Posted on Jun 12, 2016
What do you do when a soldier refuses to listen to your directions?
335K
5.22K
1.81K
192
192
0
This is a general question. If you have a soldier who refuses to listen to you, as a non-commissioned officer, do you simply put the incident on paper?
Example given- A soldier has unauthorized sunglasses on in a formation. You tell the soldier to take the sunglasses off. He/she refuses.
On the 4856, do you recommend for UCMJ? I've gone thru 600-20 and cannot find anything regarding this
Example given- A soldier has unauthorized sunglasses on in a formation. You tell the soldier to take the sunglasses off. He/she refuses.
On the 4856, do you recommend for UCMJ? I've gone thru 600-20 and cannot find anything regarding this
Posted >1 y ago
Responses: 770
No UCMJ needed. A proper unit will police their own and get Snuffy squared away.....right away.
(0)
(0)
Peer pressure is also a great tool. If you've got a pos Snuffy let the squad, or platoon take care of his attitude.
That is after you remove his sunglasses for him. There is a great reply from a CSM but I can't find it again. Make sure you read all your replies.
That is after you remove his sunglasses for him. There is a great reply from a CSM but I can't find it again. Make sure you read all your replies.
(0)
(0)
Brings back memories, alright, I'm a PFC put in charge of company formations for phase 4 soldiers (soldiers not authorized off post privileges during AIT) on weekends, duty NCO directed me that if I give a just and proper order to a soldier it should be taken as though it came from the NCOs mouth, soldier was wearing sunglasses in a company formation in which no one else was, also they were not in accordance with AR 670-1, directed soldier to remove them, SM refused, I removed and took SM to NCO, typical butt chewing was told her disrespected NCO by disrespecting me blah blah blah, NCO asks me what I would do in this situation since soldier already had a previous counseling for violation of 670-1, I recommended that SM write the section of 670-1, write 5 page essay on said section and why the should follow that section to be turned in the following day, and that SM is required to bring the offending article to all company formations for remainder of time in company and be recommended for Art15 for failure to obey a lawful order from a NCO if the sunglasses are not present at all formations, problem solved (SM ended up getting an article 15 for not turning in essay on time and NEVER bringing the sunglasses to formation, was asked several times to present them and was always met with an "I forgot Sgt")
(0)
(0)
If I had done this as a (Marine) PFC back in 2005, I have no doubt that the Corporals would have broken ranks and curb-stomped me until I was retarded. By the time I was a Sergeant, that particular tool was removed from my tool-box. On another note, I did commit this exact offense (refusing to remove my shades in formation) as a Corporal. Luckily, the Sergeant in charge of the formation was my friend, and he knew it was because I was completely shitfaced. Don't hate. We were all shitfaced.
(0)
(0)
How about failure to obey a lawful order?
Disrespect to an NCO?
I've seen it too much.....people who don't want to be the bad guy and try to cajole, coddle, befriend, bribe and beg for obedience. It doesn't work. You end up with a bunch of SFCs like the ones I work with now who grew up in the age where drill sergeants couldn't yell at them and they could get away with crap like this.
Once a Soldier has an MOS---professionalism (and following a lawful directive is the act of a professional) is not an option anymore. Don't ask for it--demand it. Put it in developmental counselings. Read about building the team. Team members pull their weight and do their share. Following basic uniform guidance is part of that. Does your 1SG /PSG have to call you out in formation and ask you why your troop is wearing ray bans in formation?
There are certain aspects of rapport building with a Soldier that is fine. You are dealing with disrespect. Any rapport you build here is you trying to be the good guy. In doing that, you are becoming more like him.....isn't he supposed to be getting more like you? You are the NCO, right?
I'm not saying to be a hammer. If you are only a hammer--then everyone else is nails. Put the standards down on paper and follow up with the good and the bad. The Soldier performance will dictate what you have to say. But you have to be holding up the standard.
You asked about UCMJ.....why don't you look there? 600-20 isn't going to tell you anything on this.
Disrespect to an NCO?
I've seen it too much.....people who don't want to be the bad guy and try to cajole, coddle, befriend, bribe and beg for obedience. It doesn't work. You end up with a bunch of SFCs like the ones I work with now who grew up in the age where drill sergeants couldn't yell at them and they could get away with crap like this.
Once a Soldier has an MOS---professionalism (and following a lawful directive is the act of a professional) is not an option anymore. Don't ask for it--demand it. Put it in developmental counselings. Read about building the team. Team members pull their weight and do their share. Following basic uniform guidance is part of that. Does your 1SG /PSG have to call you out in formation and ask you why your troop is wearing ray bans in formation?
There are certain aspects of rapport building with a Soldier that is fine. You are dealing with disrespect. Any rapport you build here is you trying to be the good guy. In doing that, you are becoming more like him.....isn't he supposed to be getting more like you? You are the NCO, right?
I'm not saying to be a hammer. If you are only a hammer--then everyone else is nails. Put the standards down on paper and follow up with the good and the bad. The Soldier performance will dictate what you have to say. But you have to be holding up the standard.
You asked about UCMJ.....why don't you look there? 600-20 isn't going to tell you anything on this.
(0)
(0)
Article 92. Failure to obey a lawful order. Place member on report via report of offense
(0)
(0)
Article 15 under Article 91 & 92 UCMJ. Drop the hammer. If a soldier is going to challenge your authority as a noncommissioned officer, then that soldier needs to be made an example to the others of that improper behavior and blatant disrespect will not be tolerated. There is no place in the Armed Forces for blatant disrespect of warrant, commissioned, or noncommissioned officers. All soldiers regardless of their rank need to have a full understanding of their place in the chain of command and the consequences of their actions. If you allow a subordinate to challenge your authority then they take away your powerbase in the eyes of all of your soldiers . This under no circumstances can be allowed to happen.
(0)
(0)
Either do it or I guarantee that before I'm finished with you, you will wish to hell you did.
(0)
(0)
a reasonable idea, tell the Soldier to step out of ranks. tell the soldier to report to the First Sgt office.
Turn the platoon over to the next person in charge.
Follow the soldier to the office or First Sergeants office.
Inform he or she that they have two choices.
One. Put them in their pocket and don't wear them in formation again.
Two. Tell the soldier a lawful order was given and if they continue to disobey the order,
Read the soldier their rights and request UCMJ action. Request 14 days restriction, 14 days extra duty and reduction in rank one grade.
You as the Platoon Sergeant must ensure you do this process by the book so the sleeze bag can not go to the IG complaining of harassment.
Turn the platoon over to the next person in charge.
Follow the soldier to the office or First Sergeants office.
Inform he or she that they have two choices.
One. Put them in their pocket and don't wear them in formation again.
Two. Tell the soldier a lawful order was given and if they continue to disobey the order,
Read the soldier their rights and request UCMJ action. Request 14 days restriction, 14 days extra duty and reduction in rank one grade.
You as the Platoon Sergeant must ensure you do this process by the book so the sleeze bag can not go to the IG complaining of harassment.
(0)
(0)
Read This Next


SGT
Squad Leader
Discipline
Team Leader
