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Please tell me that nobody finds this to be an acceptable way to joke around. I am one of the most humor filled people around, but some things are sacred to me and should not be messed with. This is one of them.
Honor Guard
Respect
Disrespect
Posted 12 y ago
Responses: 30
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It is getting so bad, I think we as SR NCOs, JR NCOs, Officers and future Leaders need to take a close look at the stupidity that we are seeing herebrothers and sisters in arms . Soldiers, Sailors, Marines and Airmen all are taking pictures of things like this and giving us all a black eye. THese things will NEVER, in todays society, be only a joke among friends. (even though this a a joke in very poor taste). With the technology today a pic you took 5 minutes ago will be all over the world in minutes. maybe even seconds. It amazes me that these knuckleheads still take distasteful pictures and post to a social media network.... Didn't we learn from Abu Graib? The Marines urinating on the dead insurgent? The ignorant young woman at the tomb of the unknowns, and most recently the SRA with the POW flag? Yes some things are sacred, like the United States Military! Everything we do while in uniform reflects our branch and the Military as a whole.
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CPT(P) (Join to see)
Thank you, CSM, for saying this. You are absolutely right.
I had an NCO that I deployed with back in 09 write me and tell me that one of his Soldiers was in that class photo, he didn't know it got posted on instagram, and he is very upset with the actions of his former classmate. His Soldier is also the only one standing at attention, like for a real professional class photo.
I told my friend to use this as a learning point for his Soldier. I hope that mentoring is taking place so these younger joes think about things before they post them. Social media IS real life!!
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SSG Daniel Rosploch
Its not just the Soldiers, though. Somewhere in that group of "kids" is an NCO, an NCO that cares more about being likeable than being the standard. If there's one thing I've learned through losing my E-5 and getting it back is that being liked by your Soldiers will only screw every one. I have more respect and more love for those NCOs that were hard on me, that lived and breathed "the standard" (even if I didn't understand the purpose of said standard) than I ever will for an NCO that tries to be friends with his/her Soldiers. Part of that mindset starts with junior NCOs being pushed hard by the next level up.
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Yet these same Soldiers are the first to complain that their COC is toxic or that their leadership is the root of the problems in the military these days. Unbelievable.<br>
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A1C Michael David Severson
Well, blame those above who are toxic, and use that as a springboard to justify bad behavior when they do wrong, and are called on it.
For us older folks that remember the famous line by Flip Wilson, "The devil made me do it!," we all laughed, knowing the truth back then. Such an excuse was funny, but we still kept our bearing in real life that we are responsible for ourselves.
Now we have descended into professional victimhood, nobody will take blame for anything, and living up to a substandard rule of morals and ethics rots the core of not only the military ranks, but civilization as a whole.
History is replete with anecdotal evidence of empires falling apart from within, rather than without. You can see this in both sacred and secular writings.
The Greek and Roman armies were among the most advanced in terms of strategic and tactical warfare in their time. In the end, both empires fell not from failure of their militias per se, but from a national corruption that bled across all fabric and strata of their societies.
The Dark Ages after the fall of Rome demonstrates recent history very well. I shudder at the thought that our society would be repeating history that these other great empires and peoples experienced.
However, if we do not stand for anything, we will fall for everything our hungry eyes desire. If the military, which has been the most maligned segment of society in the eyes of many over time, becomes the last bastion of morals, decency, honor, respect, courtesy, etc., then let us bear the brunt of any reproach with our heads up, unflinching and unapologetic for our standards.
We just might end up being the last great example of all things virtuous to our nation, if our nation's soul continues its downward spiral.
Each of us can make a difference, and collectively, a great impact on the soul of our nation. But it must start with us. We can gripe here, and express our dismay.
However, if we do not make our words productive in creating good fruit with the influence of our daily living, we are just breaking a lot of wind, instead of giving birth to something substantial...
Let's roll people!
MD AKA Doc... :-)
For us older folks that remember the famous line by Flip Wilson, "The devil made me do it!," we all laughed, knowing the truth back then. Such an excuse was funny, but we still kept our bearing in real life that we are responsible for ourselves.
Now we have descended into professional victimhood, nobody will take blame for anything, and living up to a substandard rule of morals and ethics rots the core of not only the military ranks, but civilization as a whole.
History is replete with anecdotal evidence of empires falling apart from within, rather than without. You can see this in both sacred and secular writings.
The Greek and Roman armies were among the most advanced in terms of strategic and tactical warfare in their time. In the end, both empires fell not from failure of their militias per se, but from a national corruption that bled across all fabric and strata of their societies.
The Dark Ages after the fall of Rome demonstrates recent history very well. I shudder at the thought that our society would be repeating history that these other great empires and peoples experienced.
However, if we do not stand for anything, we will fall for everything our hungry eyes desire. If the military, which has been the most maligned segment of society in the eyes of many over time, becomes the last bastion of morals, decency, honor, respect, courtesy, etc., then let us bear the brunt of any reproach with our heads up, unflinching and unapologetic for our standards.
We just might end up being the last great example of all things virtuous to our nation, if our nation's soul continues its downward spiral.
Each of us can make a difference, and collectively, a great impact on the soul of our nation. But it must start with us. We can gripe here, and express our dismay.
However, if we do not make our words productive in creating good fruit with the influence of our daily living, we are just breaking a lot of wind, instead of giving birth to something substantial...
Let's roll people!
MD AKA Doc... :-)
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SSG (Join to see)
A1C Michael David Severson You said "The Greek and Roman armies were among the most advanced in terms of strategic and tactical warfare in their time. In the end, both empires fell not from failure of their militias per se, but from a national corruption that bled across all fabric and strata of their societies."
I've heard this before but I always wondered why people thought this way. When do you perceive the Roman empire as having fallen. The Eastern Roman Empire didn't actually fall until 1453, you could be referring to the split between Eastern and Western Empires that took place around 285 or the Western Empire which eventually became the Holy Roman Empire.
I've heard this before but I always wondered why people thought this way. When do you perceive the Roman empire as having fallen. The Eastern Roman Empire didn't actually fall until 1453, you could be referring to the split between Eastern and Western Empires that took place around 285 or the Western Empire which eventually became the Holy Roman Empire.
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On a side note, for those of you referring to funeral honors as 'funeral detail', I ask you to think about the meaning of what you are saying. I can tell you believe they are honors, so refer to them as such. A detail is something boring, menial (and yes, sometimes necessary), but not something you necessarily feel honored to do. Anything involving the fallen, and the flag, should always be referred to as 'honors', because they are an absolute honor to be a part of. <div><br></div><div>Just my opinion, but I learned this a decade ago at AIT, when I was the student 1SG and giving the report to 1SG-actual. He stopped me when I said 'X amount of Soldiers on flag detail' and asked me if I thought that working with the flag was an honor. I said, yes of course, 1SG! He told me to always refer to it as such, because others pay attention, and it shows how we feel about it. That has always stuck with me. </div>
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A1C Michael David Severson
Honor is an inexorable element as a member of the Armed Services, regardless of branch. Every effort should reflect that, you brought that to light quite well!!
Back in my day, we had the credo, "Death before Dishonor!" Better to be the honored dead, than a disgraced malefactor.
Back in my day, we had the credo, "Death before Dishonor!" Better to be the honored dead, than a disgraced malefactor.
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It's Soldiers like this that put a bad name to the Military in general by doing things like this. Some of the best Soldiers I knew bled and died in this uniform and its a shame how these so called Soldiers disgrace it and a military funeral like its some kind of comedy hour. NO Respect, NO honor, and absolutely NO Military Bearing or discipline at all in these pictures. What make things worst is that people actually liked these pictures 18 and 16 times like nothing is wrong here.
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I did about 6 months of funeral detail when I was stationed at Hood. We had a pretty good crew and we joked in between our details, but we NEVER said anything about the detail itself, we never criticized the mourners, the deceased, etc. Yes, doing two to three funerals a week can get depressing, but there are other outlets. This is a blatant disregard to one's military bearing, a lack of respect for the veteran and the uniform, and I hope to God that the so-called leaders of these servicemembers (I refuse to call them Soldiers) are held responsible just as their subordinates. Shame on them.
Y'know, prior to me getting out (and true to this day), there was a common gripe among some of the better NCOs that the Army was going to sh*t. Seeing this just reaffirms that belief. What a sad day for our Army.
Y'know, prior to me getting out (and true to this day), there was a common gripe among some of the better NCOs that the Army was going to sh*t. Seeing this just reaffirms that belief. What a sad day for our Army.
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This is a disgrace to all men and women in uniform, and completely disrespectful. Every one of these Soldiers should be punished.
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MSG (Join to see)
I couldn't agree with you more sir. This picture is toxic in many different ways. Where was the chain of command when this was happening is my question
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SGT (Join to see)
if actions like this don't make your blood boil there might be something wrong with you. it justifies the ucmj in every way
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SGT (Join to see)
I agree, and not just punished, but kicked out. As far as all the people who "liked" the photos and comments, if any of them are military, they should be punished as well.
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this is more than inappropriate its god damn disgusting if we gotta kick people out of the Army its these people, soldiers should be honored that they've been chosen to be apart of a funeral detail not bitch or moan about it. i take funeral details to heart. one of my good friends died in Afghanistan back in 2011 and i had to call his mother so i can go to his funeral to pay my respects and it was by far the hardest thing i have done in my life i couldn't imagine what his parents or his fiancee had to go through. seeing this just makes my blood boil. i have no pity for whatever punishment these soldiers get
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While my unit was on funeral Honors I volunteered for every funeral I could and made sure that whoever went on the funeral with me knew that this is an honor and they had better not take it lightly. If one of the Soldiers would try to make light of any of the funeral's we did I would ensure they would never make that mistake again. However I lucked out and we had Soldiers that realized the honor it was to provide final honor's for the deceased Soldiers that we were providing final honor's for seeing stuff like this seriously makes me sick to my stomach. I can only hope that their chain ensures they are properly punished for this disgrace.
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SSG (Join to see)
SSG Abel, I wholeheartedly agree regarding funeral honors. I had the privilege to be the NCOIC for a funeral honors team about 10 years ago. While it was heartbreaking, it was also amazing and such an honor to represent the military for a family. I also had the privilege, several times, to present the Flag to the family. It choked me up many times.
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SSG (Join to see)
I agree with you 100% most of the funeral's I had the honor of doing I was the NCOIC and presenting the flag to the Soldiers next of kin if that honor does not choke you up and inject you with pride knowing you were able to do the recently deceased Soldier proud then there is something wrong with you. I know whenever I was conducting honors we were told we could leave after the ceremony but I would make sure me and my Soldiers would stand off to the side until the last person left so they knew that we were not just there to do a "quick ceremony" and leave but so that they would know that we actually cared and saw it as an honor to their loved one.
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SSG (Join to see)
No doubt. For me, the toughest were the first two I did. Most of the funerals, as the NCOIC, I would be the closest one to the grave-site and stand about 50 feet away. As the bugler played taps and I stood at attention saluting the casket, there were 2-3 dozen sets of eyes on me. Talk about being nervous.
I did the same thing after the ceremony. We would stand to the side and wait for an appropriate time to depart. It gave the family members time for themselves. Some would come up and thank us, which for me wasn't necessary since it was an honor to be there.
I did the same thing after the ceremony. We would stand to the side and wait for an appropriate time to depart. It gave the family members time for themselves. Some would come up and thank us, which for me wasn't necessary since it was an honor to be there.
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SSG (Join to see)
ya and if they tried to thank me for conducting honor's I would make sure to let them know that it was our honor to do this for them. I actually looked forward to conducting honors as choked up as I would get at times it is by far the biggest honor I have had in the army.
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What in the world??? What is wrong with service-members now a days??? Got the Airman and the POW/MIA mural, now this. Where is the honor? Where is the decency? Where is the responsibility and accountability? Truly disappointed and saddened.
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OK, my objective is to stay calm on this but I really doubt that will happen so bear with me. I am retired from the Kentucky National Guard with 24 years of service, 19 of them active. My very first combat tour was Grenada, then Desert Shield/Storm, Somalia, and a trip back to the Gulf for OIF in 06-07. The last tour was with the Infantry with the KY National Guard. I have lost enough friends that early in my career I stopped having friends, and started referring to them as acquaintances. That in itself is a sad statement. What's sadder is this. We depend on our fellow soldiers to not leave us behind either wounded, or dead. If it is the later, then we depend on each other to at least do us the honor of a decent send off to Fiddler's Green.
Now we have soldiers, whether National Guard or Regular Army is irrelevant, that have to audacity to do this to disrespect the Honor Guard. It's also irrelevant if there was an actual trooper in the casket or not. Look behind them! It's the American Flag. The flag I flew from my radio aerial on my tank in Desert Storm. Same flag flying over the Tomb of the Unknown. Same flag that will be on me when I go to the Green. It is blatant disrespect for the Flag, our country and the US Army. They deserve no mercy.
On top of that, I believe the Wisconsin National Guard needs the proverbial enema. From the top down, they need to go. This is a total breakdown of the entire chain of command from The Adjutant General (TAG) down to these individual's squad leaders. If my troops under me had even thought about doing this, I would have had their ass to put it mildly. This is, in my opinion, a prime example of how the military as a whole has got this "touchy feely" don't hurt someone's feelings attitude and it's dragging us all down with it.
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