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Who does it? According to the new AR670-1, SM has to be clean shaven while in uniform or in civilian attire while On Duty. Thing is, I've heard many SNCO's say that even off duty you have to be clean shaven. What is your input in this matter? Do you shave while on leave or on the weekends?
I usually don't shave on weekends or on leave, and I live On Post. I've been downrange for the past 10 months so the new AR 670-1 came out while I was out here. Don't know if a CSM is gonna come and chew my butt out for not shaving on a Saturday coming out of the PX lol.
I usually don't shave on weekends or on leave, and I live On Post. I've been downrange for the past 10 months so the new AR 670-1 came out while I was out here. Don't know if a CSM is gonna come and chew my butt out for not shaving on a Saturday coming out of the PX lol.
Military Industry
Enlisted
Army Regulations
Posted >1 y ago
Responses: 75
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Just use common sense. Like don't show up to visit your new unit before signing in, wearing civilian clothes and beard or goatee, and badly needing a haircut. Whether or not its in the reg, doesn't give a good first impression.
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The key words are "ON DUTY". With that said, you don't have to shave on the weekends while no in uniform or on duty. I don't how so many people misinterpret this or just completely try to rewrite that snipet of regulation.
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SSG (Join to see)
it's not that individuals misinterpret the regulation it is the fact that they don't pay attention to the updates or get there information from someone else who is also incorrect and then try to enforce a regulation that doesn't exist shaving off duty is only the tip of the iceberg when it comes to this issue.
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Suspended Profile
The Army is full of over stressed Soldiers, go ahead and tell them they have to wear the uniform off duty too.
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That's crap...or women would not be allowed to let their hair down in civvies.
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No you don't have to shave in your off time.
In fact, because of what I do professionally in civilian life, I often look like a complete thug. I basically do not shave or cut my hair between battle drills. I look like walking probable cause. Some time back I ran into one of my Sergeants that is a civilian LEO while working. He told me I looked like a dirtbag outlaw biker!
Give your face a break....embrace your inner hippie dirtbag.... Get shaggy.
In fact, because of what I do professionally in civilian life, I often look like a complete thug. I basically do not shave or cut my hair between battle drills. I look like walking probable cause. Some time back I ran into one of my Sergeants that is a civilian LEO while working. He told me I looked like a dirtbag outlaw biker!
Give your face a break....embrace your inner hippie dirtbag.... Get shaggy.
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I can't even make it through the day staying clean shaven, but I shave every morning unless on leave... I don't take leave often so it is usually in 50 to 60 day chunks.
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Also the phrase " portrays a neat and clean appearance" is very open to interpretation. I do not grow a Santa Claus beard while on leave, and certainly do not have time to grow one on a 4 day or much less on a weekend. If afforded the opportunity, i grown a neatly shaped and trimmed Andrea Bocelli/George Clooney-esque beard, which I personally feel is neither detracting, nor drawing attention. I merely giving my face a break, on personal time i have earned. If the Army decides to cone out with an AR that strictly prohibits this, I will have no choice but to oblige. Until then, let me keep this morsel of normalcy without busting my balls.
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If im off duty or on leave? Fuhgedaboudit! Im on day 7 of 51 days of authorized leave and i will not once touch my facial hair. Since i cannot grow hair on my head like Bradley Cooper(notice the hat in both pics) i dedicate relaxed grooming standard deployments and leave to growing a bad ass beard.lol (for the record both pictures are of me on leave, at home in Miami)
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We are always required to present a professional appearance whether on duty, off duty, or on leave. Local policies also dictate certain standards, and has been discussed, do you want to be known as a minimalist who merely meets the standards?
I witnessed a CPT inform a COL that his sideburns were just inside the limits when the COL told him he needed to trim his sideburns. When pressed further, the CPT told the COL that he was not subject to DIV standards as his unit was merely a tenant unit on our post. The CPT did not understand the reputation he was developing, nor the comment I then received for not having already addressed the haircut standards.
Long story short, don't put yourself in a situation to be questioned about meeting the standards. A "good Soldier" never needs a haircut or shave.
I witnessed a CPT inform a COL that his sideburns were just inside the limits when the COL told him he needed to trim his sideburns. When pressed further, the CPT told the COL that he was not subject to DIV standards as his unit was merely a tenant unit on our post. The CPT did not understand the reputation he was developing, nor the comment I then received for not having already addressed the haircut standards.
Long story short, don't put yourself in a situation to be questioned about meeting the standards. A "good Soldier" never needs a haircut or shave.
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SGT (Join to see)
I'm not disagreeing with you, but what is the purpose of a standard if meeting it isn't considered good enough?
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CH (COL) Geoff Bailey
SGT (Join to see) , I'd say that barely meeting a standard and intentionally making certain you're just inside the limit communicates a lack of respect for authority and raises concern as to whether leaders can trust that person to practice self-discipline enough to also lead and enforce those same standards.
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SGT (Join to see)
Except there are many people who can't, or won't meet, the standard. I'd rather someone knows the regulation well enough to ensure they are within it, than SNCO's who think following the regulation isn't enough. That's how we get the 0630 - PT Formation turned into 0545 - PT Formation, because every level keeps adding on the fifteen minutes prior to the fifteen minutes prior bs.
I don't think one should always aim to only meet the standard, but if I choose to be satisfied with meeting the standard in one specific place (like shaving), that shouldn't be treated like a bad thing. If it is a bad thing, change the reg and raise the standard.
I don't think one should always aim to only meet the standard, but if I choose to be satisfied with meeting the standard in one specific place (like shaving), that shouldn't be treated like a bad thing. If it is a bad thing, change the reg and raise the standard.
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CH (COL) Geoff Bailey
SGT (Join to see) , you raise some good points. Raising the bar in order to prevent failure for those who repeatedly fail to meet the standards has the unintended consequence of feeling like group punishment. Leaders can always push back the standards a little in order to ensure compliance, but have to use common sense in doing so. I.e. a pre-WLC APFT at BDE level requiring a 70 point performance in each area before sending someone to WLC. This ensures no APFT failures on day 1.
At the same time, we all are not going to have days where we meet the standard due to becoming overcome by events. A leader looks at the entire performance of an individual and knows when to give room, or apply the "proper motivation necessary" in order to accomplish the mission. A leader also knows when a Soldier consistently fails to meet the standard or operates just inside the minimum standard. These Soldiers are asked to sit on the sideline when we look for the next group of leaders. It happens in every career field (civilian or military). Of course, we also assess strengths and weaknesses and employ people where they are strongest or push people to develop where they are weakest. It's part of a total development if the individual/team.
At the same time, we all are not going to have days where we meet the standard due to becoming overcome by events. A leader looks at the entire performance of an individual and knows when to give room, or apply the "proper motivation necessary" in order to accomplish the mission. A leader also knows when a Soldier consistently fails to meet the standard or operates just inside the minimum standard. These Soldiers are asked to sit on the sideline when we look for the next group of leaders. It happens in every career field (civilian or military). Of course, we also assess strengths and weaknesses and employ people where they are strongest or push people to develop where they are weakest. It's part of a total development if the individual/team.
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