Posted on Nov 6, 2014
Why are enlisted members not afforded the same opportunties as officers?
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Currently there are several intern programs being offered only to officers, why is that? Does someone feel that enlisted members are unworthy? Incapable? Un-equal? This seems like a very discriminatory practice from an organization that prides itself on not discriminating.
So why are Officers the only ones offered these opportunities for personal and professional growth? It seems as though the enlisted soldier is caused to fend for themselves while the officers are groomed.
There are several enlisted members that I know who would love an opportunity like these officers are being offered, myself included. So where are we going wrong when taking care of our enlisted members.?
MG(R) James Wright MBA Program (TRADOC Internship): A TRADOC-funded competitive officer broadening opportunity. It includes an accelerated 15 month degree producing program open to active component Captains and Majors in the Operations, and Logistics branches.
JCS/OSD/ARSTAF Internship:Interns attend Georgetown University and earn a Master of Policy Management degree.
Congressional Fellowship:43-month program which includes pursuit of Master’s degree in Legislative Affairs at George Washington University.
General Downing Scholarship Program: Two-year program to study terrorism and counterterrorism at a top tier graduate school in the U.S. or abroad.
So why are Officers the only ones offered these opportunities for personal and professional growth? It seems as though the enlisted soldier is caused to fend for themselves while the officers are groomed.
There are several enlisted members that I know who would love an opportunity like these officers are being offered, myself included. So where are we going wrong when taking care of our enlisted members.?
MG(R) James Wright MBA Program (TRADOC Internship): A TRADOC-funded competitive officer broadening opportunity. It includes an accelerated 15 month degree producing program open to active component Captains and Majors in the Operations, and Logistics branches.
JCS/OSD/ARSTAF Internship:Interns attend Georgetown University and earn a Master of Policy Management degree.
Congressional Fellowship:43-month program which includes pursuit of Master’s degree in Legislative Affairs at George Washington University.
General Downing Scholarship Program: Two-year program to study terrorism and counterterrorism at a top tier graduate school in the U.S. or abroad.
Discrimination
Equality
Edited 10 y ago
Posted 10 y ago
Responses: 11
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Send me, I just went indefinite, and I have a BS and a MS. I am worthy of a challenge. Sergeant First Class Grudzinski and SSG Beultler both make very good points. I have thought the same things said by the OP in the past. I have also sometimes felt like a second class citizen in the ranks of enlisted, but I hope I have changed that through my hard work in college because Officers aren't the only Soldiers will college degrees.
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There are good and valid points being made on both sides of the argument. Should these same programs be open to all enlisted Soldiers? Perhaps not. Should they be open to qualified enlisted Soldiers (by grade, TIS, previous education)? I think so. Gone are the days where the biggest thing separating Commissioned Officers from enlisted Soldiers was a college education. I came in with a BA and completed my Masters while on AD. I have several friends with Masters and even more with Bachelor degrees. I think the point being made, is all Commissioned Officers are eligible for these programs (though still would have to apply and be accepted) based only on the fact they wear bars or oak leaves; while equally and even greater-educated enlisted are disqualified simply because they wear chevrons and rockers.
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SFC (Join to see)
My point exactly. Just because we chose to wear the stripes of the Sergeant doesn't mean that we are any less worthy of professional growth. There are many very intelligent enlisted members out there that deserve just as much opportunity as any officer. I had a friend who was completing her PhD while serving.
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SSG Lisa Rendina
I agree that enlisted with degrees are still in the minority. However, the point was simply enlisted are disqualified only because they are enlisted. Also, it used to be that only Commissioned Officers held degrees, but we know that is no longer the case (no matter how small the percentage may be), I never said the education gap had closed. Perhaps, this would even make the argument for opening these educational opportunities to enlisted even easier seeing as how only 6% would even meet a minimum qualification of a Bachelor degree.
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I'm not meaning to be offensive, but we're looking at very different career prospects. Enlisted have a huge loss around the first term of reenlistment and the majority never make it far beyond the first DA selection board hurdle due to personal initiative, conduct, and educational background.
You can compare the O-3 CPT to the SSG/SFC for spending a huge portion of their career in that paygrade. The CPT has a BA/BS and may already have a graduate degree. Most Are committed to a career when they get picked up for MAJ while a number of SSG retire SFC and some SFC retire the moment they hit three years as a MSG.
We don't hit strategic leadership until we make SGM and even then you can argue that the additional ASIs for various levels of senior enlisted advisor experience really creates that strategic enlisted advisor around the SSD-5 level.
In all sincerity, spending a huge amount of resources giving us Enlisted folks special internships is pearls before swine in the large scheme of things. We do not possess the background, current expertise, or future longevity to implement what we could learn at those internships compared to an Officer with another decade in service.
The lack of mentorship is distinctively our own fault though. Every SFC who is competing for MSG and complaining about an empty IPERMS and a messed up ERB is proof of that.
You can compare the O-3 CPT to the SSG/SFC for spending a huge portion of their career in that paygrade. The CPT has a BA/BS and may already have a graduate degree. Most Are committed to a career when they get picked up for MAJ while a number of SSG retire SFC and some SFC retire the moment they hit three years as a MSG.
We don't hit strategic leadership until we make SGM and even then you can argue that the additional ASIs for various levels of senior enlisted advisor experience really creates that strategic enlisted advisor around the SSD-5 level.
In all sincerity, spending a huge amount of resources giving us Enlisted folks special internships is pearls before swine in the large scheme of things. We do not possess the background, current expertise, or future longevity to implement what we could learn at those internships compared to an Officer with another decade in service.
The lack of mentorship is distinctively our own fault though. Every SFC who is competing for MSG and complaining about an empty IPERMS and a messed up ERB is proof of that.
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SFC (Join to see)
I don't get offended SSG Carl Beutler and I'm sure the pearls before swine comment was completely anecdotal but I must disagree because that comment makes enlisted members seem like second class.
I did possess the background, expertise and longevity to use whatever skills I may have acquired during one of those intern programs. However now at my current time I am nearing the end of my time in boots. When I reflect back and ask what did the Army do to make me the professional that they expected me to be I can't recall anything.
The NCOES system is completely broken because each level teaches skills needed to do the job most students are already doing.
My point is this. The enlisted side of the house does very little to prepare people for senior leader positions, staff positions or for transitional opportunity. If you want a degree you have to make the time to get it unlike the officer side where they send you to get it. Many of these intern programs ultimately assist them in gaining advanced degrees.
My initial point still stands, officers and enlisted should be offered the same opportunities regardless.
I did possess the background, expertise and longevity to use whatever skills I may have acquired during one of those intern programs. However now at my current time I am nearing the end of my time in boots. When I reflect back and ask what did the Army do to make me the professional that they expected me to be I can't recall anything.
The NCOES system is completely broken because each level teaches skills needed to do the job most students are already doing.
My point is this. The enlisted side of the house does very little to prepare people for senior leader positions, staff positions or for transitional opportunity. If you want a degree you have to make the time to get it unlike the officer side where they send you to get it. Many of these intern programs ultimately assist them in gaining advanced degrees.
My initial point still stands, officers and enlisted should be offered the same opportunities regardless.
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1LT (Join to see)
I teach at the ALC level for NCOES and I find that only my SSG students with two years or more TIG are actually doing the job we train at that level. I think it's the sad fate of the Enlisted under the current system to leave the Army just when we become really useful.
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