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Over the past few years I've been interviewed by a lot of local newspapers, radio and televisions shows in my effort to raise awareness of issues we as Veterans are facing. Several of these interviews include me talking about my personal battle with PTSD and while I use the acronym when I say the words I only call it Post Traumatic Stress. Because of this, I am asked why I drop the word "disorder". Personally, I feel that PTSD is NOT a disorder. It is my brain's normal reaction to an abnormal situation. I feel that everyone that has gone through what we have gone through come back differently. To me that isn't a disorder.<div><br></div><div>So my question to the RP group is what are your thoughts? Do you view PTSD as a "disorder"? What thoughts, if any, do you have about people labeling it a disorder? Do you think this is why many Veterans choose to ignore it rather than seek treatment based on the general public's view of what disorders are?</div><div><br></div><div>I know what the doctors say, I'm just interest in what others think.</div>
Posted in these groups: 
PTSD
PTSD
Posted 12 y ago
Responses: 27
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I'm going to share this .. It took 18 years for me,, to finally see .. its not so much a pts for me, i get shakes, panic attacks, nightmares, cold sweats, I can't sleep, and I'm always scanning a crowd.. We all do.. the problem is while we are working together on or off mission, we know who our enemy is. The civilian world is a disaster compared to Military lifestyle.. Its like being fed a drug and then have it taken away .. the problem is an ingrained lifestyle just does not go away .. we are military for life, well some of us are.. And living in the Civilian world, you just can't put the genie back in the bottle .. it doesn't matter if it is a Disorder , a Mental problem .. it needs attention .. there is so much more to it then emotional stress, and mental issues , it goes much deeper.. and feeding us drugs and sleeping 16 hours a day does not cut it..
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I think the issue has to do with the way the psychs classify disorder in DSM 4 and 5. Basically anything outside of "normal" is a disorder. Since the only place you find "normal" is on a washing machine, it pretty much means everyone has a disorder. While 4 made diagnosis of PTSD among military and law enforcement difficult, 5 modified the criteria to take into consideration training that would force certain symptoms below the radar. <br>The real question is, can you adapt your reaction to your new environment? Do you even want to try?<br>
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SGT Thomas Sullivan
Some of this is exactly why I questioned the military for putting me out with Bi-polar disorder, when it is fully treatable with medication and periodic counseling, kind of like those with PTSD.
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I don't think it's the word "disorder" that causes the stigma. It's the entire term. For example people who say they are OCD. They rarely mean that in a negative way. Some even say it proudly and it's often looked at as a positive. The word disorder doesn't change that.<div>DIS-order simply means I have something that I can't get in order. Whether it's eating, or post traumatic stress, and I need help to do it or fix it. (get it in order)</div><div>We all have stress; marital stress, kid stress, financial stress, whatever. Once those stresses present with medical symptoms it becomes a disorder in my opinion. For some people that level of stress is high, others low. Someone can see someones head get blown off and be fine, another persons life could be ruined by it. </div><div>I think someone with PTSD is more concerned about the symptoms than with someone pointing out they have a disorder.</div><div>I tell my folks, I have PTS....you don't wanna see my "D!"</div><div><br></div>
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I believe that while we are on active duty we are so focused on what we do and the need for order and discipline we tend to dismiss this issue. In fact whether you call it a disorder, disability, sickness, psychological illness, etc. is is a fact that each must deal with when they return and move out of the normal military group.
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CMC Robert Young
Chief, you're spot on. The 'professionals' will argue from now
until doomsday about what to call it while the point should be what to do about it. Maybe if the system spent more time invested in finding helpful treatment options and less time debating semantics, more would be done to help those who need it.
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SGT Leigh Barton
Thank you both. This brings two important phrases to mind that I think most of us have already heard. The first is "when all is said and done, more will be said than done". The "professionals" as you call them, seem to be more concerned with a convenient reference to pigeonhole this disorder with than the nature, origin, or mechanism of action of the condition. Almost as bad as some technicians fluent in "jargonese", they might not have a clue what they're talking about, but it sure sounds good. The second is "if you can't measure it it ain't science". In most cases a psych referral is the first thing done, and the definitive testing is overlooked, few psych departments look in that direction. My best recommendation would be to start with an endocrinologist and arrange a supervised comprehensive physical, with particular attention to metabolic disorders, if available a neurologist and gastroenterologist might be useful assets as well. If they agree on a psych referral, you can be certain any treatable conditions haven't been overlooked.
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After explaining my views on the condition it seems appropriate to explain the basis for my comment. Since this is both personal and difficult for me to explain, some background is in order. The first six years after my discharge found me spending sixteen hours a day unconscious, the other eight I was barely lucid. Both of my younger brothers knew something was wrong, and VA kept coming up with Flu or other diagnoses. The flu doesn't last for six years. The older of the two decided to start me on nutritional therapy with remarkable results. Magic bullet. Fortunately since the Army lost my records seventeen times I retained them. I had been through them repeatedly to no avail when I encountered another vet that had a level 4 case of PTSD. He's the one that pointed out the similarities in my symptoms to his own. After some discussion it developed that before he developed the disorder he had been on a fourteen day patrol. He went for a beer and thought he got some bad hooch. Local brew, Vietnam. The big picture hit me a few weeks later. Fourteen days in the jungle, overheated, exhausted, malnourished, dehydrated, and flirting with exposure, he heads for an air conditioned exchange, and pounds down an ice cold beer. That's one serious shock for the system. Naturally the local beer is cheaper, so that's what he gets, and the booze gets the blame for the next two days of disorientation. The temperature was what caused the injury. He goes into shock and the next patrol he's walking wounded and doesn't even know it. It would be like giving an autistic teenager a rifle and putting him in a firefight. He also commented that any effective treatment for PTSD includes a nutritional support regimen. Although I don't have the resources to research the subject properly, the process that seems to develop is an environmental sensitivity causing the body to respond too aggressively to changes in the environment, over utilizing the nutrients across the board at an accelerated rate, since their function in the body is to maintain optimum acclimatization to the environment. The same type of injury would also account for the residual effects of Malaria, with the heat of the pathogenic (disease) process being the culprit instead of the environment. Essentially the body can no longer get it's required level of nutrients and trace elements from the normal diet, and when the levels fall too low, shock sets in. The undiagnosed heat injury seems so far to be applicable to heat injury, PTSD, and Malaria. However I'm uncertain who to ask to evaluate this assessment. The upshot is that it has worked for me and may help improve the treatment others are undergoing.
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SGT Leigh Barton
Thank you. What I'm getting at may be more than just a nutritional support requirement. There's a common denominator here that bears more than a cursory examination, a symptom of the condition that has the capacity to influence any treatment plan significantly. In the case of a chronic recurrent adrenaline surge, the metabolism is accelerated depleting the nutrients and trace elements across the board, faster than the normal diet can replace them. The same occurs in certain heat injuries, Malaria, and probably others as well. It indicates to me the potential for a mechanical origin to many of the conditions that are currently listed as Post Traumatic Stress Disorders. The common denominator I'm referring to is an endocrine disorder. The endocrine system is notorious for it's sensitization processes, Bee stings, allergic reactions of all kinds, Each results in some kind of shock. Most potentially life threatening. The vitamins AND trace elements ARE what the body uses to stabilize itself, causing the body to go into shock when the levels are depleted beyond a safe level. Perceptive and cognitive functions are the first things to go. Beyond that the victim loses consciousness. I am aware that excessive use of nutritional supplements caries it's own attendant risks, however in 1996 I spent several months doing residential rough wiring in Henderson and North Las Vegas during the hottest part of the summer, I ended up taking those same over the counter supplements sometimes five times in a single day. The result was that I might "fade out" a little, but continued to function, and if you don't wire a building correctly you WILL find out about it. The cycle seems to be one of sensitization, excessive nutritional depletion, loss of function , followed by further sensitization. Increasing the nutrient levels in the body appears to break the cycle and contribute to restoring normal function. This sensitization also seems to be influenced by environmental changes, not just cold to hot, but hot to cold as well, anything forcing the endocrine system to increase function. To replace nutrients at the levels I'm talking about I'd have to eat steak dinners five or six times a day. Under no circumstances would it be advisable to discontinue other therapy, stress disorders are ill understood, and need to be managed on a case by case basis. Just be aware that those vitamin mineral tablets may be doing more for you than you realize.
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SGT Thomas Lucken
Korea of the past 1991 and before! Has always seem to stay a hidden secret of what has happen over there! Run combat patrols, but not a combat location! Also, we had troops occupying Guard Posts and Observation Posts along the DMZ. Normally you carried your UBL while out on patrol. I never manned OPs or GPs up on the DMZ, but have ran 19 combat patrols up on it.
In the past, every incident the civilian world heard about on the DMZ, another 15 to 20 probable never made it out to the world.
1991, the American sector was turned over to the ROK Army to take over. Over the past 23 plus years since then I have heard from more then one Vet suffering PTSD from being on the DMZ. Also many of us who served over there especially after 1972, question the residual affects of Agent Orange. Because I along with others have several symptoms of AO. But the government has currently said there are no valid claims after 72, last year used.
In the past, every incident the civilian world heard about on the DMZ, another 15 to 20 probable never made it out to the world.
1991, the American sector was turned over to the ROK Army to take over. Over the past 23 plus years since then I have heard from more then one Vet suffering PTSD from being on the DMZ. Also many of us who served over there especially after 1972, question the residual affects of Agent Orange. Because I along with others have several symptoms of AO. But the government has currently said there are no valid claims after 72, last year used.
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SGT Leigh Barton
It's for sure we've parked on the same real estate. In 1982 the Security unit rotating through a DMZ assignment rotated it's personnel through Ambush patrols, recon patrols, Quick reaction force, and Observation posts. And with all the Sabre rattling from both the north and south it's a miracle anybody comes home with their brains intact. I'd be inclined to look at the environment over there before the exotic crap, it's brutal and North Americans aren't used to it. And yes I was a mud fucking medic, Airborne, mechanized and leg. And congrats on your Imjin Scout Badge. Senior Aidman patrol medical support. If it looked like it might get real, it got handed to me. Anybody else with the rank or skill at sucking up stayed in the clinic where it was safe. Now for the PTSD part, my father was hit on the head while setting pins, before the automatics were developed, and ended up taking phenobarbitol and dilantin for the epilepsy (seizures) that it produced, others have sustained memory loss ranging from partial to total amnesia, others have conditions ranging from nightmares to flashbacks caused by everything from accidents to combat trauma, rape victims, and more. they are all POST TRAUMATIC STRESS DISORDERS. The only thing the public knows about it is the "flashbacks" portrayed in Rambo or Blue Thunder, and it scares the crap out of them. Even the government overreacts since it hasn't a clue how to handle it. Hopefully this and other similar forums will correct the damage done by Hollyweird. I know better than to count on the government for help. But the training counts for more than anyone will ever know.
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SGT Thomas Lucken
The Cav in 80's supplemented the Infantry on the Z. We only did the patrols, recon during the day, ambush at night, 1 day on, 2 days off. We were up there 30 days each time (1983 and 1987).
1983-84 I was with A Troop 4-7 Cav, which was a ground troop out of Garry Owen. 10 patrols and all quiet.
1987-88 I was with B Troop 4-7 Cav, which was a Air Troop and the last of the old Blues Platoons! 9 patrols not so lucky. Also that year, had a Cobra fly over the MDL and get shot out.
In the Air Cav we had Quicksaber/ORF once every 3 weeks. 2 slicks and 1 squad were on standby, more then once we loaded up with the birds cranked up and full with ammo. When we got on the bird, you about shit your pants thinking this is it.
During DS, I was TDY for about 6 weeks attached to 3 Corps from NTC. Korea tours were alot tougher for me then DS, considering DS I was there basically as a advisor.
1983-84 I was with A Troop 4-7 Cav, which was a ground troop out of Garry Owen. 10 patrols and all quiet.
1987-88 I was with B Troop 4-7 Cav, which was a Air Troop and the last of the old Blues Platoons! 9 patrols not so lucky. Also that year, had a Cobra fly over the MDL and get shot out.
In the Air Cav we had Quicksaber/ORF once every 3 weeks. 2 slicks and 1 squad were on standby, more then once we loaded up with the birds cranked up and full with ammo. When we got on the bird, you about shit your pants thinking this is it.
During DS, I was TDY for about 6 weeks attached to 3 Corps from NTC. Korea tours were alot tougher for me then DS, considering DS I was there basically as a advisor.
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PTSD, whether you call it disorder or syndrome. I think many veterans that suffer from it, are scared to approach for help whether with the VA or the outside world.
With the current political situation, especially with the 2nd Amendment being challenge many don't see help. Also, I could be accused of having it, I just dealt with it. My son had to seek help from VA, he has had an harder time dealing with it. (OEF 2009).
Also, it depends on each individual how they handle it mentally. Emotions are different from person to person on various situations.
With the current political situation, especially with the 2nd Amendment being challenge many don't see help. Also, I could be accused of having it, I just dealt with it. My son had to seek help from VA, he has had an harder time dealing with it. (OEF 2009).
Also, it depends on each individual how they handle it mentally. Emotions are different from person to person on various situations.
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SGT Ben Keen
An interesting point has been made within your reply Tom. I'm wondering if any sort of study has ever been done taking family members who were both exposed to combat but in different eras, both with PTSD and looking at how both reintegrated. Is there something that was done differently between the eras? Are the changes in society making our reactions to combat that much worse? Has our exposure to things like first-person shooting games (which I love by the way) hinder our brain's ability to process serious events when they happen for real? The results of such a test would be interesting to see.
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SPC David Wyckoff
Sounds like you and I have a lot in common, SGT Lucken. I see my son as dealing with his quite well but my daughter on the other hand, I encourage her all the time to seek help. She doesn't for almost the exact reason you stated.
SGT Keen, you raise some very interesting questions.
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I can only speak for myself, but it might be that my opinion could be echoed by others like me.
My wife has sworn for over twenty years that I have PTSD or PTS. I know something is wrong but I don't think its PTSD. However, my kids will tell you that I have had moments where they didn't even know if I was mentally in control of what I was doing. Rage, depression, withdrawl, insomnia, hyper alertness, followed by utter exhaustion...all the symptoms that the book talks about. I managed to raise three kids and never beat them or strike them in anger. That's only thanks to my wife who found a way to difuse me time and time again. I never hit her either. But I have said some things to my wife and kids that hurt more than any beating ever could. That red rage would take over and I couldn't find a way to stop it. I still haven't.
I have never truly been to a Dr to be evaluated, and here's the reason why. I don't feel that I have it. When I listen to my Dad and Uncles talk about Vietnam I think wow, I never did or saw anything like that. Subsequent to coming back home we were praised and welcomed, then we were told that our war didn't count. That it wasn't a real war. That it only lasted 100 hours. In my mind there are only a few soldiers from DS that should have PTSD and I didn't feel I was one of them. I didn't even feel I was entitled to any VA SC compensation until my disability began to interfere with my ability to earn a living and take care of my family. I mean I didn't lose a limb, right? I wasn't shot or wounded in battle. VA service connection was for the real soldiers.
Even to this day I still answer the questions at the VA as if everything is hunky dory. Yes I sleep fine, no I am not depressed, no I am not suicidal...and on and on.
I was honest with one Dr, one time. She put me on mood meds and scheduled me for a group session. I went. There were Vietnam, OIF, and OEF vets in there talking. I felt like I didn't belong there. These were hard charging warriors who has actually been in the shit. So I never went back.
Maybe it has to do a little bit with the ol grunt and remf thing. I was a guy, who did a thing, a long time ago. But I wasn't THE guy. The one that seeks out, finds and closes with the enemy and destroys them. I'm the guy who kept the machine running that helped THE guy do his job. I managed to find a place in society and keep from letting the craziness control me.
Sorry I got to going and couldn't get stopped.
EDIT NOTE
My apologies I blathered on and didn't even answer the OP's question. My answer is, that is probably doesn't really matter what you call it. Only a medical professional needs a specific category name so they can put a pin in it for diagnosis sake.
The reality is that service members are suffering from it and for whatever reason are not seeking help. If it helps them seek professional help to call it something else besides a disorder, then lets change the name.
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SGT Leigh Barton
I've been on the move so much I lost all the photos I had of Korea. I had gotten pictures of Freedom bridge, Vice President Bush (Sr.) (tasked as senior aidman for the ambulance support team during his visit for a summit, god I hate VIP coverage), and my all time favorites were the APC's coming in to replace us.
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SGT Thomas Lucken
Leigh, take a look at this Discussion! People apparently do not know what they are talking about, a little heated about it.
https://www.rallypoint.com/answers/korean-war-defense-vet?from_groups=false
https://www.rallypoint.com/answers/korean-war-defense-vet?from_groups=false
I think that since the Korean War has never officially been declared over that everyone that been there in the last 60 years should designated a Korean War vet as opposed to a Korean Defense Vet. What...
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SGT Leigh Barton
Shared on Facebook with me.
Bringing
her back into public circulation is thae worst thing that can be done.
If she should be honored for anything it should be the hundred best
women candidates for a firing squad.
Bringing
her back into public circulation is thae worst thing that can be done.
If she should be honored for anything it should be the hundred best
women candidates for a firing squad.
Barbara Walters on Jane Fonda:
Jane Fonda was on 3 times this week talking about her new book. . . and
how good she feels in her 70s. . . She still does not know what she did
wrong. . .
Her book just may not make the bestseller list if more people knew.
Barbara Walters said: Thank you all. Many died in Vietnam for our
freedoms. I did not like Jane Fonda then and I don't like her now. She
can lead her present life the way she wants and perhaps SHE can forget
the past, but we DO NOT have to stand by without comment and see her
honored" as a "Woman of the Century."
(I remember this well.)
For those who served and/or died. . .
NEVER FORGIVE A TRAITOR.
SHE REALLY WAS A TRAITOR!!
And now President Obama wants to honor her !!!!
In Memory of Lt. C. Thomsen Wieland, who spent 100 days at the Hanoi Hilton [infamous North Vietnam prison] --
IF YOU NEVER FORWARDED ANYTHING IN YOUR LIFE. FORWARD THIS SO THAT EVERYONE WILL KNOW!
A TRAITOR IS BOUT TO NE HONORED. KEEP THIS MOVING ACROSS AMERICA.
This is for all the kids born in the 70s and after who do not remember,
and didn't have to bear the burden that our fathers, mothers and older
brothers and sisters had to bear.
Jane Fonda is being honored as one of the "100 Women of the Century."
Barbara Walters writes: Unfortunately, many have forgotten and still
countless others have never known how Ms. Fonda betrayed not only the
idea of our country, but specific men who served and sacrificed during
the Vietnam War.
The first part of this is from an F-4E pilot.
The pilot's name is Jerry Driscoll, a River Rat. In 1968, the former
Commandant of the USAF Survival School was a POW in Ho Lo Prison, the
"Hanoi Hilton."
Dragged from a stinking cesspit of a cell,
cleaned, fed, and dressed in clean PJ's, he was ordered to describe for a
visiting American "peace activist" the "lenient and humane treatment"
he'd received. He spat at Ms. Fonda, was clubbed, and was dragged away.
During the subsequent beating, he fell forward onto the camp commandant
's feet, which sent that officer berserk.
In 1978, the Air
Force Colonel still suffered from double vision (which permanently ended
his flying career) from the commandant's frenzied application of a
wooden baton.
From 1963-65, Col. Larry Carrigan was in the
47FW/DO (F-4E's). He spent 6 years in the "Hanoi Hilton". . . the first
three of which his family only knew he was "missing in action." His wife
lived on faith that he was still alive. His group, too, got the
cleaned-up, fed and clothed routine in preparation for a "peace
delegation" visit.
They, however, had time and devised a plan
to get word to the world that they were alive and still survived. Each
man secreted a tiny piece of paper, with his Social Security number on
it, in the palm of his hand. When paraded before Ms. Fonda and a
cameraman, she walked the line, shaking each man's hand and asking
little encouraging snippets like: "Aren't you sorry you bombed babies?"
and "Are you grateful for the humane treatment from your benevolent
captors?" Believing this HAD to be an act, they each palmed her their
sliver of paper.
She took them all without missing a beat. . .
At the end of the line and once the camera stopped rolling, to the
shocked disbelief of the POWs, she turned to the officer in charge and
handed him all the little pieces of paper...
Three men died
from the subsequent beatings. Colonel Carrigan was almost number four
but he survived, which is the only reason we know of her actions that
day.
I was a civilian economic development advisor in Vietnam,
and was captured by the North Vietnamese communists in South Vietnam in
1968, and held prisoner for over 5 years.
I spent 27 months
in solitary confinement; one year in a cage in Cambodia; and one year in
a 'black box' in Hanoi. My North Vietnamese captors deliberately
poisoned and murdered a female missionary, a nurse in a leprosarium in
Banme Thuot, South Vietnam, whom I buried in the jungle near the
Cambodian border. At one time, I weighed only about 90 lbs. (My normal
weight is 170 lbs.)
We were Jane Fonda's "war criminals."
When Jane Fonda was in Hanoi, I was asked by the camp communist
political officer if I would be willing to meet with her. I said yes,
for I wanted to tell her about the real treatment we POWs received. . .
and how different it was from the treatment purported by the North
Vietnamese, and parroted by her as "humane and lenient."
Because of this, I spent three days on a rocky floor on my knees, with
my arms outstretched with a large steel weight strapped on my hands, and
beaten with a bamboo cane.
I had the opportunity to meet with
Jane Fonda soon after I was released. I asked her if she would be
willing to debate me on TV. She never did answer me.
These
first-hand experiences do not exemplify someone who should be honored as
part of "100 Years of Great Women." Lest we forget. . . "100 Years of
Great Women" should never include a traitor whose hands are covered with
the blood of so many patriots.
There are few things I have
strong visceral reactions to, but Hanoi Jane's participation in blatant
treason, is one of them. Please take the time to forward to as many
people as you possibly can. It will eventually end up on her computer,
and she needs to know that we will never forget.
RONALD D. SAMPSON, CMSgt, USAF
716 Maintenance Squadron,
Chief of Maintenance
DSN: 875-6431 COMM: 883-6343
PLEASE HELP BY SENDING THIS TO EVERYONE IN YOUR ADDRESS BOOK. FOR ENOUGH PEOPLE TO SEE THIS MAYBE HER STATUS WILL CHANGE.
This is the one that should leave a bad taste. It was shared with me on facebook the other day.
Jane Fonda was on 3 times this week talking about her new book. . . and
how good she feels in her 70s. . . She still does not know what she did
wrong. . .
Her book just may not make the bestseller list if more people knew.
Barbara Walters said: Thank you all. Many died in Vietnam for our
freedoms. I did not like Jane Fonda then and I don't like her now. She
can lead her present life the way she wants and perhaps SHE can forget
the past, but we DO NOT have to stand by without comment and see her
honored" as a "Woman of the Century."
(I remember this well.)
For those who served and/or died. . .
NEVER FORGIVE A TRAITOR.
SHE REALLY WAS A TRAITOR!!
And now President Obama wants to honor her !!!!
In Memory of Lt. C. Thomsen Wieland, who spent 100 days at the Hanoi Hilton [infamous North Vietnam prison] --
IF YOU NEVER FORWARDED ANYTHING IN YOUR LIFE. FORWARD THIS SO THAT EVERYONE WILL KNOW!
A TRAITOR IS BOUT TO NE HONORED. KEEP THIS MOVING ACROSS AMERICA.
This is for all the kids born in the 70s and after who do not remember,
and didn't have to bear the burden that our fathers, mothers and older
brothers and sisters had to bear.
Jane Fonda is being honored as one of the "100 Women of the Century."
Barbara Walters writes: Unfortunately, many have forgotten and still
countless others have never known how Ms. Fonda betrayed not only the
idea of our country, but specific men who served and sacrificed during
the Vietnam War.
The first part of this is from an F-4E pilot.
The pilot's name is Jerry Driscoll, a River Rat. In 1968, the former
Commandant of the USAF Survival School was a POW in Ho Lo Prison, the
"Hanoi Hilton."
Dragged from a stinking cesspit of a cell,
cleaned, fed, and dressed in clean PJ's, he was ordered to describe for a
visiting American "peace activist" the "lenient and humane treatment"
he'd received. He spat at Ms. Fonda, was clubbed, and was dragged away.
During the subsequent beating, he fell forward onto the camp commandant
's feet, which sent that officer berserk.
In 1978, the Air
Force Colonel still suffered from double vision (which permanently ended
his flying career) from the commandant's frenzied application of a
wooden baton.
From 1963-65, Col. Larry Carrigan was in the
47FW/DO (F-4E's). He spent 6 years in the "Hanoi Hilton". . . the first
three of which his family only knew he was "missing in action." His wife
lived on faith that he was still alive. His group, too, got the
cleaned-up, fed and clothed routine in preparation for a "peace
delegation" visit.
They, however, had time and devised a plan
to get word to the world that they were alive and still survived. Each
man secreted a tiny piece of paper, with his Social Security number on
it, in the palm of his hand. When paraded before Ms. Fonda and a
cameraman, she walked the line, shaking each man's hand and asking
little encouraging snippets like: "Aren't you sorry you bombed babies?"
and "Are you grateful for the humane treatment from your benevolent
captors?" Believing this HAD to be an act, they each palmed her their
sliver of paper.
She took them all without missing a beat. . .
At the end of the line and once the camera stopped rolling, to the
shocked disbelief of the POWs, she turned to the officer in charge and
handed him all the little pieces of paper...
Three men died
from the subsequent beatings. Colonel Carrigan was almost number four
but he survived, which is the only reason we know of her actions that
day.
I was a civilian economic development advisor in Vietnam,
and was captured by the North Vietnamese communists in South Vietnam in
1968, and held prisoner for over 5 years.
I spent 27 months
in solitary confinement; one year in a cage in Cambodia; and one year in
a 'black box' in Hanoi. My North Vietnamese captors deliberately
poisoned and murdered a female missionary, a nurse in a leprosarium in
Banme Thuot, South Vietnam, whom I buried in the jungle near the
Cambodian border. At one time, I weighed only about 90 lbs. (My normal
weight is 170 lbs.)
We were Jane Fonda's "war criminals."
When Jane Fonda was in Hanoi, I was asked by the camp communist
political officer if I would be willing to meet with her. I said yes,
for I wanted to tell her about the real treatment we POWs received. . .
and how different it was from the treatment purported by the North
Vietnamese, and parroted by her as "humane and lenient."
Because of this, I spent three days on a rocky floor on my knees, with
my arms outstretched with a large steel weight strapped on my hands, and
beaten with a bamboo cane.
I had the opportunity to meet with
Jane Fonda soon after I was released. I asked her if she would be
willing to debate me on TV. She never did answer me.
These
first-hand experiences do not exemplify someone who should be honored as
part of "100 Years of Great Women." Lest we forget. . . "100 Years of
Great Women" should never include a traitor whose hands are covered with
the blood of so many patriots.
There are few things I have
strong visceral reactions to, but Hanoi Jane's participation in blatant
treason, is one of them. Please take the time to forward to as many
people as you possibly can. It will eventually end up on her computer,
and she needs to know that we will never forget.
RONALD D. SAMPSON, CMSgt, USAF
716 Maintenance Squadron,
Chief of Maintenance
DSN: 875-6431 COMM: 883-6343
PLEASE HELP BY SENDING THIS TO EVERYONE IN YOUR ADDRESS BOOK. FOR ENOUGH PEOPLE TO SEE THIS MAYBE HER STATUS WILL CHANGE.
This is the one that should leave a bad taste. It was shared with me on facebook the other day.
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SGT Leigh Barton
Here's a link that you might like since I'm on both facebook and Youtube. This is one of my favorite recreational exercises now. If you have about an hour check out the playlist.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=thv9QE8IPh0&list=PLI0yO3DnvBOj9NE2j9WEEs1CkKzMEFzxI
This is my channel.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=thv9QE8IPh0&list=PLI0yO3DnvBOj9NE2j9WEEs1CkKzMEFzxI
This is my channel.
These videos are a personal exercise for me, not for profit. Since I don't have a living room to share them, I share them with my guests here. Come on in, si...
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Mental Health issues often times come with a stigma attached to them such as the word Disorder. I too suffer from PTS and for me it is a Disorder because for a number of years I could not function as I would have normally. After several years of recovery I am just now able to function on a more normal basis and soon I hope to re-enter the work force. What we need is an anti stigma campagne for mental health, substance abuse and homeless issues facing many Veterans today.
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In a word, yes. The word "disorder" describes function. It's a binary word meaning not functioning in its proper order. As applied to medical conditions, anything abnormal is a disorder, the word being used interchangeably with condition. So a medical disorder is simply a medical condition. However to further quantify such things to assist in understanding them, I typically used injury, illness, and anatomical dysfunction as guidelines to assist in determining the nature of the condition being analyzed. Further analysis would attempt to ascertain which of the nine body systems are involved. Since it's origin is not parasitic in nature as Malaria, Encephalitis, or the myriad varieties of helminthic, viral, rickettsial, or fungal parasites, it is not an illness. Since it does not impede the normal physical functions of any components of the human body it is not an anatomical dysfunction. It is an injury, period. As the name implies, Post (meaning after) Traumatic (meaning impact related) stress (meaning pressure) disorder. Or a condition that has developed as the direct result of a stress producing event. Personally I would further categorize it as what the Emergency medical handbook describes as shock of a psychogenic nature, much as the residual effects of malaria, trauma induced amnesia, or trauma induced epilepsy, or even catatonia. Does that help answer the question?<br>
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