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When I joined the Army in August of 1990, I did so for a few reasons:
1. I've always been VERY politically aware about what was happening in the world. I've always striven to learn the facts and not be a knee jerk reactionary.
2. It SERIOUSLY pissed me off to see that Saddam Hussein thought he could just cross a border and take whatever the f*ck he wanted.
3. If I'm honest with you, I was 22 years old and in need of direction in my life. Discipline I had, direction I was lacking.
For those three primary reasons, (of course, there are many more), I spent exactly 7 days in the DEP and shipped out to basic almost as fast as I had signed up.
I was a willing warrior! I was eager to fight for and defend our American way of life. It took me just under 3 years to figure out that my own Government didn't hold the same viewpoint.
The final straw came about 3 years into my enlistment, when the guys and I, (including my E-7 - a helluva guy!) were playing poker in the barracks one night and we started talking about the only thing everyone on post was talking about...the impending visit of Pat Schroeder (D - Colorado) who was a member of the House Armed Services Committee. She was on a tour of all the 3rd ID and was going to make recommendations to President (cough) Clinton about base closures in Germany.
To make a long story short, months later, we, the soldiers of Ferris Barracks, Germany, couldn't even fiscally afford to go on live fire exercise at Grafenwoehr because we couldn't afford the ammunition for our rifles, much less the rounds for the BFV's and the M1A1's. Previously, we had completed this training, without fail, twice a year for about 6 weeks at a time.
To me, that was the writing on the wall. If my own government wasn't going to give us the ammunition needed to train effectively, then I saw no reason to dedicate the next 25 years of my life to that way of thinking...and I got the hell out.
If you didn't serve until retirement, for what reason did you decide to ETS?
PS. Up until the time I actually applied for early release, my E-7 (poker buddy) was CONVINCED that I was going to re-up, because I was a good soldier. For the record, I was a DAMN good soldier; I entered service as an E-1 and in under 3 years made E-4. But my E-7 failed to understand the depth of my conviction on this matter - either give me the tools and training to fight, or f*ck off. I'm no ones political football.
1. I've always been VERY politically aware about what was happening in the world. I've always striven to learn the facts and not be a knee jerk reactionary.
2. It SERIOUSLY pissed me off to see that Saddam Hussein thought he could just cross a border and take whatever the f*ck he wanted.
3. If I'm honest with you, I was 22 years old and in need of direction in my life. Discipline I had, direction I was lacking.
For those three primary reasons, (of course, there are many more), I spent exactly 7 days in the DEP and shipped out to basic almost as fast as I had signed up.
I was a willing warrior! I was eager to fight for and defend our American way of life. It took me just under 3 years to figure out that my own Government didn't hold the same viewpoint.
The final straw came about 3 years into my enlistment, when the guys and I, (including my E-7 - a helluva guy!) were playing poker in the barracks one night and we started talking about the only thing everyone on post was talking about...the impending visit of Pat Schroeder (D - Colorado) who was a member of the House Armed Services Committee. She was on a tour of all the 3rd ID and was going to make recommendations to President (cough) Clinton about base closures in Germany.
To make a long story short, months later, we, the soldiers of Ferris Barracks, Germany, couldn't even fiscally afford to go on live fire exercise at Grafenwoehr because we couldn't afford the ammunition for our rifles, much less the rounds for the BFV's and the M1A1's. Previously, we had completed this training, without fail, twice a year for about 6 weeks at a time.
To me, that was the writing on the wall. If my own government wasn't going to give us the ammunition needed to train effectively, then I saw no reason to dedicate the next 25 years of my life to that way of thinking...and I got the hell out.
If you didn't serve until retirement, for what reason did you decide to ETS?
PS. Up until the time I actually applied for early release, my E-7 (poker buddy) was CONVINCED that I was going to re-up, because I was a good soldier. For the record, I was a DAMN good soldier; I entered service as an E-1 and in under 3 years made E-4. But my E-7 failed to understand the depth of my conviction on this matter - either give me the tools and training to fight, or f*ck off. I'm no ones political football.
Re-enlistment
Transition
ETS/EAS
Training
Politics
Edited 11 y ago
Posted 11 y ago
Responses: 173
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I wasn't given much of a choice it was secret service or 16 months solar power school which sounded good but it would require me to get commissioned and all together was a 10 obligation at age 21 I wasn't ready to give anyone that much of a commitment, but I would of loved the solar power school, seems there is always a catch, and I am always proud of the fact my promotions was from hard work and the dedication I gave to learning more than the pretty boy's for Patriots electrical power, and not kissing ass like my pretty boy dumbass NCOIC wanted me to do, thank god I had civilian higher ups that recognized that and pushed him to advance me and he hated it, but that was Ok they sent his ass packing to Germany, he was an E-6 and wanted to be called sir, long story sort he was a fucken idiot LOL
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Where do I begin? Was it the officer who denied my eligibility take the advancement test because I had the wrong dates and didn't sign the paperwork? Was it the fact that I stopped learning? Was it the difficulty of branching out into another career field? Or was I unable to play the political game?
I fit the stereotypical profile of a career Navy enlisted sailor. I am an immigrant of Filipino descent, born and raised there. By all accounts, I should be a retiree, anywhere from from an E-6 to E9. I decided to separate after 8 years of service.
I wanted to work on computers but my options were limited given that I was not a US Citizen upon my enlistment. So I became a striker, 2 years of general duty, then went to Aviation Storekeeper "A" School where I was the honor graduate of my class. I returned to my old command as an E-4.
One fond memory I have of the military is my maintenance chief taking me aside and telling me to never say "I don't know." This was in response to a some task that I had heretofore not performed or trained on. He told me, you're a petty officer now, you never say things like that.
I made E-5 in just under four years, then transferred to shore duty, and the politics began. I was never in the Filipino "in-crowd", it wasn't my thing. I had my own buddies, people whom to this day, I keep in touch with and are lifelong friends with. Needless to say, I was most likely not at the top of the division chief's ranking. I did my shore duty, did some college on the side, all the while wondering where I was headed.
The sign came when it was time to sign the advancement worksheets so I could take the test for E-6. I was working graveyards and somehow got the deadlines mixed up for when I had to get it done. No excuses, it was my mistake. I went to the admin office to see if I could somehow sign the papers and take the test anyway, I was met with "You want to be a 1st class and you didn't sign your paperwork? Sorry." In that moment, I decided to separate. I had about a year left on my enlistment. So I kept my nose clean and took the opportunity to practice resume writing and started interviewing for jobs even though I knew I could not accept any offers. I didn't get any offers during that year anyway.
Six months prior to separation, my division chief (also Filipino) calls me into his office, to ask me what my plans were. I told him I was separating. He looked at me inquisitively ... What are you going to do? You don't have a degree. It was difficult for me to tell him the obvious answer, I was going to go get a job.
So that was that, six months went by, I kept interviewing, improving my resume, and ultimately landed a job with a telecommunications firm as a database engineer ... which is a fancy name for a switch operator.
The factors contributing to my decision to separate were mostly subconscious except for the condescending attitude of an officer. First, I stopped learning, mostly because I had no mentor like at my original command. I had a warrant officer who stood up for me and kept me on the right path. Here I had to suck up and I've never been any good at that. Second, Logistics was not my area of interest, though it has served me well through my transition. I was programming computers since I was 10 years old, that's what I wanted to do, and there seemed to be no easy way to convert. Third, I had a flaw, and that was disdain for sucking up. I did not mind work, my father imbued upon me a love for work and getting things done. However, to have to show someone what I was doing and that I was doing it? That was just silly.
These days, I am a proud American, having earned my citizenship in this great nation. There are some things I miss about the service, some things I don't. I actually did some reserve time afterwards but had to go inactive when I started school. Working full time and studying was well more than enough to fill the day. The truth is, my humble successes as a civilian is in large part due to the lessons and experiences in the military.
I fit the stereotypical profile of a career Navy enlisted sailor. I am an immigrant of Filipino descent, born and raised there. By all accounts, I should be a retiree, anywhere from from an E-6 to E9. I decided to separate after 8 years of service.
I wanted to work on computers but my options were limited given that I was not a US Citizen upon my enlistment. So I became a striker, 2 years of general duty, then went to Aviation Storekeeper "A" School where I was the honor graduate of my class. I returned to my old command as an E-4.
One fond memory I have of the military is my maintenance chief taking me aside and telling me to never say "I don't know." This was in response to a some task that I had heretofore not performed or trained on. He told me, you're a petty officer now, you never say things like that.
I made E-5 in just under four years, then transferred to shore duty, and the politics began. I was never in the Filipino "in-crowd", it wasn't my thing. I had my own buddies, people whom to this day, I keep in touch with and are lifelong friends with. Needless to say, I was most likely not at the top of the division chief's ranking. I did my shore duty, did some college on the side, all the while wondering where I was headed.
The sign came when it was time to sign the advancement worksheets so I could take the test for E-6. I was working graveyards and somehow got the deadlines mixed up for when I had to get it done. No excuses, it was my mistake. I went to the admin office to see if I could somehow sign the papers and take the test anyway, I was met with "You want to be a 1st class and you didn't sign your paperwork? Sorry." In that moment, I decided to separate. I had about a year left on my enlistment. So I kept my nose clean and took the opportunity to practice resume writing and started interviewing for jobs even though I knew I could not accept any offers. I didn't get any offers during that year anyway.
Six months prior to separation, my division chief (also Filipino) calls me into his office, to ask me what my plans were. I told him I was separating. He looked at me inquisitively ... What are you going to do? You don't have a degree. It was difficult for me to tell him the obvious answer, I was going to go get a job.
So that was that, six months went by, I kept interviewing, improving my resume, and ultimately landed a job with a telecommunications firm as a database engineer ... which is a fancy name for a switch operator.
The factors contributing to my decision to separate were mostly subconscious except for the condescending attitude of an officer. First, I stopped learning, mostly because I had no mentor like at my original command. I had a warrant officer who stood up for me and kept me on the right path. Here I had to suck up and I've never been any good at that. Second, Logistics was not my area of interest, though it has served me well through my transition. I was programming computers since I was 10 years old, that's what I wanted to do, and there seemed to be no easy way to convert. Third, I had a flaw, and that was disdain for sucking up. I did not mind work, my father imbued upon me a love for work and getting things done. However, to have to show someone what I was doing and that I was doing it? That was just silly.
These days, I am a proud American, having earned my citizenship in this great nation. There are some things I miss about the service, some things I don't. I actually did some reserve time afterwards but had to go inactive when I started school. Working full time and studying was well more than enough to fill the day. The truth is, my humble successes as a civilian is in large part due to the lessons and experiences in the military.
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loved my career but loved my family more. after 4 years at sea finally made it to shore duty just to be told i was going back to sea after 1 year.
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I was Medically retired [against my will ] I had 10 years in the Navy in a closed rate and still made E-6 in 7 years and had just passed my E-7 test and had to have my 5th knee operation it didn't work and in 30 days I was history found out later I had been selected for Chief I was mad for a long time but I got over it especially when I found out that being under the old system I make more this way then if I had done 20 years but I had my sights on going warrant now I will never know
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I been a Warrior Princess on active duty for 4 years and then when Guard. I then realized that the Guard sucks and I would have to wait for a spot AND then compete with the rest of the 92A for a promotion in my state.
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SSG Charles Langlois
Yup, that's how it works in the Guard. There isn't boards and such like active duty for promotion. It does suck and that's also why you see E-6's with 20+ years of service with no chance of making it any higher. (depending on MOS of course) Slots vs bodies just doesn't add up. It gets frustrating and I've seen many a good soldier ETS out of the guard or go active just because the possibility of upward progression wasn't there.
Now, here's this for you. I don't know how active duty does it but guard, once you hit 20, look out. They have been effectively doing a RIF through 20 year boards. Anything and everything they can nail you on they will. That's when you truly realize yup, I really am just a number. But, who's looking at the ones that are on the 20 year boards?????
Now, here's this for you. I don't know how active duty does it but guard, once you hit 20, look out. They have been effectively doing a RIF through 20 year boards. Anything and everything they can nail you on they will. That's when you truly realize yup, I really am just a number. But, who's looking at the ones that are on the 20 year boards?????
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SPC Chelsea Fernandez
Right now to get promoted you have to get recommendation from the chain of command :(
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Got out in 04 after a year deployed to Iraq. the main reason I got out was because of the Double Standard and the do has I say but not has I do mentality that at the time was rampant in the military. I say this not to make anyone mad or angry but it is my honest opinion.
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SSG Charles Langlois
Hate to tell you but that's always the way it's been. Some prefer to view it as "rank has it's privileges" (which there is a certain amount of truth to that) but some really abuse it too.
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PFC Andrew Brewton
True but some senior and junior NCO'S are not mature enough to lead just because they can pass a PT test and game the system than they get promoted(NOT ALL NCO FALL IN TO THIS CATEGORY) the one that are not mature are abusive and likely to get some one killed or snap them self's. the best line I've ever heard from an E-6 "I don't know how to use that equipment, that is why I have privates under me to do my job for me" I understand that an NCO has to be well rounded but soldiers look to there NCO's to Help them not just with there PT test and Common Knowledge but for technical expertise b/c AIT doesn't teach a lot of Real world training but class room training
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I got out simply because the army didn't want me. The RECRUITERS wanted me, whoo-boy did they! But from day 1 in basic, they wanted me out. I didn't fit the physical format for a soldier, I was (gasp!) 12 pounds overweight. For FOUR years I fought with this. Lose the weight, gain some back, go on the fat-boy program, keep it off for a while... Ya get tha gist?
And the after Desert Storm, The Drawdown. My company commander had me weigh in and tape-test as often as possible after PT, looking for that one pound that would put me on the program again too soon and therefore make me eligible for chaptering out. After I was reassigned a different post, lost my work out partner and the motivation of an excellent Master Sergeant (Ghoulson, I'll never forget him), she got me. I was a pound or two over, and that's all she wrote. Nuthin left to do but type the paperwork up.
The army took me in, made me a soldier, and then kicked me out as quickly as they could. And then the VA doesn't understand why I've had trouble adjusting ever since. They say you have to have had seen combat or some other traumatic experience to get the label and diagnosis of PTSD... How about the trauma of being kicked the hell out and having your life turned upside down and having your family on the street over something as inconsequential as a couple of pounds? When I was just as fit as anyone else in the company, passed my pfts, ran circles around some of my fellow soldiers...
It's been 18 years of ups and downs in my life, but I still have trouble coping in the real world. I'm unemployed, haven't held a full time job since 2001. I've been in and out of mental health treatment, went to school under the VRAP program, and I'm still homeless and jobless.
And the after Desert Storm, The Drawdown. My company commander had me weigh in and tape-test as often as possible after PT, looking for that one pound that would put me on the program again too soon and therefore make me eligible for chaptering out. After I was reassigned a different post, lost my work out partner and the motivation of an excellent Master Sergeant (Ghoulson, I'll never forget him), she got me. I was a pound or two over, and that's all she wrote. Nuthin left to do but type the paperwork up.
The army took me in, made me a soldier, and then kicked me out as quickly as they could. And then the VA doesn't understand why I've had trouble adjusting ever since. They say you have to have had seen combat or some other traumatic experience to get the label and diagnosis of PTSD... How about the trauma of being kicked the hell out and having your life turned upside down and having your family on the street over something as inconsequential as a couple of pounds? When I was just as fit as anyone else in the company, passed my pfts, ran circles around some of my fellow soldiers...
It's been 18 years of ups and downs in my life, but I still have trouble coping in the real world. I'm unemployed, haven't held a full time job since 2001. I've been in and out of mental health treatment, went to school under the VRAP program, and I'm still homeless and jobless.
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SPC Thomas Webb
Phil,
I didn't rate anything during my separation, but in 2006 I was granted 30% service connected for my knees and one ankle. I sustained multiple injuries during my single enlistment (I guess I just wasn't built to last, my body fails me more and more each day, starting to lose my eyesight now!). I would probably rate a little higher, but as often as I've had to move around in the years since, I can never stay in one place long enough for all the paperwork to go through and to actually get a rating appointment. Since the initial rating, I've moved all over the country chasing jobs and opportunities that never panned out. Now I'm bouncing around simply to find a place to stay for a while here and there with friends or family. Now I'm fresh out of friends and down to the last family member willing to give me a little crash space.
I didn't rate anything during my separation, but in 2006 I was granted 30% service connected for my knees and one ankle. I sustained multiple injuries during my single enlistment (I guess I just wasn't built to last, my body fails me more and more each day, starting to lose my eyesight now!). I would probably rate a little higher, but as often as I've had to move around in the years since, I can never stay in one place long enough for all the paperwork to go through and to actually get a rating appointment. Since the initial rating, I've moved all over the country chasing jobs and opportunities that never panned out. Now I'm bouncing around simply to find a place to stay for a while here and there with friends or family. Now I'm fresh out of friends and down to the last family member willing to give me a little crash space.
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I left the military when I went to Pope AFB, North Carolina. The attitude of the military of the Army and Air Force personnel was, generally speaking, pathetic. People had a "I don't care" attitude. My commander never went into the flightline. Some officers did not care about Quality Assurance minor failures. The mission was so important that it seems no one care about the uniform and about AFIs. The period of 2 years I spent there it was the worse period in my military career. I did not even want a retirement ceremony.
I also believe that God sent me there so I will be forced to get out because He had better plans for me. And He did!
I also believe that God sent me there so I will be forced to get out because He had better plans for me. And He did!
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Hmmm... (1) I had no desire to be separated from my family anymore and staying in the Army would have required just that; (2) the prospect of maybe making CW5 just did not interest me enough to stay; and (3) although I enjoyed being a warrant officer, there were things I wanted to accomplish that were just not possible in the warrant officer rank structure.
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I was an E5 and 21 years old when my enlistment obligation was over. I’d been made several promises regarding enlistment bonus, additional schooling, duty stations, etc., to entice me into re-enlisting. However, as much as I liked the military and the people I worked with, I simply could not see myself as a “lifer”, getting married, and knowing it would be a fight to keep my marriage going throughout numerous deployments. Politically, I was a “babe-in-the-woods” when it came to policy, and had only begun to understand that a nations defense forces were at the mercy of the integrity, or lack thereof, it’s leaders. Up until then I believed “the USA right or wrong”, but my world was turned upside down when my friends began to die in Vietnam. It became increasingly more apparent politicians rather then by our very capable Generals and Admirals and those on the ground who understood the advocacy were directing this non-declared war.
After I separated from the military I went back to school and was working as an Engineering Aid for a large construction company when I was approach by the Navy to join the reserves. By then I actually missed military life and agreed to re-enlist if I got the right school and drew flight-skins in a VP squadron.
I enjoyed the duties of an FCO and the company of my shipmates and flight crew, but I was dismay at what was happening under the new CNO regarding changes made to females in combat and aboard ship. It seemed like a stupid decision to have females aboard a ship where 97% or more were males aged 20-something with raging hormones. To me it was a tinderbox waiting on an ignition source. That’s when it was abundantly clear our leadership was cow towing to politics.
I love my country but was dismayed at liberal politics that had increasingly been shaping foreign policy. Getting involved in wars where it was apparent we had no intention to win was commonplace, and I wanted to know why. Now after 50 years as a student of both Bible and secular history I’ve got some of those questions answered.
I have since attended the first ever reunion of my Navy ATRON now designated a VFA flying Super Hornets. I’ve been on two dependents day cruises as a civilian aboard the new generation of super carriers (nuke boats), and toured the very latest CVN in the fleet. We’ve got the best-equipped military in the world (Army, Navy, Air Force, Marines, Coast Guard). But the concern regarding political influences putting military personnel in harms way under questionable and unnecessarily reasons haunts me. My nephew, a highly decorated retired Senior Chief (E8 - three tours w/1st Marine’s Divison in Iraq), shares my concerns.
Additionally, I’ve been involved and support Wounded Warriors in a variety of way, including donating my time and finances to helping both men and woman who suffering the physical and emotional wounds of combat adjust to civilian life.
All to say, I can voice my opinion as a civilian much more effectively than if I’d remained in service. Therefore, I did the right thing by not “re-enlisting”.
After I separated from the military I went back to school and was working as an Engineering Aid for a large construction company when I was approach by the Navy to join the reserves. By then I actually missed military life and agreed to re-enlist if I got the right school and drew flight-skins in a VP squadron.
I enjoyed the duties of an FCO and the company of my shipmates and flight crew, but I was dismay at what was happening under the new CNO regarding changes made to females in combat and aboard ship. It seemed like a stupid decision to have females aboard a ship where 97% or more were males aged 20-something with raging hormones. To me it was a tinderbox waiting on an ignition source. That’s when it was abundantly clear our leadership was cow towing to politics.
I love my country but was dismayed at liberal politics that had increasingly been shaping foreign policy. Getting involved in wars where it was apparent we had no intention to win was commonplace, and I wanted to know why. Now after 50 years as a student of both Bible and secular history I’ve got some of those questions answered.
I have since attended the first ever reunion of my Navy ATRON now designated a VFA flying Super Hornets. I’ve been on two dependents day cruises as a civilian aboard the new generation of super carriers (nuke boats), and toured the very latest CVN in the fleet. We’ve got the best-equipped military in the world (Army, Navy, Air Force, Marines, Coast Guard). But the concern regarding political influences putting military personnel in harms way under questionable and unnecessarily reasons haunts me. My nephew, a highly decorated retired Senior Chief (E8 - three tours w/1st Marine’s Divison in Iraq), shares my concerns.
Additionally, I’ve been involved and support Wounded Warriors in a variety of way, including donating my time and finances to helping both men and woman who suffering the physical and emotional wounds of combat adjust to civilian life.
All to say, I can voice my opinion as a civilian much more effectively than if I’d remained in service. Therefore, I did the right thing by not “re-enlisting”.
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