There is still stuff to get done.
Had this been my unit snd I were PSG I would have requested that the Commander bring in ONLY essential personnel. I would have gone to him, training schedule in hand, identified critical tasks that could not be pushed (BN or Higher meetings or suspenses, external training), who was necessary for those tasks, and a proposed time to make up all other tasks within the next week. Then, assuming I could convince CO of my plan, I ask for only essential people at 1300, and everyone else at 0600 the next day.
But that requires your PLT leadership to be proactive in bringing a solution to the Command. Because, honestly, Commander does not have time for that. Not at that level of detail. Not when (s)he is still going to be there for author hour explaining the missing item, and be back at least an hour before everyone else (if not at 10 AM) because (s)he has meetings.
You were given almost 8 hours. Before coming in for a 3-4 hour day. Yes, it sucks. But it was neither unfair nor a horrible call. Mission first.
And as a SSG who should be able to see more of the big picture beyond just your squad / section, yes, this is whining.
Want to guess where I was at 0901? Hint: it was not in my rack.
After my "24 hour" shift, which was actually 27 when you count the PT the morning before, I went right on to a normal day of work, prepping to go to war. I *was* released earlier than the rest of the Company that day - at around 1830.
Unforseen and exceptional circumstances may cause the "norm" to be suspended. No one planned the missing item, therefore schedules got messed up.
Your Command took that into account as best they can. But there is a HUGE difference between giving one or two Soldiers the next day off and giving the whole Company the day off. There is still a training schedule. There is still stuff to get done.
Had this been my unit snd I were PSG I would have requested that the Commander bring in ONLY essential personnel. I would have gone to him, training schedule in hand, identified critical tasks that could not be pushed (BN or Higher meetings or suspenses, external training), who was necessary for those tasks, and a proposed time to make up all other tasks within the next week. Then, assuming I could convince CO of my plan, I ask for only essential people at 1300, and everyone else at 0600 the next day.
But that requires your PLT leadership to be proactive in bringing a solution to the Command. Because, honestly, Commander does not have time for that. Not at that level of detail. Not when (s)he is still going to be there for author hour explaining the missing item, and be back at least an hour before everyone else (if not at 10 AM) because (s)he has meetings.
You were given almost 8 hours. Before coming in for a 3-4 hour day. Yes, it sucks. But it was neither unfair nor a horrible call. Mission first.
And as a SSG who should be able to see more of the big picture beyond just your squad / section, yes, this is whining.
(0)
(0)
1
1
0
It was the call your leadership made and is well within their rights to make. What they could do is potentially give the people who did that operation a comp day, possibly. If it was me, I'd find a way to give my soldiers some comp time if I couldn't give them it that next day.
You guys did get a late work call so at least they didn't say go straight back to work. I don't think anyone can say what they could have or should have done as we aren't in the situation.
Talk to your leadership to see if a comp day can be worked out.
You guys did get a late work call so at least they didn't say go straight back to work. I don't think anyone can say what they could have or should have done as we aren't in the situation.
Talk to your leadership to see if a comp day can be worked out.
(1)
(0)
Read This Next
Continue with Facebook 
Continue with Google