Posted on Jun 12, 2016
SSG Emergency Action Controller / Ops Nco
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This is a general question. If you have a soldier who refuses to listen to you, as a non-commissioned officer, do you simply put the incident on paper?

Example given- A soldier has unauthorized sunglasses on in a formation. You tell the soldier to take the sunglasses off. He/she refuses.


On the 4856, do you recommend for UCMJ? I've gone thru 600-20 and cannot find anything regarding this
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Responses: 770
SPC Jeff Peek
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Front lean and rest until he dies
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CPT Pedro Meza
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Dam, you are not Old School are you? 1970's solution the NCO tells every one in his squad to drop and do 10/20 push ups, in formation the Platoon leaders will have the whole platoon drop to support the NCO and to teach the soldiers that his/her poor choice will be corrected by his peers once the NCO leaves.
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SrA Sean Womersley
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Edited >1 y ago
They are called orders for a reason. When you sign that dotted line to join the military, you are subjected to follow those orders and must do so. It seems like this "sense of entitlement" I see with the current generation of teens/young adults applies to some of our younger military members as well. Although my heart is with SFC Boyd's response, my brain is siding with 1LT De Jesus on this situation. Everything is too PC these days to the point that going in a straight line is no longer the correct way to get to your intended destination.
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SGT Stanley Bass
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1. The soldier will take those glasses off there on the spot
2. Afterwards there will be verbal counselling, if you don't simply have the ext NCO take charge of the formation while you and the soldier go take care of that verbal counselling
3. Another incident and it goes on paper
4 A third incident and Extra duty will be incurred
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SSG (Other / Not listed)
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Yes, you could do that. Article 92 is a serious violation of the UCMJ. I think crushing sunglasses is a bit extreme. But, I still wouldn't back down. In this day and age, there seems to be a trend rearing its ugly head where junior enlisted feel as if they have options in everything associated with this military life.
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PO1 Tharin Young
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Sending a person directly to NJP for something like this won't go very far and will most likely reflect poorly upon you. In such cases I would give official counseling in to the person in question, and doing so in the presence of your immediate supervisor is a good idea, and may actually be required. If this doesn't wake him up to his transgression, repeat as often as is necessary to show a pattern of insubordination, then send him to the show, with all of the recorded counseling in hand for ammunition.

I never actually had to go that far myself. the counseling will usually get their attention, but I've known people who did have such special cases assigned to them.
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SGT James Copley
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OK so every one on here seem to be really awesome and never been a new NCO in the New army!! And let us be really if you did some of this they would be the first to UCMJ you. This is what I would do

1st I hope that the other NCO's are one your side
2nd if there is nothing in the AR 600-2 then " I know that the 82nd has a hand book that cover everything that the AR douse not" So I would go to that next and I know for a fact that the 82nd had a reg in there for that so I am sure that what ever unit you are in would do the same.

3rd I would confront the PVT ask them were their DIV book was and when they don't have it PT them and or wright them up for that.

Then you not only can get them on being out of uniform, not respecting an NCO and on top of that not having their DIV hand book.

Then I would let them know everything I could do to them and how it can F up their further in the Army and them go from there depending on how they react to all of the.

AND if some one else want to try and play that game again that is when you nail them to the cross after that.

you need to let them know that yes they may have knew you ask an E-4 but that douse not give them the ok for them to walk all over you.
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SSG Mark Jordan
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Edited >1 y ago
you do write on the 4856 I recommend UCMJ. I will give you an example. PVT Joe Snuffy.
The purpose of this counseling is to document your violation under the UCMJ ARTICLE 91 insubordinate to a Non Commissioned Offiver. On 16 June 2016 at 0550 you were given a lawful order by myself SSG Jordan.To get in formation, you refused and said, no. You by doing so are also in violation of ARTICLE 92 of the UCMJ failure to orders. I SSG Jordan am recommending UCMJ. Most of the time on you can give corrective training on the spot should fix. I still always put in packet even corrective training thing what they were. Since this sm was so disrespectful and did not follow orders if you told them to drop and they did not you now have a strong case for artice 15 right off the bat. That would be disrespect to you and not folloing orders twice.
Then you put what is called the magic statement in there
Sepration Notification: If this substandard conduct continues, action may be initiated to separate you from the Army IAW 635-200. If you are involuntarily separted There is a big thing that goes there.
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SSG Mark Jordan
SSG Mark Jordan
>1 y
you make example out of one mother and the rest will fall in line I never had any one ever refuse an order I gave. I also never refused an order given to me by a senior either.
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PFC Combat Engineer
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You put his ass in order or you give him a article 15 reduce pay rank and send his ass to fort levanworth. If that won't work how about a good old fashion blanket party.
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Cpl Tiltrotor Crew Chief, MV-22
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You signed a contract to conform to the rules and regs of the military. They do not conform to you the individual because you want to be different. I'd do paperwork then proceed to make his life a living hell for so long as he's in my unit.
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