Posted on Apr 20, 2016
Should a supervisor get negatively counseled if their Soldier does not make progress from an ABCP or APFT failure?
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To add onto my original question. Would the circumstances change if the Soldier was an NCO, possibly a mid-career NCO who knows by now their individual responsibilities and the Army standards. Should that NCO's supervisor get negatively counseled? How far up the ranks would it end? Would a Master Sergeant (E8) get a negative counseling for their subordinate? Would an Officer?
Edited >1 y ago
Posted >1 y ago
Responses: 44
I would say no. We are in the military, not a baby sitting service. The soldier knows the standards and it's their personal responsibility to adhere to it. Just like on APFT and Weapons. If the Soldier needs help or motivation - and the leader didn't provide that, then that's different. But, at the end of the day the soldier has to want better and do better for themselves.
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NO. If the Superior is there, doing "Remedial" & giving up their personal time to enforce/help the "Soldier" try & progress to correct the deficiency, a resounding no. As I know from first hand, if the soldier, when away from the superior eats like a horse, is lazy, drinks like a fish, & doesn't give a rat's ass, they will FAIL no matter what. There is a mentality, not just the physical, in getting a soldier to pass. If they aren't in it mentally, no matter what is done to help, they are still doomed to fail due to the mindset. The supervisor cannot & should not be required to "BABYSIT" 24/7. They need to sleep/eat & have some time for other duties/R&R also. Some soldiers are just a "LOST CAUSE". No matter what you do, your SOL!
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Only if it's systemic. If a team leader has 4 guys pass and 1 doesn't, who's fault? But if none in the tear pass, maybe it's a leadership problem. And that can go right up the line. It's one thing to have individual soldiers fail because an APFT still is an individual requirement. But if there is a high percentage of failures, you have to look at leaders and the training being conducted.
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There are only a handful of individual tasks required for soldiers.
- Height/Weight/Bodyfat
- APFT
- Weapons Qual
Yes, that leader is responsible for TRAINING their soldiers to meet/exceed the standard. However once they have been trained, they cannot control what that soldier eats/drinks/whatever.
The answer is no.
- Height/Weight/Bodyfat
- APFT
- Weapons Qual
Yes, that leader is responsible for TRAINING their soldiers to meet/exceed the standard. However once they have been trained, they cannot control what that soldier eats/drinks/whatever.
The answer is no.
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No the supervisor should not get counseled. When the smoke clear at the end of the day, it's up to the individual regardless of rank to pass APFT. The army standard is 180. I remember in my infantry days back in 98 when I was with 1-68AR BN 3rd BCT 4th ID in Carson, my PSG set a standard where every individual in the platoon had to get a 270 or above on every APFT. I scored a 250 thinking he was joking, but 24 to 48 hours later, I had to retake another APFT to meet the 270 requirement.
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Hell naaw. That's on the NCO...the subordinate NCO, that is. He/she knows the standard, and should be striving to meet it. The senior NCO is just the facilitator. If you're a career NCO and can't motivate yourself to pass APFT, major injury aside, you've got issues.
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Supervisor should not get counseled as long that supervisor reacted accordingly to try to fix the problem.
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It depends on what you, the leader, do for the Soldier, if do nothing and you two or more APFT failure then, YES. You should get a counseling. If they were PT Studs you'd want the to reflect on your NCOER, right?
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Should only get negatively counseled if they didn't do everything in their power to assist the soldier or NCO to pass.
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