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I have been noticing a trend lately, and its disturbing to me. Not all police are bad, many of them are great people who help the community on and off the clock, but in the past year I have come across so many videos on social media of officers brutally attacking children and killing others .... who had done nothing wrong. Is there no accountability for the police?
(I posted a couple videos of cops beating up civilians, and one video of a cop choking another guy to death, the moderator and/or administrator of RP seems to have removed it)
Why is it if a soldier injures or kills a civilian he is court marshalled, but if a LEO does it, its "Paid Vacation"?
In my honest opinion, we as soldiers treated the Afghan Populace with much more dignity and respect then the police treat U.S. Citizens with.
(I posted a couple videos of cops beating up civilians, and one video of a cop choking another guy to death, the moderator and/or administrator of RP seems to have removed it)
Why is it if a soldier injures or kills a civilian he is court marshalled, but if a LEO does it, its "Paid Vacation"?
In my honest opinion, we as soldiers treated the Afghan Populace with much more dignity and respect then the police treat U.S. Citizens with.
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Edited >1 y ago
Posted >1 y ago
Responses: 12
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Skokie woman's face shattered after being launched into concrete jail cell bench
SKOKIE, IL -- Disturbing video evidence has been released of an incident that left a woman's face so badly injured that she needed facial reconstructive surg...
SGT Suraj Dave 1SG Mike Case PO1 (Join to see) If it were but one instance, one really bad moment that would be one thing. It would be shocking and intolerable and so we are left with the horns of a dilemma. Do we justify that kind of malice and cloud it with our own narrow perception?
The problem is, IMHO, that the rise of paramilitary behavior on a routine call when things go terribly wrong and ends with a slap on the wrist. The officers are awarded a lot of latitude with their behaviors and attitudes towards a SUSPECT and certainly not hurling a young woman into a concrete stool which resulted in a shattered cheek and eye socket. As a judge I would ask the cop to apologize and plead for HER mercy.
Officers are there to keep the police and quell violent behavior. Mere disrespect should not be the basis for a life changing event and subsequently provide fuel to unrest.
Now my experience is my brother-in-law is an exceptionally calming person in a crisis. All the times we in each other presence he was a consummate gentlemen, deferring to others rather robbing them of dignity, no matter the cost. He eventually became police chief.
On night there was a call and a young guy wrapped his father's brand new car around a tree and the father was ready to beat his son up. My BIL got on a three-way call and settled both the kid and his father down. I have never seen that before. Kill em with kindness and treat other with utmost respect.
I respect cops and I would never accelerate stress to give a cop any reason to assault me. But this is the real world. And cops MUST not aggravate the situation with unmerited violence.
http://youtu.be/gMWDxwL1Zog
No one can justify that! No amount of community service can mitigate that kind of behavior and I bet that if COPS were filming this would not have happened. That community and the nation hold cops responsible as they would hold civilians.
The problem is, IMHO, that the rise of paramilitary behavior on a routine call when things go terribly wrong and ends with a slap on the wrist. The officers are awarded a lot of latitude with their behaviors and attitudes towards a SUSPECT and certainly not hurling a young woman into a concrete stool which resulted in a shattered cheek and eye socket. As a judge I would ask the cop to apologize and plead for HER mercy.
Officers are there to keep the police and quell violent behavior. Mere disrespect should not be the basis for a life changing event and subsequently provide fuel to unrest.
Now my experience is my brother-in-law is an exceptionally calming person in a crisis. All the times we in each other presence he was a consummate gentlemen, deferring to others rather robbing them of dignity, no matter the cost. He eventually became police chief.
On night there was a call and a young guy wrapped his father's brand new car around a tree and the father was ready to beat his son up. My BIL got on a three-way call and settled both the kid and his father down. I have never seen that before. Kill em with kindness and treat other with utmost respect.
I respect cops and I would never accelerate stress to give a cop any reason to assault me. But this is the real world. And cops MUST not aggravate the situation with unmerited violence.
http://youtu.be/gMWDxwL1Zog
No one can justify that! No amount of community service can mitigate that kind of behavior and I bet that if COPS were filming this would not have happened. That community and the nation hold cops responsible as they would hold civilians.
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PO1 (Join to see)
Dayum...that hurt ME just watching! The video seems complete - though there is still some question I have as to what happened outside the cell. No matter, I do think the shove was excessive and unnecessary.
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SSgt (Join to see)
CPT Gregory Wagoner And all of us should emulate my brother-in-law's behavior. Each side needs to sit down and get to know each and not assuming the worst. Never did she merit that and I am sure if he could have done it over again, he would.
Cops get PTSD too and police stations need to rate them with PRPs to make sure that this does not happen.
Cops get PTSD too and police stations need to rate them with PRPs to make sure that this does not happen.
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1SG Mike Case
The cop in that video needs to be fired and then put on trial for assault. I have no qualms with the "militarization" of the police force. When they get into a fight with two men carrying AK-47's and body armor, it is easy to sit on the sidelines and complain about the equipment they are getting. I think the screening for people becoming cops should be better. I think they should be paid more for the work they do. You can't attract the cream of the crop with low paying wages for the danger they put themselves in. I think all cops should wear body cameras and all cars be equipped with cameras as well. I think all cops should be with partners and never alone. There are a lot of improvements that police can make but I for one will not tie one hand behind the back of the police and limit the weapons they are allowed to use. I do think they should stand trial for things that happen like in the video you posted though.
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LTC Paul Labrador
Besides "military" gear usually doesn't come out except for very select circumstances. The problem is that those circumstances tends to be headline news (and played ad nauseum over the air) so there is a perception that cops are always running around with body armor and assault rifles....which is not true.
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The answer for your first question as to why they are on "paid vacation" and the Army is court-martialed, is a union.
As for the rash of outbreaks of cops attacking people, there can be as many videos of law enforcement doing great things for their community as well. As the saying goes "you build 1000 bridges, you are a bridge builder, but you suck one #$%^ and that makes you a #$%^ sucker".
Everyone always remembers the bad things that people do and that is what stands out. What makes its worse is that the cops are sworn to uphold the law. They are the ones we teach our kids to run to when in danger or scared. I promise you that law enforcement hate the ones that do the horrible things. They want nothing more than to get rid of the bad apples, just as we do in the military. If it comes to light that this cop was wrong, then try him and sentence him, but truly he has already been tried. Nothing short of the death penalty will satisfy the people looking for justice. The law enforcement community right now has two black eyes and a bloody nose and only law enforcement can repair the ugly image people them as. It will take time but it can be repaired.
As for the rash of outbreaks of cops attacking people, there can be as many videos of law enforcement doing great things for their community as well. As the saying goes "you build 1000 bridges, you are a bridge builder, but you suck one #$%^ and that makes you a #$%^ sucker".
Everyone always remembers the bad things that people do and that is what stands out. What makes its worse is that the cops are sworn to uphold the law. They are the ones we teach our kids to run to when in danger or scared. I promise you that law enforcement hate the ones that do the horrible things. They want nothing more than to get rid of the bad apples, just as we do in the military. If it comes to light that this cop was wrong, then try him and sentence him, but truly he has already been tried. Nothing short of the death penalty will satisfy the people looking for justice. The law enforcement community right now has two black eyes and a bloody nose and only law enforcement can repair the ugly image people them as. It will take time but it can be repaired.
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SGT Suraj Dave
The problem is MSG, the sheer numbers of these videos being shot in 2014... I am sure out of the 100's being uploaded, quite a few of them are not the full story... but there are many where you see the videos and read the articles, and it was cold murder. I think the only reason we are aware of these things is because of smart phones.
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1SG Mike Case
That is so true.....I remember when I didn't a picture the whole day. I am not saying bad things aren't happening but technology definitely have made it so easy to tape the bad things and load them instantly. But in a era where everyone wants to be noticed, bad press always gets more attention over good press. I can load a video of the cops stopping and playing basketball with the kids and a video of a cop beating someone and the video of the beating will go viral and the other one will fade into the background
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I'm not one to make assumptions based on a video. Yes, video is a fantastic tool to bring forth into a courtroom as evidence. However, my question is always this: is the video showing the ENTIRE story - from beginning of the situation to the end - or is the video only showing what the videoographer wants to be shown? Video is only a tool. How that tool is used is the key.
Second question, in each situation where you saw someone getting their ass kicked by police, have you done due diligence and gone through the process of finding out what the results of the investigation / trials were? Or are you just assuming the cops got by with the "offense"?
What you call "paid vacation" is a direct result of cops being accused of offenses and those offenses found to be an angry citizen trying to put the cop off the job. Citizens do anything to get a cop off the job - and usually it's because the cop caught them doing something illegal and the cop made the offender's day really bad. So, today in most police departments, when a cop is accused of a serious crime, the officer is put on "administrative leave" until the outcome of the investigation / trial. If the officer is found guilty, THEN the officer is penalized but not until. It's kinda like the rule that civilians have - "innocent until PROVEN guilty".
Just remember - video's are not the "endall" when it comes to an investigation. I remember one particular situation where an officer was found to be beating the hell out of a guy in an elevator...the video was 11 minutes long. What the video DIDN'T show was the individual throwing away the gun he emptied at the cop just before he entered the elevator. The cop entered the elevator just before the doors closed and proceeded to attempt to arrest the guy - who resisted. The cop beat the crap out of the guy because the guy kept resisting and trying for the cop's gun. The cop got put on "administrative leave" for 5 months until the investigation was complete and he was proven innocent.
So, don't make a decision on just a video - people out there aren't stupid, they try to set up cops all the time.
Second question, in each situation where you saw someone getting their ass kicked by police, have you done due diligence and gone through the process of finding out what the results of the investigation / trials were? Or are you just assuming the cops got by with the "offense"?
What you call "paid vacation" is a direct result of cops being accused of offenses and those offenses found to be an angry citizen trying to put the cop off the job. Citizens do anything to get a cop off the job - and usually it's because the cop caught them doing something illegal and the cop made the offender's day really bad. So, today in most police departments, when a cop is accused of a serious crime, the officer is put on "administrative leave" until the outcome of the investigation / trial. If the officer is found guilty, THEN the officer is penalized but not until. It's kinda like the rule that civilians have - "innocent until PROVEN guilty".
Just remember - video's are not the "endall" when it comes to an investigation. I remember one particular situation where an officer was found to be beating the hell out of a guy in an elevator...the video was 11 minutes long. What the video DIDN'T show was the individual throwing away the gun he emptied at the cop just before he entered the elevator. The cop entered the elevator just before the doors closed and proceeded to attempt to arrest the guy - who resisted. The cop beat the crap out of the guy because the guy kept resisting and trying for the cop's gun. The cop got put on "administrative leave" for 5 months until the investigation was complete and he was proven innocent.
So, don't make a decision on just a video - people out there aren't stupid, they try to set up cops all the time.
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SGT Suraj Dave
PO1 (Join to see) At the beginning of the video, they are all just talking to each other. If he did anything truly dangerous, they wouldn't be just talking to him.... You can watch the "Before" of the murder happen.
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PO1 (Join to see)
I did...it didn't tell me anything about the previous 3 hours.....not a peep. As to the "talking to each other"...that's usually how normal cops try to approach people. Often talking will get you and the cop further than anything else. Look, I'm not happy the guy died. No one should be killed in an arrest. However, at what point does the individual take personal responsibility?? Did the cop not tell him he was going to be arrested? So, what did the guy think - he was going to avoid getting arrested by resisting? Why did the guy resist? If he had NOT resisted he'd most likely still be alive.....
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SGT Suraj Dave
PO1 (Join to see)
I thought you would be interested in knowing, the guy who shot the video of the NYPD killing the father of 6, is now being threatened and harassed by the police.
http://thefreethoughtproject.com/police-retaliation-man-filmed-cops-killing-eric-garner-arrested-gun-charge/
I thought you would be interested in knowing, the guy who shot the video of the NYPD killing the father of 6, is now being threatened and harassed by the police.
http://thefreethoughtproject.com/police-retaliation-man-filmed-cops-killing-eric-garner-arrested-gun-charge/
Police Retaliation? Man Who Filmed Cops Killing Eric Garner Arrested on Gun Charge
"Once they ruled this a homicide, now you all of a sudden find something on him? C'mon. Let's be realistic." The Free Thought ProjectMike SawyerAugust 4, 2014 22 year-old Ramsey Orta was the young man who shot the gruesome video of the NYPD killing Eric Garner. The cops placed father of 6, Eric Garner, in…
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PO1 (Join to see)
SGT Suraj Dave yeah, I saw that. There does appear to be more going on than is being said on the news. Don't get me wrong - I'm all about punishing a bad cop. However, you won't convince me that every man and woman that puts a badge on is rotten. First of all, by making that assertion you'll be saying that 4 generations of my family are crooked. That won't make me happy at all. I personally know a lot of cops - from local 2 stop sign towns to FEDS in all types of directions. I also know that for every cop there are people who scrutinize every move made by every cop, nit-picking on every little detail.
I will also make a generalization - and I know how that's gonna go over - but here it is: In many cases, individuals that get "racked up" (or whatever the kids are saying these days) by the cops have usually done MUCH worse that what they are convicted of. It's the nature of our justice system - one that let's people arrested for major crimes (up to capital murder) plead down to relatively moderate or even minor crimes.
End of generalization.
My question is: Did Eric Garner have an illegal weapon on him? I'm sorry - I don't doubt that Mr. Garner is a fine, upstanding citizen - one that has never found himself afoul of the law or any illegal activity from birth to present. I won't say that cops won't plant evidence - there's too many instances of bad cops getting caught. But, you'll excuse me if I ask this one question - if Mr. Garner is such a fine, upstanding, hard working, tax paying, honest man - how is it that he's in the right spot at the right time to be able to produce all these videos of cop brutality? This guy has to be the luckiest SOB on the planet. He is just getting off work, just minding his own business, going to the local store to get a gallon of milk for his wife and 2.5 kids when - WHAM! - out of the blue there's a cop the just JUMPS out in front of this super-law abiding citizen and starts to beat the living $hit out of another innocent, law-abiding, hard working, just on the way to the grocery store for milk for HIS wife and 2.5 kids,victim! PULLLEEZE!
I will also make a generalization - and I know how that's gonna go over - but here it is: In many cases, individuals that get "racked up" (or whatever the kids are saying these days) by the cops have usually done MUCH worse that what they are convicted of. It's the nature of our justice system - one that let's people arrested for major crimes (up to capital murder) plead down to relatively moderate or even minor crimes.
End of generalization.
My question is: Did Eric Garner have an illegal weapon on him? I'm sorry - I don't doubt that Mr. Garner is a fine, upstanding citizen - one that has never found himself afoul of the law or any illegal activity from birth to present. I won't say that cops won't plant evidence - there's too many instances of bad cops getting caught. But, you'll excuse me if I ask this one question - if Mr. Garner is such a fine, upstanding, hard working, tax paying, honest man - how is it that he's in the right spot at the right time to be able to produce all these videos of cop brutality? This guy has to be the luckiest SOB on the planet. He is just getting off work, just minding his own business, going to the local store to get a gallon of milk for his wife and 2.5 kids when - WHAM! - out of the blue there's a cop the just JUMPS out in front of this super-law abiding citizen and starts to beat the living $hit out of another innocent, law-abiding, hard working, just on the way to the grocery store for milk for HIS wife and 2.5 kids,victim! PULLLEEZE!
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