Posted on Dec 12, 2018
When you forfeit pay due to UCMJ, do they take BAH or just base pay?
4.31K
28
11
3
3
0
Posted in these groups: 
UCMJ
UCMJ
Posted 6 y ago
Responses: 6
3
3
0
SSG (Join to see) as a follow-up response your question begs the question how do you not know that as a sergeant?
And that’s not really criticism to you perhaps your mentors and leaders but to you it’s more of an observation. Clearly you can’t know what you don’t know. But your company leadership , NCO support channel etc. absolutely knows that is a basic piece information every Sergeant should know, if not Word for Word at least be able to understand it to reference it as needed
In any case if the question is about to happen to you , you will have an opportunity soon to Become More informed on the article 15 process.
If you’re asking on behalf of one your soldiers , perhaps you should go see Legal assistance and ask to watch the article 15 briefing they give everybody prior to standing in front of the commander.
And that’s not really criticism to you perhaps your mentors and leaders but to you it’s more of an observation. Clearly you can’t know what you don’t know. But your company leadership , NCO support channel etc. absolutely knows that is a basic piece information every Sergeant should know, if not Word for Word at least be able to understand it to reference it as needed
In any case if the question is about to happen to you , you will have an opportunity soon to Become More informed on the article 15 process.
If you’re asking on behalf of one your soldiers , perhaps you should go see Legal assistance and ask to watch the article 15 briefing they give everybody prior to standing in front of the commander.
(2)
(0)
CPT Lawrence Cable
SSG (Join to see) - Here is an information paper I ran across that covers most of the bases from a soldiers point of view, including your original question. https://armycourtmartialdefense.com/Article_15_UCMJ.pdf
MÄÓûpòðãGøÝ|þWΧ' ÌBk_'Âj*~aÙ,.{ïáXÖïçÿkÀ4uRN|y~6_þ4òWÂ"Ý.Z{yâûD"ÉS/Ín1oz,òsÚîAݶ¿ÔG]ÀËbzOðk%ÊjS7ðm_î}·]tð%ü9 üI}làÉd-êý·ÝÖØ[|?ärÑv«ªº10b/Î]ïGÛÂÄnÛßë AÊÅnèwOáûRßKÔ(ï}?áÿþÍá3Ýð{ôß}øTÏâþmýÇYÃYAOâYüDóÙ=z=qì'¡ï7ñçü;ÍÏ!è{füqûÆôs_îÁXØ1zïÔcÌMÐÙ=þæjù,ðÕülv2Ïr6?CôQrZÂ#E3IJgY48(úZÏqâeÖë=NûÄÚOÆ}º[§ âÙr47"ÈÍÆÁ|Ëd ÿú|pâg88ÄSrCqr"èÌ-ηavT&í¶'f6 bÝK"(D[n[e3'eÁ¿4S(Ðæë_·%ÀÖ,úþZîvBÛÍð|¡7ð!ö~5·«WH*èp\;{ïy'j\NÙ «þzWNdMW@oRrÖ«oµâ8({èÎ^óàcÅä9Sîì]mVßîÓÇ`Xð:uñÇà¶+ÑuÕ...
(2)
(0)
SGM Erik Marquez
SSG (Join to see)
The paper you were just linked to good idea as well more info is better by suggestion to go see your local legal assistance office has the advantage of being the same one your soldiers will go visit.
Should be about a 15 minute briefing likely you’ll watch a video tape be handed in information paper and if you were actually facing UCMJ they would ask if you had any questions.
What they will tell us soldier during the article 15 briefing and they may remind you about is legal assistance does not make suggestions or give advice on what the soldier should do.
They cannot answer a soldiers question of “should I take the article 15 or go to court marshal?”
Nor will they advise on the strength of the case against you in a article 15 procedure
I don’t also caution you about advising soldiers based on past experience is yours or others in reference to things like “they’ll never take that the court-martial quote
That may have been true for some other chain of command but it might not be true for the current one
“Ask for an open hearing they always drop it down one grade”
Sure your butt is unit commander did that but will the company commander in your unit?
My experience is the commanders I had an article 15 wasn’t run past legal unless we had enough to go to court Marshall
Some units some commanders some soldiers have it in there mine always ask for a court Marshall they’ll never go through the trouble
Jag won’t let them and they will have to drop it
They can’t prove it to that standard
I suppose if those tactics didn’t work they wouldn’t become Barracks fables
But the reality and history for the unit I was in. If you wanted to roll the dice and ask for a court-martial congratulations you won it’s all yours good luck
The paper you were just linked to good idea as well more info is better by suggestion to go see your local legal assistance office has the advantage of being the same one your soldiers will go visit.
Should be about a 15 minute briefing likely you’ll watch a video tape be handed in information paper and if you were actually facing UCMJ they would ask if you had any questions.
What they will tell us soldier during the article 15 briefing and they may remind you about is legal assistance does not make suggestions or give advice on what the soldier should do.
They cannot answer a soldiers question of “should I take the article 15 or go to court marshal?”
Nor will they advise on the strength of the case against you in a article 15 procedure
I don’t also caution you about advising soldiers based on past experience is yours or others in reference to things like “they’ll never take that the court-martial quote
That may have been true for some other chain of command but it might not be true for the current one
“Ask for an open hearing they always drop it down one grade”
Sure your butt is unit commander did that but will the company commander in your unit?
My experience is the commanders I had an article 15 wasn’t run past legal unless we had enough to go to court Marshall
Some units some commanders some soldiers have it in there mine always ask for a court Marshall they’ll never go through the trouble
Jag won’t let them and they will have to drop it
They can’t prove it to that standard
I suppose if those tactics didn’t work they wouldn’t become Barracks fables
But the reality and history for the unit I was in. If you wanted to roll the dice and ask for a court-martial congratulations you won it’s all yours good luck
(2)
(0)
CPT Lawrence Cable
SGM Erik Marquez - I agree. One of the best things you could do for your soldier in this situation is to get them to talk to Trial Services or whatever the equivalent at the local JAG. If that command is using the procedure correctly, it is to punish a soldier that still has potential to be a good soldier since in the Army an Article 15 is not automatically a career ending event. For E4 and below, it's not even much of a bump in the road. I never went into an Article 15 proceeding without enough evidence to prosecute in a Court Martial and only had one that indicated he wanted a court martial, but recanted that after I had him talk to JAG again. I feel that it was a test to see if I was willing to go to the Wall with it. He was one of my failures from back in the days that I believed a good commander could salvage bad soldiers. Hindsight being 20/20, I think I would not have given him the option of an Article 15 and just got rid of a trouble maker earlier.
That's a hard command lesson to learn. No matter how much you channel Audie Murphy, John Wayne or Dick Winters, you just can't salvage every soldier you command and it's a hard lesson to learn the difference between when you should try to save them or just get them out of the unit by the fastest method.
That's a hard command lesson to learn. No matter how much you channel Audie Murphy, John Wayne or Dick Winters, you just can't salvage every soldier you command and it's a hard lesson to learn the difference between when you should try to save them or just get them out of the unit by the fastest method.
(1)
(0)
Read This Next
Continue with Facebook 
Continue with Google