Posted on Mar 2, 2015
VETERAN HIRING: If a company states they are "Veteran Friendly," what is your initial reaction?
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Do you believe the organization...
Posted in these groups: 
Employment
Civilian Career
Employment Civilian Career
Posted 11 y ago
Responses: 61
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It's striking to me the amount of companies that really lack the time and resources needed to do veteran outreach. This is a different era of veteran hiring. To use an analogy, you could consider many vets to be NFL franchise players these days...still on this rise in career progression, excellent leadership qualities, many times multiple degrees and tons of valuable real world experience. Hiring vets isn't just a PR issue anymore, it's a smart business decision and will impact the bottom line for decades at companies who hire smart. I think it's clear by one phone call with a recruiter at any level as to how serious the company is about veteran hiring. Those companies who get it, have trained and equipped their staff appropriately. Those that don't, will fly the vet friendly flag which fools no one but those that don't understand what it takes to effectively recruit and grow military talent.
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SFC Chad Sowash
That's a great analogy Brandon. No question, there is a need for companies to first assess their needs and gaps before building a program. The beautiful thing about this talent pool is that it's never going away. Every year skilled men and women transition into the civilian world while TA chases and steals talent from each other. The smart, business savvy orgs are seeing the benefits and building teams focused on driving this talent pool into their very own ranks.
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Having been on both sides of this issue, and having worked for more than one private-sector employer as a Military Recruiter I can tell you a few things from first hand perspective.
1. The tax break is negligible. If an employer is seeking to maximize it's return of investment this way, then it will be disappointed. Very few new hires actually qualify for this tax break because of the narrow parameters.
2. Companies genuinely see the value in hiring military veterans. The hard- and soft-skills that veterans hold and embody are truly desired by most companies and hiring managers.
3. As always, there are a few other factors that play into whether or not an individual gets hired. Actual skillsets, applying for jobs beneath or above their actual skillsets, the ability of recruiters to sell military candidates to the hiring managers, recruiter's ability to identify applicable skillsets from military-jargon heavy resumes. The list goes on.
We try to hire as many vets as possible while still getting the best candidate for the job. Sometimes it's a great fit, other times it isn't. There are plenty of recruiters out there with a military background who aren't military focused, per se, but will seek out a fellow vet when doing their due diligence for the hiring manager. I tend to take the company at face value when they say they are Veteran Friendly.
1. The tax break is negligible. If an employer is seeking to maximize it's return of investment this way, then it will be disappointed. Very few new hires actually qualify for this tax break because of the narrow parameters.
2. Companies genuinely see the value in hiring military veterans. The hard- and soft-skills that veterans hold and embody are truly desired by most companies and hiring managers.
3. As always, there are a few other factors that play into whether or not an individual gets hired. Actual skillsets, applying for jobs beneath or above their actual skillsets, the ability of recruiters to sell military candidates to the hiring managers, recruiter's ability to identify applicable skillsets from military-jargon heavy resumes. The list goes on.
We try to hire as many vets as possible while still getting the best candidate for the job. Sometimes it's a great fit, other times it isn't. There are plenty of recruiters out there with a military background who aren't military focused, per se, but will seek out a fellow vet when doing their due diligence for the hiring manager. I tend to take the company at face value when they say they are Veteran Friendly.
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SFC Chad Sowash
Hey Jeff, thanks for the insight.
I'd like to say that our experiences are just about night and day. After working with hundreds of major F500 companies for nearly a decade I've seen incentives create major impact while building a program and proving the veteran hiring business case (ROI).
I agree many companies do want to hire veterans, but they don't know how or their focus is more on the Charity Case instead of the Business Case, which dooms them from the start.
In closing, I'm very happy to hear that you and your organization tries to hire veterans, moreover I appreciate your insight and experience. It takes more than one set of eyes on the objective to provide good intel in many circumstances and I appreciate you lending us your in this case.
Sincerely,
Chad
I'd like to say that our experiences are just about night and day. After working with hundreds of major F500 companies for nearly a decade I've seen incentives create major impact while building a program and proving the veteran hiring business case (ROI).
I agree many companies do want to hire veterans, but they don't know how or their focus is more on the Charity Case instead of the Business Case, which dooms them from the start.
In closing, I'm very happy to hear that you and your organization tries to hire veterans, moreover I appreciate your insight and experience. It takes more than one set of eyes on the objective to provide good intel in many circumstances and I appreciate you lending us your in this case.
Sincerely,
Chad
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MSgt David Krones
It seems to me that all to often, the HR hiring structure is woefully under informed and honestly unprepared to adequately cross-correlate military skill sets to actual jobs. Having gone back to school to complete a business degree (completed at the end of 2014), most of the academic community does not even know how to try this approach. To be fair, most of us transitioning also have a difficult time doing that as well. The hard part is putting it on paper in a resume format that the civilian sector hiring officials can easily understand.
Thanks for your insights Jeff and Chad!
Sincerely,
Dave
Thanks for your insights Jeff and Chad!
Sincerely,
Dave
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PVT (Join to see)
SFC Chad Sowash Believe it or not part of this is a training issue. Non-military recruiters need to be trained to sell a military candidate. Rather than asking "will you accept a military candidate?" and move on having checked the box, they need to ask follow on questions. Things like "how much experience will you accept in lieu of education?" or "will you provide gap training or OJT for someone who is new to the industry?"
Most people are hired based on qualifications, but most are fired on behaviors. My point is to recruit from a pool of people with solid behaviors and train to bridge the gap. Unfortunately that isn't always available depending on the situation (timing, money, or other resources).
Most people are hired based on qualifications, but most are fired on behaviors. My point is to recruit from a pool of people with solid behaviors and train to bridge the gap. Unfortunately that isn't always available depending on the situation (timing, money, or other resources).
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If the company has a good track record, excellent, if not they should be sued for false advertising. But, I would guess it as useful as this: "The Uniformed Services Employment and Reemployment Rights Act of 1994 (USERRA 38 U.S.C. 4301-4335)"
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I see the results of this survey and have experienced the truth of those results that it's hard to get companies that say they're Veteran Friendly to honor that commitment. My followup question would be, How can we change that? Because if anyone can, I believe we can...
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I think in most cases the company genuinely wants to hire veterans. However, I don't think they are equipped to be successful. When we get out of the military we go through SAPS & TAPS and receive an emense amount of information on how to present our military skills in a manner that someone without military experience can understand. Unfortunately, I think in many of cases, individuals who never served find it difficult to accept a 22 year old veteran may actually have that leadership skill the company they work for is looking for.
I believe companies that are truly looking to be veteran friendly should take the initiative to understand what exactly that means,and do it because they believe in our abilities as veterans and not just because of a tax break.
I believe companies that are truly looking to be veteran friendly should take the initiative to understand what exactly that means,and do it because they believe in our abilities as veterans and not just because of a tax break.
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GI Jobs' Military Friendly Employer "MFE" rankings (google it) is a good place to find real military friendly employers as it's a data driven survey that takes into account the number of veterans hired each year, the total number of veteran employees, and the types of internal veteran programs offered, to name just a few of the factors. During my transition I experienced better results dealing with companies on this list. I now work for one of those MFE companies - ManTech with 45% of its employees being veterans. Always be cautious but don't be dismissive because there are a lot of great companies that hire lots of veterans and are truly military friendly.
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I get the impression they are not actually hiring but just making the claim. I see a lot of employers who are veteran friendly, actually have no jobs available and haven't for a while. In that case I doubt "veteran friendly" really means anything. There's just no jobs available and in that case maybe they are a great place to work for with minimal turnover? There was one company I got real hard on for claiming they are veteran friendly and not hiring, and they actually were at a job fair I went to recently. Didn't want to be a hypocrite or maybe I was being too hard so I talked to them. The recruiter got all mad when I told him I was not willing to relocate and if they had anything available locally because they have a big presence here. The recruiter handed me a piece of paper for a local job that closed two years ago. And this is a company that has done a lot of advertising claiming they are veteran friendly and they are all over the place locally so it is very odd nothing is available.
Locally, a lot of the employers who claim they are veteran friendly and are hiring a lot of veterans don't always have the skills they are looking for and are not willing to budge or even train. There are a lot of jobs that require sales experience locally and this may be limited to my location. You do not really get this if/when you are in the military, unless you were a recruiter. I am finding that very few employers are willing to train, and many of the employers at job fairs for service members and/or veterans, the employers or recruiters at these events do not know anything about the military. In addition I have seen some employers and ask myself "Why are you even here?" at a military job fair? I have seen employers at job fairs in the medical field specifically who are looking for doctors, nurses and psychiatrists. I worked in the clinic for many years, and almost every field I just mentioned I have yet to even hear of someone be out of work at all in those fields for more than maybe a month tops after they get out, and you are not going to find them at a military job fair as they have a job back wherever they want to relocate to, locally lined up or already recruited. I'm sure there are exceptions but I have yet to see it.
I see Walmart and I think Starbucks guaranteeing veterans a job and that is an awesome gesture, however those jobs do not pay the bills and in some locations, the store may not be hiring and it may not even be full time. I have applied to a few places that claim they are veteran friendly, but the same day I applied I have gotten denied.
Realistically at this point I might as well get back in shape and go law enforcement or go to trucking school.
Locally, a lot of the employers who claim they are veteran friendly and are hiring a lot of veterans don't always have the skills they are looking for and are not willing to budge or even train. There are a lot of jobs that require sales experience locally and this may be limited to my location. You do not really get this if/when you are in the military, unless you were a recruiter. I am finding that very few employers are willing to train, and many of the employers at job fairs for service members and/or veterans, the employers or recruiters at these events do not know anything about the military. In addition I have seen some employers and ask myself "Why are you even here?" at a military job fair? I have seen employers at job fairs in the medical field specifically who are looking for doctors, nurses and psychiatrists. I worked in the clinic for many years, and almost every field I just mentioned I have yet to even hear of someone be out of work at all in those fields for more than maybe a month tops after they get out, and you are not going to find them at a military job fair as they have a job back wherever they want to relocate to, locally lined up or already recruited. I'm sure there are exceptions but I have yet to see it.
I see Walmart and I think Starbucks guaranteeing veterans a job and that is an awesome gesture, however those jobs do not pay the bills and in some locations, the store may not be hiring and it may not even be full time. I have applied to a few places that claim they are veteran friendly, but the same day I applied I have gotten denied.
Realistically at this point I might as well get back in shape and go law enforcement or go to trucking school.
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SrA David Steyer
My wife would have to get a job too if we moved so now two people would have to get a job instead of one. If it was just me then yes I would do so.
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When I hear or see the "Veteran Friendly" moniker from a business, in regards to employment - I would think that means that when they interview a veteran, the person doing the interview (or someone on the interview panel) is either a veteran or real intimate with military career fields. While a veteran may avoid using "military" lingo - they still may not always be able to explain what they did in the military is applicable to the current job they are applying for. Having someone conduct the interview or on the interviewing panel, that understands the military jargon and can help "translate" the veteran's skills for his/her counterparts - in order to make a better educated decision on whether or not to hire the said veteran.
In reality - it's probably nothing like that, but if/when i'm a business owner, that's what it will mean for my company.
In reality - it's probably nothing like that, but if/when i'm a business owner, that's what it will mean for my company.
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There's also the tax break incentives for companies as well.
https://www.whitehouse.gov/blog/2013/04/05/incentivizing-employers-hire-veterans-through-permanent-tax-credits
https://www.whitehouse.gov/blog/2013/04/05/incentivizing-employers-hire-veterans-through-permanent-tax-credits
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I have seen it way too often when it is something that companies say because they feel they have to. A true veteran friendly company sure doesn't have to hire veterans primarily but to make an effort to hire veterans and being accepting of the circumstances that comes with it.
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