Posted on Feb 25, 2016
Should the Navy recognize Humanism as a Religious Preference and eventually allow Humanist organizations to endorse Chaplain candidates?
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As an RP... and as a Humanist... I am conflicted with the fact that my religious preference isn't recognized within the Navy's Chaplain Corps and that there is no direct support for people like me.
I feel that it would not only expand the reach of the Corps itself but it could also improve morale among non-theistic Sailors and Marines.
Do you have any experience or thoughts on this?
I feel that it would not only expand the reach of the Corps itself but it could also improve morale among non-theistic Sailors and Marines.
Do you have any experience or thoughts on this?
Posted in these groups: 
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Religion
Posted 9 y ago
Responses: 2
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As my group is also fighting to get the DoD to approve our religious preference, I respect and support your desire for recognition. I question the validity of needing a Chaplain if one is a humanist, though. Wouldn't speaking to a secular counselor be more appropriate if those services are needed? The Chaplains' role is to provide spiritual support and even if one is not a follower of the Monotheistic Judeo-Christian faiths, if one is faithful they may require that spiritual support and a Chaplain of their faith would be logical. If one does not consider spirituality to be rational, but does respect the inherent human spirit and intellect it seems to follow that speaking with an individual that is trained in the scientific methods of mental health counseling would be more in line with Humanist thinking.
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SPC Joshua Heath
PO2 (Join to see) - I respect your point about rank and deployment. I know in the Army we did frequently have military and civilian counselors in deployed environments. I can only imagine just a think is much less common ship bound so I cannot speak to the capacity of support you must encounter.
In thinking on this while writing a reply, I believe we agree more than disagree on the aspects of spirituality. How do you currently understand and reflect on morality, ethics, etc in your day to day life?
In thinking on this while writing a reply, I believe we agree more than disagree on the aspects of spirituality. How do you currently understand and reflect on morality, ethics, etc in your day to day life?
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PO2 (Join to see)
Thats a huge question.
I could go on for days about it. And since I work with the Chaplains already I am faced with the topic at least a few times a day. I tend to answer questions differently than the Chaplains on station. Take homosexuality, for example... is it moral to work with a lesbian or gay couple in a pre-marriage counseling?... Each of the denominations that are represented with the Chaplains on base will say "No", so any couple that comes in and requests assistance is referred to the courthouse off base.
I, and I am sure any Humanist Chaplain, would disagree with that moral stance. So it becomes a topic that is worth exploring through my own lens. And these are the sorts of things that cause me to take a minute to reflect on how my morals and ethics... and spirituality... would cause me to answer these questions differently.
Even if I wasn't already working with the Chaplains... I might have these same sorts of questions pop up. Say, for example, I was the LPO of a department and a joining member to my unit was a lesbian... Since being openly gay is a new element to the military, I could ask a Humanist Chaplain what my role should be to educate my crew about the ethics of the new policy and what is expected of their behavior... That chaplain would be able to speak in the same moral and ethical language that I understand... and allow me to see the regulation through the scope of his authority as a Humanist Chaplain.
Commanding Officers utilize Chaplains in much the same way. They seek moral guidance for specific problems facing the command. My question is "What would an atheist/agnostic/humanist/nonpref CO want from a Chaplain?... what kinds of stress would be caused when that CO is seeking answers from a Chaplain whose moral code is polar opposite from their own?
Did I answer your question?
I could go on for days about it. And since I work with the Chaplains already I am faced with the topic at least a few times a day. I tend to answer questions differently than the Chaplains on station. Take homosexuality, for example... is it moral to work with a lesbian or gay couple in a pre-marriage counseling?... Each of the denominations that are represented with the Chaplains on base will say "No", so any couple that comes in and requests assistance is referred to the courthouse off base.
I, and I am sure any Humanist Chaplain, would disagree with that moral stance. So it becomes a topic that is worth exploring through my own lens. And these are the sorts of things that cause me to take a minute to reflect on how my morals and ethics... and spirituality... would cause me to answer these questions differently.
Even if I wasn't already working with the Chaplains... I might have these same sorts of questions pop up. Say, for example, I was the LPO of a department and a joining member to my unit was a lesbian... Since being openly gay is a new element to the military, I could ask a Humanist Chaplain what my role should be to educate my crew about the ethics of the new policy and what is expected of their behavior... That chaplain would be able to speak in the same moral and ethical language that I understand... and allow me to see the regulation through the scope of his authority as a Humanist Chaplain.
Commanding Officers utilize Chaplains in much the same way. They seek moral guidance for specific problems facing the command. My question is "What would an atheist/agnostic/humanist/nonpref CO want from a Chaplain?... what kinds of stress would be caused when that CO is seeking answers from a Chaplain whose moral code is polar opposite from their own?
Did I answer your question?
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SPC Joshua Heath
PO2 (Join to see) - You certainly did, and I thank you for giving me your time. You make a compelling and thoughtful argument.
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Please elaborate on why you believe there is a need for a Humanist Chaplain. At the end of the day we have to serve the most Service Members with a very small resource. If maybe .01% of the force identified as a Humanist, how could we support multiple chaplains that are for an infinitesimally small population?
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PO2 (Join to see)
First, thank you for your question Major. It is nice to get a respectful conversation going about this topic. Just keep in mind that my specialty is with Navy RMTs, I know almost nothing about the Army.
I'll answer in reverse order. We would support these chaplains the same way we do with Hindu, Jewish, and Buddhist Chaplains. Their demographics are roughly the same as those that openly identify as "Humanist" (since the only branch that has that as an option is the Army). So there is, at least some, case to be made to consider the utility and support here.
I would further argue that the .01% is not a fair assessment. Humanistic approaches to counseling and spirituality open doors to those who aren't affiliated with organized religion, those who are non-pref, and those who are openly atheistic/agnostic. By all accounts, and from personal experience, that population, combined, is second in size to Catholics as a denominationally specific group.
I believe there is a need here because the groups that would be facilitated under a Humanist Chaplain tend to speak a much different language than their religious counterparts. I won't say that they are polar opposites because even we atheists can find beauty and meaning in the Bible and Koran. But from my time in the Navy, and with the Marines, people will avoid the Chaplains office if they are... like me... and I don't blame them. Talking about supernatural elements, about God, about destiny, prayer... these things aren't translatable or meaningful to the Humanist group (and I am throwing in the atheists, agnostics, non-pref, unaffiliated with them). It would just be nice to see the language of morale and spiritual fitness be applicable to ALL service members.
So this would, in my opinion, strengthen the overall reach of the Chaplain Corps. More billets. more turnover and access to the programs that the chapel/chaplains run. More conversations about meaningful topics, like morality, ethics, spirituality, family, community, love, devotion....
I just don't see how inclusion would hinder any mission going forward.
Thanks again Major.
Best.
I'll answer in reverse order. We would support these chaplains the same way we do with Hindu, Jewish, and Buddhist Chaplains. Their demographics are roughly the same as those that openly identify as "Humanist" (since the only branch that has that as an option is the Army). So there is, at least some, case to be made to consider the utility and support here.
I would further argue that the .01% is not a fair assessment. Humanistic approaches to counseling and spirituality open doors to those who aren't affiliated with organized religion, those who are non-pref, and those who are openly atheistic/agnostic. By all accounts, and from personal experience, that population, combined, is second in size to Catholics as a denominationally specific group.
I believe there is a need here because the groups that would be facilitated under a Humanist Chaplain tend to speak a much different language than their religious counterparts. I won't say that they are polar opposites because even we atheists can find beauty and meaning in the Bible and Koran. But from my time in the Navy, and with the Marines, people will avoid the Chaplains office if they are... like me... and I don't blame them. Talking about supernatural elements, about God, about destiny, prayer... these things aren't translatable or meaningful to the Humanist group (and I am throwing in the atheists, agnostics, non-pref, unaffiliated with them). It would just be nice to see the language of morale and spiritual fitness be applicable to ALL service members.
So this would, in my opinion, strengthen the overall reach of the Chaplain Corps. More billets. more turnover and access to the programs that the chapel/chaplains run. More conversations about meaningful topics, like morality, ethics, spirituality, family, community, love, devotion....
I just don't see how inclusion would hinder any mission going forward.
Thanks again Major.
Best.
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