Posted on Aug 4, 2015
Women In Field Artillery, In The United States Army. Is This The Way Forward?
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In my opinion the Army is heading in the right direction (equality for all).
In a recent Armytimes Artice:
The Army plans to open to women all but one field artillery MOS, the service's top officer said Monday.
With the exception of the 13F military occupational specialty, "we have decided … we are not going to ask for a waiver to keep it closed," said Army Chief of Staff Gen. Ray Odierno.
This decision, which opens up MOSs such as cannon crewmember (13B) and field artillery automated tactical data system specialist (13D), comes just weeks after the Army opened the combat engineer (12B) MOS to women.
It also follows a decision from more than a year ago to open all field artillery officer positions to women.
A decision about the 13F, or fire support specialist, MOS will be made when the Army makes a decision about whether to open the infantry and armor specialties to women, Odierno said.
"We're going to do that with infantry and armor because they're embedded with infantry and armor units," Odierno said.
These changes are the latest in an ongoing campaign to eliminate the Direct Ground Combat Assignment Rule by dismantling, in phases, policies that have barred women from serving in combat units below the brigade level.
The campaign began in 2012 when the Army opened 13,000 positions previously closed to women; the goal is to open most positions to women by the end of 2015.
Since 2012, the Army has conducted extensive tests as it tried to determine which MOSs should be opened to women and how it should be done.
"We've done a lot of pilot programs, we've done a lot of physical testing, we've done a lot of testing on how we integrate women into units, and those are all going well," Odierno said. "We want the best person, if they're qualified and meet the standards, we want to give them the opportunity to do whatever they want."
For the field artillery MOSs, using data from the physical studies, "we felt women, as part of an artillery crew, could do all the things necessary to do that [job], so we've opened that up," Odierno said.
Army senior leaders have not made a decision about whether they will ask for a waiver to keep infantry and armor closed to women, he said.
"We're headed in the right direction, but we still have some work to do," said Odierno, who is wrapping up his tenure as chief of staff later this month. "That was a decision I wanted to make, but, frankly, we didn't have the data in time for me to make that decision."
The decision about those remaining MOSs will fall to Odierno's successor, Gen. Mark Milley, who is pending Senate confirmation.
http://www.armytimes.com/story/military/careers/army/2015/08/03/odierno-army-open-most-field-artillery-jobs-women/31083303/
In a recent Armytimes Artice:
The Army plans to open to women all but one field artillery MOS, the service's top officer said Monday.
With the exception of the 13F military occupational specialty, "we have decided … we are not going to ask for a waiver to keep it closed," said Army Chief of Staff Gen. Ray Odierno.
This decision, which opens up MOSs such as cannon crewmember (13B) and field artillery automated tactical data system specialist (13D), comes just weeks after the Army opened the combat engineer (12B) MOS to women.
It also follows a decision from more than a year ago to open all field artillery officer positions to women.
A decision about the 13F, or fire support specialist, MOS will be made when the Army makes a decision about whether to open the infantry and armor specialties to women, Odierno said.
"We're going to do that with infantry and armor because they're embedded with infantry and armor units," Odierno said.
These changes are the latest in an ongoing campaign to eliminate the Direct Ground Combat Assignment Rule by dismantling, in phases, policies that have barred women from serving in combat units below the brigade level.
The campaign began in 2012 when the Army opened 13,000 positions previously closed to women; the goal is to open most positions to women by the end of 2015.
Since 2012, the Army has conducted extensive tests as it tried to determine which MOSs should be opened to women and how it should be done.
"We've done a lot of pilot programs, we've done a lot of physical testing, we've done a lot of testing on how we integrate women into units, and those are all going well," Odierno said. "We want the best person, if they're qualified and meet the standards, we want to give them the opportunity to do whatever they want."
For the field artillery MOSs, using data from the physical studies, "we felt women, as part of an artillery crew, could do all the things necessary to do that [job], so we've opened that up," Odierno said.
Army senior leaders have not made a decision about whether they will ask for a waiver to keep infantry and armor closed to women, he said.
"We're headed in the right direction, but we still have some work to do," said Odierno, who is wrapping up his tenure as chief of staff later this month. "That was a decision I wanted to make, but, frankly, we didn't have the data in time for me to make that decision."
The decision about those remaining MOSs will fall to Odierno's successor, Gen. Mark Milley, who is pending Senate confirmation.
http://www.armytimes.com/story/military/careers/army/2015/08/03/odierno-army-open-most-field-artillery-jobs-women/31083303/
Edited >1 y ago
Posted >1 y ago
Responses: 32
I say do it! I have had the opportunity to serve with some amazing, outstanding and competent female Soldiers. Some that actually smoked the heck out of me. Giving the fact that less than 1% of the American population serve in the military, it doesn't make sense to restrict any MOS. I do however think that the standard should not be lowered.
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I don't see why not, women have been serving in all capacities in Air Defense Artillery and there isn't much of a difference in my opinion.
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SFC (Join to see)
While they are doing great, there’s a dramatic difference Chief. Nowhere near the same.
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Rounds fired by a woman will do their job regardless. More power to the army.
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I'm not so sure why so many are jumping on this bandwagon of supporting women in the Field Artillery, especially in 13F roles, when most are not even FA, much less 13F (I've seen one 13F and one FA Officer). My question is, why? Is there a shortage of Artillerymen? Is there an impending war that is about to occur in which the Army is going to suffer from a severe attrition due to combat so there's a need to back fill bodies for fill the different roles in the FA? Or, which is my guess, is this another area in which the powers that be wants to use the military as some sort of political platform/social experiment like we have seen in so many other areas?
For those that have served for a long time, have you forgotten what it was like when you went to the field? There were no bunks, or tents to sleep in. Everything you needed to sustain yourself and to operate for an extended period of time was carried on your back. I know current theaters of operations has everyone living on FOBs, but that way of operating/fighting may not be how we...you (I'm retired now)... conduct business in the next war.
Go ahead you who are in power, and let women in these front line combat roles, but don't come crying when it all blows up in your faces! In my opinion, stop using the military as a social/political platform and use it for what it was meant to do; be able to maintain a show of strength and deter war, and if the need arises, to be able to go and kick ass!
For those that have served for a long time, have you forgotten what it was like when you went to the field? There were no bunks, or tents to sleep in. Everything you needed to sustain yourself and to operate for an extended period of time was carried on your back. I know current theaters of operations has everyone living on FOBs, but that way of operating/fighting may not be how we...you (I'm retired now)... conduct business in the next war.
Go ahead you who are in power, and let women in these front line combat roles, but don't come crying when it all blows up in your faces! In my opinion, stop using the military as a social/political platform and use it for what it was meant to do; be able to maintain a show of strength and deter war, and if the need arises, to be able to go and kick ass!
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SSG (Join to see)
I agree SFC, I just dont see the gain from making this change other than "political correctness". Section Chiefs and FLL get all the added stress and consideration with no benefit.
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MSG Dan Castaneda
I totally agree with you as well. It seems that those that make those decisions or support these decisions are not the ones doing it. Or even further have lost touch with reality and now consumed by political correctness. Either way, General Odierno should have gone to Ranger school before allowing it to happen. It always humor me how a bus driver, a mechanic or supply guy could support women in Special Forces. SMH.
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LTC Ray Buenteo
My son was a 13D and he lived in the field. He said setting up and tearing down was more than half the job and it was physical. He said artillery is not an “in the rear with the gear job” you have physically demanding tasks and everyone must carry their own weight. One person not carrying their part puts extreme demands on other members of the team both physically and mentally . After set up then you have to get into the mental/skill part of the game while maintaining your equipment and still accomplishing additional basic soldier tasks. His time at Hood and then with 25ID in Hawaii was mostly in the field. He did a tour in Iraq but did not speak of it at all.
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I don't think there would be a problem with women in Field Artillery. If they can do the calculations and adjustments necessary to support a call for fire and the other functions of their position, then more power to them!
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LTC Gavin Heater
Blink: I thought you were more refined than this to take a flank shot at the King of Battle. I may have to rally my fellow (gender universal) Redlegs to challenge your opinion. Gavin
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LTC Bink Romanick
LTC Gavin Heater I qualified it...it's sounded like a shot...I said that women have been operating Target Acquisition Radar for years..am I incorrect?
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LTC Gavin Heater
You are correct, my esteemed colleague. MLRS accepted (or planned to except) women years ago. GEN Odierno is an outstanding RedLeg who will be missed when he is retired.
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MSG Dan Castaneda
LTC Gavin Heater - Yes we'll miss him as about as much as we miss General Shisenski. Mr. lets give black berets to everyone.
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Sarge you always on POINT, leading the charge on relevant issues in today's military BROTHER!
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SFC Joe S. Davis Jr., MSM, DSL
SGT Brian Nile thanks your always say the right words to motivate me BROTHER!
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