Posted on Apr 22, 2016
What is your advice for Females joining the ranks of the combat jobs in the Military?
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I am an Army Recruiter and it would be great to share.
As we gear up to ship out some of our first female Future Soldiers in combat jobs, I ask of the members of RP, what is your advice for these young soldiers?
Please keep it constructive and nothing along the lines of they shouldn't be able to serve in these positions because that ship has sailed and opinions about how they should not serve in these positions are not going to change anything.
Edit: The conversation among RP members about mentoring these service members is amazing. Honestly, I did not know what to expect when I started the thread, because this is a subject many feel strong about. Thank you so much for all of your advice thus far, I cannot wait to share it with our female and male recruits and hope you share it in your ranks/communities as well. Together we are molding the future of the military.
As we gear up to ship out some of our first female Future Soldiers in combat jobs, I ask of the members of RP, what is your advice for these young soldiers?
Please keep it constructive and nothing along the lines of they shouldn't be able to serve in these positions because that ship has sailed and opinions about how they should not serve in these positions are not going to change anything.
Edit: The conversation among RP members about mentoring these service members is amazing. Honestly, I did not know what to expect when I started the thread, because this is a subject many feel strong about. Thank you so much for all of your advice thus far, I cannot wait to share it with our female and male recruits and hope you share it in your ranks/communities as well. Together we are molding the future of the military.
Edited >1 y ago
Posted >1 y ago
Responses: 398
I want to start off by saying that joining the Infantry was the best thing I ever did with my life, besides becoming a father. I sincerely loved doing what I did, and I loved the men I served with. We were a tight knit, cohesive brotherhood of likeminded individuals that made things happen. The pride that we took in ourselves, our platoon, battalion, and the division spoke volumes of the amazing leadership that we had (although not perfect, it was pretty damn close). Things worked the way they did because of the brotherhood developed over centuries of war fighting and developing the system that is in place today. I have no doubt that there are women out there than can outperform some of the men in the Infantry today, however, I don't believe that standards need to be changed in order to best suit the needs of a new gender entering the combat arms.
The argument can be made that its a male's natural instinct to protect a woman in times of danger, but honestly, with the training one receives over countless hours before deploying to combat, its instinctual to protect everyone within your unit. I believe its instinctive to protect anyone that shares a common bond with you.
I say this with the utmost respect towards service members of the opposite gender, but I do not feel that the Infantry is the place for females. The mental and physical stress that one endures during the training, and in an actual combat environment, is almost too much for some males to endure. Males and females are anatomically different. I am not saying that to bring up the age old 'menstrual cycle' debate that I heard time and time again while on active duty, I mean body composition wise. Men and women are constructed differently. Women have a different center of gravity, womens muscle composition, and bone density are different.
While I was still on active duty, there was discussion of the development of gender specific body armor being developed, and even female friendly Rucks and other gear being developed in order to better suit the needs of the female service member. Im not opposed to gear fitting correctly, by any stretch of the imagination. In fact I wish the Army would have spent more time developing a body armor that better suited the male frame better. the IOTV was by far the most uncomfortable thing I've ever been issued (long live the plate carrier). But, they don't make 'female friendly' man-packs, female friendly, mortar systems, m240 bravos, etc.
If the integration of female service members into combat arms MOS's is going to work, females cant be excluded from positions such as ammo barer, RTO, assistant gunner, and other 'Mule' jobs, simply because people are concerned about them being able to handle the weight. To not have them fill those positions would be seen as either favoritism or sexism, depending on who is looking at it. I filled many of those positions as I rose through the ranks, and until I became a team leader, I carried a fair bit of weight, and was miserable more times than not.
I don't know what the future holds. The Army tends to makes things work more times than not, and I never reached the ranks high enough to be a part of the decision making process for the whole Army, but I feel like if this is the direction the Army is headed, they will develop a system that will make it work.
The argument can be made that its a male's natural instinct to protect a woman in times of danger, but honestly, with the training one receives over countless hours before deploying to combat, its instinctual to protect everyone within your unit. I believe its instinctive to protect anyone that shares a common bond with you.
I say this with the utmost respect towards service members of the opposite gender, but I do not feel that the Infantry is the place for females. The mental and physical stress that one endures during the training, and in an actual combat environment, is almost too much for some males to endure. Males and females are anatomically different. I am not saying that to bring up the age old 'menstrual cycle' debate that I heard time and time again while on active duty, I mean body composition wise. Men and women are constructed differently. Women have a different center of gravity, womens muscle composition, and bone density are different.
While I was still on active duty, there was discussion of the development of gender specific body armor being developed, and even female friendly Rucks and other gear being developed in order to better suit the needs of the female service member. Im not opposed to gear fitting correctly, by any stretch of the imagination. In fact I wish the Army would have spent more time developing a body armor that better suited the male frame better. the IOTV was by far the most uncomfortable thing I've ever been issued (long live the plate carrier). But, they don't make 'female friendly' man-packs, female friendly, mortar systems, m240 bravos, etc.
If the integration of female service members into combat arms MOS's is going to work, females cant be excluded from positions such as ammo barer, RTO, assistant gunner, and other 'Mule' jobs, simply because people are concerned about them being able to handle the weight. To not have them fill those positions would be seen as either favoritism or sexism, depending on who is looking at it. I filled many of those positions as I rose through the ranks, and until I became a team leader, I carried a fair bit of weight, and was miserable more times than not.
I don't know what the future holds. The Army tends to makes things work more times than not, and I never reached the ranks high enough to be a part of the decision making process for the whole Army, but I feel like if this is the direction the Army is headed, they will develop a system that will make it work.
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SSG Bethany Viglietta
SGT Steven McMahon
Your last paragraph is spot on! Though, I have seen infantry units not necessarily play favoritism, but put the larger males on the heavier equipment. Generally I didn't see a male the size of me carrying a 240b; however, that individual covered some other necessary position/responsibility. You are right about the Army making things work and females will have to be able to fill all positions.
Your last paragraph is spot on! Though, I have seen infantry units not necessarily play favoritism, but put the larger males on the heavier equipment. Generally I didn't see a male the size of me carrying a 240b; however, that individual covered some other necessary position/responsibility. You are right about the Army making things work and females will have to be able to fill all positions.
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SSG Bethany Viglietta
SGT Michael Ryan There are threads already out there for opinions of whether or not women should be able to serve in these roles. This one is about advice for those who will serve in the roles.
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Give them he same advise you give the guys - tell them about what they can expect ruing training and what they can expect after training. I think I might even over emphasize the fact that the infantry is the "Queen of Battle" and that armor and artillery aren't far behind.
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Females joining combat arms need to understand the social impact to themselves when they do this. I have jumped out of airplanes for years where there are few females and equally as long been a male nurse which is rare. I have enjoyed being a male nurse and never minded being the only male at times, other times it can be lonely. If I want to take the discussion to sports or cars, usually only the tomboy girls can keep up. We have done well blending all walks of life into our military however sometimes you just want to talk about dresses, make-up, newest hair style, and being bald, I suck at the hair conversations... I am sure these females will strive to shoot, communicate, and move out well, learn their weapons and how to kill but when it comes time for the Holiday Ball, which mascara would go best with her dress is not advice she will get that day at the range. I am a better husband having worked with mostly women but sometimes who Bella is dating in Twilight is just not a conversation I always want to discuss. No I am not going to see Magic Mike with the girls and these females will experience some of this loneliness. It will not be purposeful or based on whether folks believe you belong there but a fact of life of being one girl amongst 200 men.
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During my some two years combat experience in Vietnam I fought against females from time to time. I found that they made great fanatics (they would sooner die for their cause than men would) but poor warriors (your job as a a warrior is to make the other sob dies for his cause, not you die for yours.) Every test run on this suject done on the military shows that women are just not capable so they will hinder the performance of that unit thus getting many unnecessarily hurt or killed. My advice - whether or not you like it - is tell them to join a noncombat branch.
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I Retired in 2015. I joined as a Heavy Construction Equipment Operator back in 1994. Throughout the majority my career, I was, in most cases, the only female. Women just did not last long and still to this day not many Women make it to the rank of Sergeant as an Engineer. Along the way, I was a Recruiter, earning the Morell Medallion and a Senior Drill Sergeant. I was a Platoon Sergeant, who led 32 Males and 3 Females ( 1 Sergeant E5) and ( 2 Privates First Class) down range, and carried out numerous Missions that a Female wasn't suppose to be doing, but guess what buttercup.... NCO's, lead from the front, so the majority of my platoon's missions was away from a COP/FOB....sometimes months at a time, So my role as a Platoon Sergeant included everything from securing ourselves/equipment in place , sleep cycle, work schedule, etc. To have made it that far is a testament to the Leaders in my EARLY CAREER. My leaders were the last of the Vietnam Leaders, Quarterly, you were tactically tested on your equipment. Those Men ensured that I knew my JOB. By leading from the front,.i.e. Counseling my Squad Leaders on how to Counsel and following up, P.T, Weapons, I was never questioned.
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Do what you have trained to do.do it well and come home safe.lead by example. Dont expect to be treated any different. Its a difficult job ,you've proven yourself as a soldier .never surrender and never leave a fellow soldier behind. Serve Honorably. I support you& thank you for your service. ARMY STRONG!
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If your a WM, female soldier, sailor or airman, just do your best. Learn all you can from anyone willing to give you correct information and training. Physical fitness and knowing your job to the detail are the most important issues to your job. Making good working relationships is 2nd to making the 2 most important work for you. Don't misunderstand this , but, I do not believe women should see combat ( its just the way I have been raised and the way I feel about the protection of women period). That being said, if you as a female can complete any and all training, just like that which is required for any males, can understand the consequences of what being a POW for a female will more than likely mean, then I say give it all you got. Just be sure not to leave anything on the field and give it your best 100% of the time. If for some reason you still don't make the cut, move on to a different path. You may get another chance in the future for another occupational change. And, don't forget to have fun every now and then!!
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Pull your own weight and the rest of the women to do the same. I say this because a long time ago the first female soldiers caused all the male solders to pull more duty. If that happens again, the experiment will be over in a few years.
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