Posted on Oct 23, 2015
SSG Infantryman
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What is it that the cadre and policy makers in NCOES schools think they are accomplishing by suppressing 240 years of culture. Secondly, I don't know of anyone who after the school was like "oh I better not cuss now I'm a warrior leader"
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Responses: 142
SSG Carlos Madden
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Professionalism and the NCO Creed. "No one is More Proffesional than I"
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CSM Charles Hayden
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Edited 9 y ago
SSG (Join to see) That was, is, and continues to be "official" policy. In 1966, a CSM had a talk w/ me abt my verbiage. I recall saying, Yes , Sergeant Major! I still cannot recall what he was talking abt!

Damn; now I recall a later CSM having similar words w/ me abt my addressing him as a ??????
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SGT Jimmy Carpenter
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I went through PLDC in 1996 I think and there was a no profanity rule in place then. Being a grunt, it was very difficult to refrain from profanity but I managed. It's understandable the reasoning behind it, it's considered "unprofessional" to use profanity, even (probably) more so in the civilian world.
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SFC Everett Oliver
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Warrior Leader? Is that what we call it today? SMH.....

As best I can remember this started way back in 91 when as an Operations Sergeant in an AIT Training Company we were told not to use derogatory comments toward the students nor were we to smoke within site of the students. The stupidity of it all was one of the reasons I retired....
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SFC G2 Ops Mcp Ncoic
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As a US Army Soldier I agreed to follow the rules and regulations. It is against UCMJ to use any indecent language, under ARTICLE 134. "Indecent" language is that which is grossly offensive to modesty, decency, or propriety, or shocks the moral sense, because of its vulgar, filthy, or disgusting nature, or its tendency to incite lustful thought. Language is indecent if it tends reasonably to corrupt morals or incite libidinous thoughts. The language must violate community standards. See paragraph 87 if the communication was made in the physical presence of a child.". I agreed to following these orders. There is no stipulation in my contract that I can follow only the rules that I agree with. Do I agree with the rule. I actually do. If you are not discipline to control what comes out of your mouth, than how can I trust you will be discipline enough with a finger on the trigger.
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CW2 Michael Mullikin
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Consider what our Army is doing to us:
• No swearing or other harsh language.
• No smoking, chewing or inhaling.
• Minimal drinking, most clubs have been closed.
• No fraternizing with the opposite sex, at least without a pre-contact agreement approved by and filed with JAG.
• Fraternizing with the same sex? No definitive guidance yet, but probably approved.
• No support for human trafficing. You have to get to the second to last paragraph of the policy letter to find out that patronizing prostitutes is not compatible with service in the US Army.
• Wearing of tattoos must be strictly regulated.
I couold go on, but I think you get the idea. Our leadership and its politically correct advisors are trying to transform the army into either Oliver Cromwell's New Model Puritan Army, the knights Templar or Hospitaller, the Theban Sacred Band.

One last question: what does any of this have to do with our army's ability to close with and destroy the enemy utilizing firepower, maneuver and shock effect?
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CW2 Michael Mullikin
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Reminds me of the time I was a tank commander and a chaplain came around to explain, using most of the arguments seen here. I advised that there are times, as when a main gun shell casing splits, sends a yellow fireball back into the turret, and turns all the exposed hair on everyone's bodies into fine grey ash—well, at times like those an "Oh, darn" or "Oh, drat" just doesn't seem very satisfying. I'm pleased to report that after consideration the chaplain agreed with me. When on of our young warriors is at the range and, forgetting where his muzzle is pointing, rips a three-round burst along the firing line what do you say? "Oh jinkies, Bob, PLEASE try to be more careful!!

The 1SG in the next post makes the point that it is a NEW generation and we must adapt. Some of us are old enough to remember the 60's and 70's when it really was a new generation which we persuaded to adapt to the military.

When you find that your trans-gendered driver has been kidnapped by the enemy and raped to death it will be important to carefully consider your remarks because we all know that hatred of the enemy is unprofessional.
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SSG Katherine Likely
SSG Katherine Likely
>1 y
I joined in 78 and my feeling is this - if i don't like the tone of the conversation I have the opportunity to give the negative mouth swearing genius with a bar of soap or simply walk away.

However, to answer your question - "When on of our young warriors is at the range and, forgetting where his muzzle is pointing, rips a three-round burst along the firing line what do you say?"

After taking his weapon - As calmly as I could muster, which would not be rated calm in a peaceful seance - I would say, "What the fuck do you think you are doing?" and then stand there starring at them with a mean glare - while they stammered out a response.
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CW2 Michael Mullikin
CW2 Michael Mullikin
>1 y
Roger that, SSG Likely!
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A1C Melissa Jackson
A1C Melissa Jackson
>1 y
I recently had a run in on here when I said I did not give a damn about something and some people who did not agree with my point of view both had mini-strokes because I resorted to "profanity"- they decided at once that I was a liberal (I am.) and when liberals cannot make a real argument they resort to profanity- then one of them extrapolated that since I used such an awful swear I must be ATHIEST!
Goodness. When I pointed out that such extreme reactions to the word: "damn" seemed a little startling from people who have served in the military- the marine threw out that people don't talk like that in the military- it is called professionalism.

Huh.
On my first day in the military I was called a (quotes~>) "stupid fucking bitch that doesn't have the brains God gave a cockroach" I did not feel at the time it would suit my purposes to scold the SSGT for her lack of professionalism. I fixed myself and got the HELL out of her way.

To this day I am wounded by this lack of professionalism---TO THIS DAY! Hell- if I weren't already 100% I might have to apply for a rating.
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CW2 Michael Mullikin
CW2 Michael Mullikin
>1 y
CW2 Michael Mullikin - When I was in basic I had a young hero squeeze off a couple of rounds which went into the dirt about two feet away from me. The drill sergeant walked up to the young man, who was prone at the time, snatched away his rifle, cleared it then beat him (hard) on the helmet three time with the butt end. After he was finished the drill sergeant said, "You are some kind of world-class dumb shit!'
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SSG Paul Ellis
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It's the new PC Army (which admittedly had it's start back in the late '90s.) Just because you don't cuss doesn't make you more "professional." It makes you more socially acceptable. In part, it's good manners. (You don't cuss up a storm while you're having lunch in a public place where there are wives and young children.) But I've known many "professional" NCOs who were a waste of space. They knew how to behave but not how to get anything done or manage their soldiers. When I was a young soldier, I had NCOs who called me everything except a child of God. And they were some of the best NCOs I ever had. They knew their jobs. They trained me. They gave me the appropriate attitude check when I messed up or got stupid.

When I was in, I didn't cuss all the time. There's a time and place. But not cussing at all (to extend to "My Girl" cadences is just one more step to turning soldiers into Boy Scouts with guns. Next thing you know, in addition to already giving recruits the option of rappelling in Basic Training pugil stick and bayonet training will be optional.
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SSG Katherine Likely
SSG Katherine Likely
>1 y
" But I've known many "professional" NCOs who were a waste of space." Especially in mock battles where they refused to take anything seriously and in a fox hole - I thank the good Lord that it wasn't real and we weren't facing a real enemy................... that is enough for any sane person to cuss profuseness and to ask God for forgiveness later.
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SGT William Howell
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When I went to WLC my instructors had a zero swearing policy long before this policy came into play. Their belief was that swearing was not professional and this was a professional's course. They make the rules, I just had to play by them. It was tough because I love the F bomb more than life itself.

I believe it is a correct way of teaching WLC. How can it be professional development if they allow things that are not professional?
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SSG Todd Halverson
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They are teaching you that you can be a successful leader without having to use profanity to get your message across. Great leaders can get their point across without cussing. I for one did and do cuss quite a lot.
Another reason for the no cussing is teaching discipline. Yes, they know everyone does use profanity in their everyday life. But, they are getting you to focus on getting you ideas across without profanity and it makes one really think about what they are saying.
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